ucjames wrote:

DutchMuse wrote:But I did not "announce" bloggers to the restaurant. I emailed the sommelier to ask if we could bring wines and told her who I would be dining with. One purpose was to let her know we would be bringing appropriate wines rather than wines not suited to the occasion.

If I had wanted to "announce" our visit to the restaurant (your characterization) I would have emailed the GM and my contacts at LEYE.

It boggles my mind that you don't see it as such, but the email you actually pasted for us before very much announced your companions, Dutch. It may not have been your intention to do so, though that is frankly hard to believe, but that is effectively what you did.

To the sommelier. The sommelier! Do you know how much power the sommelier usually has? You seem to think emailing the sommelier will accomplish something more than wine service.

I'm sorry but if my goal were to announce our visit it wouldn't be via the sommelier. It would be to the GM or LEYE. The sommelier doesn't control much beyond the wine list and wine service.

DutchMuse wrote:

ucjames wrote:

DutchMuse wrote:But I did not "announce" bloggers to the restaurant. I emailed the sommelier to ask if we could bring wines and told her who I would be dining with. One purpose was to let her know we would be bringing appropriate wines rather than wines not suited to the occasion.

If I had wanted to "announce" our visit to the restaurant (your characterization) I would have emailed the GM and my contacts at LEYE.

It boggles my mind that you don't see it as such, but the email you actually pasted for us before very much announced your companions, Dutch. It may not have been your intention to do so, though that is frankly hard to believe, but that is effectively what you did.

To the sommelier. The sommelier! Do you know how much power the sommelier usually has? You seem to think emailing the sommelier will accomplish something more than wine service.

I'm sorry but if my goal were to announce our visit it wouldn't be via the sommelier. It would be to the GM or LEYE. The sommelier doesn't control much beyond the wine list and wine service.

Really? You seriously don't think that the sommelier communicates with the GM?

Steve Plotnicki wrote:

ucjames wrote:What I was saying is that in my experience working with the best restaurants, a large percentage of their customers on any given night believe they are VIP customers.

VIP customers who gain their status from their celebrity or stature in the community are not the same as VIP customers whose status derives from being a passionate hobbyist who is well known in the fine dining community.

*snort*

jpschust wrote:

DutchMuse wrote:

ucjames wrote:It boggles my mind that you don't see it as such, but the email you actually pasted for us before very much announced your companions, Dutch. It may not have been your intention to do so, though that is frankly hard to believe, but that is effectively what you did.

To the sommelier. The sommelier! Do you know how much power the sommelier usually has? You seem to think emailing the sommelier will accomplish something more than wine service.

I'm sorry but if my goal were to announce our visit it wouldn't be via the sommelier. It would be to the GM or LEYE. The sommelier doesn't control much beyond the wine list and wine service.

Really? You seriously don't think that the sommelier communicates with the GM?

On another forum I frequent, one changes the color of other posts that they feel are particularly insightful, worthy of note, or just plain should not be missed, to lime.

Whether I think of myself that way or not is irrelevant to the question I asked.

The question you asked, though, had nothing to do with the post you were responding to, in which UCJames addressed the question of whether DutchMuse's email announced your party's presence as VIP's.

He denies that was his intention when volunteering the party's credentials. You continue to attempt to rationalize volunteering such information as "something any restaurant would want to know".

Bottom line; restaurants want to know about real VIP's. When they hear BAA's try and subtly slip in references to make themselves sound like VIP's, they roll their eyes and prepare for PITA's.

To the sommelier. The sommelier! Do you know how much power the sommelier usually has? You seem to think emailing the sommelier will accomplish something more than wine service.

Please. As if the sommelier isn't capable of communicating with management. In most restaurants, the sommelier is a part of the management team.

Dutch, why did you feel it was necessary to reveal your party's credentials in a discussion about corkage and wine? What did that information add to that discussion?
You claim that you simply wanted to communicate that you were a party who really knew and cared about food--but wouldn't the act of emailing the sommelier and discussing wine choices in and of itself communicate that?

I addressed this above. Being a wine collector and knowing a lot of wine directors, there is always a concern that someone inquiring about bringing their own wine into a restaurant will do so in order to, candidly, bring an inexpensive wine with the goal of lowering the total cheque charge. By telling her that foodies would be in the party, we wouldn't be that type of diner. That is, we would be "good guests" as I phrased it.

I must say, there is an awful lot of moralizing going on in this thread and by the LTH'ers. People seem pretty adept and telling others how they think they should behave, and then are quick to call us by a lot of uncomplimentary names, all in the cloak of morality. You chide Steve and me for appearing "self important," "blow hards," "big shots" and whatever else, but it seems to escape you that you put yourself above us by judging us, providing us with instruction on how we "should" have behaved, and your implied superior knowledge.

My first post on this board was to rave about a restaurant in my neighborhood soon after I moved to Chicago. My reception was ice cold and critical. There, the LTH community accused me of being a shill, a hidden representative of a PR firm, and having ulterior motives--again one of (incorrect) judgment. Here, you have essentially called me a panoply of unsavory names, mocked the writing style of two of my posts (which frankly, was the most offensive and hurtful of all), and sat in judgment in your perception and/or characterization of my actions.

You guys might want to take a quick look in the mirror. Sheesh.

yawn - where is Khaopaat with that review in order to make this thread more readable....and not a pissing match that really has nothing to do with Gras' vision and L2O's food?

DutchMuse wrote:You guys might want to take a quick look in the mirror. Sheesh.

That's good advice, Dutch, you might wish to take it to heart. For example, I was rather content to ignore all of this for the most part until you began describing other posters as provincial and declaring that they need to get out more.

Steve Plotnicki wrote:

jpschust wrote:By the sheer virtue of announcing yourself or a guest as being a national blog writer/restaurant ranker, whether your intentions were there or not it does cast the message that you expect to be treated differently than others. There's absolutely no good reason to include it.

Sure there is because it increases the odds that a restaurant does something special for you including giving them the opportunity to source special ingredients.

It also sends a message that any and all missteps (real or imagined) will be broadcast, and restaurants understand this. That's what makes a writer/blogger/reviewer pre-announcing his arrival a leverage technique. Rather than eminating from a place of passion or appreciation for the chef's art, it smacks more of 'do extra stuff for me or I'll rip you new one on-line.' It leads to reviews and accounts that spend more time discussing what a given restaurant didn't do than what it actually did do.

=R=

ronnie_suburban wrote:It leads to reviews and accounts that spend more time discussing what a given restaurant didn't do than what it actually did do.

And with that we take an L.20 moratorium.

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