Volpi, which at least Graziano's uses, calls it Genova Salami.

Now that D'Amatos is serving sandwiches, is it time for an update?

Sub-Athon. I like it!

gastro gnome wrote:Now that D'Amatos is serving sandwiches, is it time for an update?

Well, we'd have to add a few to the list in addition to D'Amatos. Santander had suggested a few, including Italian Superior.

Santander wrote:Not exactly the same category as you've picked, but I do dig Alpine Sub Shop (Elmwood Park, near Johnnie's Beef, squishy roll variety), Italian Superior Bakery (muffuletta standard, but they'll make a sub), and the Italian panino imbottito at Piccolo Mondo in Hyde Park (lunch).

At least if D'Amato's is now serving sandwiches, there should be *no* mystery about the provenance or quality of the bread. No one should be getting better product for sandwiches than the bakery itself.

Don't be too sure... Maybe Graziano is the only place in the city with coal fired bread!

I'd be in for a subathon.
I'm wondering if there's a central location we could use for the tasting. I'm thinking we could enlist one or two people for each location to do the pickup abd transport to our tasting location so we could do a true side by side. Maybe a bar on the near west side that would allow us to bring in food?

laikom wrote:

gastro gnome wrote:Now that D'Amatos is serving sandwiches, is it time for an update?

Well, we'd have to add a few to the list in addition to D'Amatos. Santander had suggested a few, including Italian Superior.

Santander wrote:Not exactly the same category as you've picked, but I do dig Alpine Sub Shop (Elmwood Park, near Johnnie's Beef, squishy roll variety), Italian Superior Bakery (muffuletta standard, but they'll make a sub), and the Italian panino imbottito at Piccolo Mondo in Hyde Park (lunch).

Freddy's in Cicero also (with homemade meats! Cut extremely slowly!). But all four are different animals than your good control group of Bari / Riviera / Graziano / Panozzo (Piccolo Mondo used to be closest, with D'Amatos bread, but my data is several years behind there. Alpine has the fillings but not the same bread type).

Someone should organize this Sub-Athon. It would be a really good event and something we haven't done in a while.

Of course I'm down for a sub-a-thon, would you like to put something up in the events page, or shall I?

laikom wrote:Of course I'm down for a sub-a-thon, would you like to put something up in the events page, or shall I?

Feel free.

When you pick a date, I'll re-vet the Hyde Park subs in advance (Piccolo, but also Medici and Zaleski and Horvath, which have "classic" Italian subs on their own house breads) so you don't waste a trip south unless they seem up to snuff. I'm sure most neighborhoods actually have similar mid-level competition in this category without rising to the level of Graziano's, Da Riv (in its glory; meats cut too thick for my liking lately) or Bari, where I'm still a contrakennite apologist.

Looking forward to this one - it's been a long time since I've been to Alpine and Fontano's and I'm curious how they'd stack up. I just love a good Italian sub.

Here are some pics from a subathon one day almost a year ago. I put them in approximate order of preference but didn't add any comments because I've forgotten a lot of details (believe me, some of the sandwiches were very forgettable). The most pleasant surprise was my first visit to Vinnie's.

JP Graziano Grocery, 901 W Randolph


Italian Superior Bakery, 933 S Western


Vinnie's Sub Shop, 1204 W Grand


Conte di Savoia, 1438 W Taylor


Bari Foods, 1120 W Grand


Fontano Foods, 1058 W Polk


Gio's Café, 2724 S Lowe


Fiore's Delicatessen, 2259 W Erie


Miceli's Deli, 2428 S Oakley

After seeing this thread a couple of weeks ago, Mrs. P and I decided to try a couple of these joints ourselves. Tragically, it's created a bit of a marital rift! So far we've hit Bari and Riviera. In my view, the Bari Italian was superior to the Riv's Will or Italian. All three sandwiches beat Bari's prosciutto and mozz, which used a lower quality mozz than what I found at Riv. Mrs. P, however, felt the Will was superior, based primarily on the better quality bread, which I have to say was a bit unexpected given Bari is next door to a bakery!

All in all, I'd be happy with either of these places and look forward to the impending sub-off! Continuing my own tour, I'll be hiting JP Graziano's (who Mrs P believes was a friend of her brother's in high school btw) for lunch today.

Rene G wrote:Here are some pics from a subathon one day almost a year ago. I put them in approximate order of preference but didn't add any comments because I've forgotten a lot of details (believe me, some of the sandwiches were very forgettable). The most pleasant surprise was my first visit to Vinnie's.

I can vouch for Vinnie's subs. I live right between Vinnie's and Bari, but I find myself going to Vinnie's much more often these days. The sesame seed bread on their special is non-canonical, but it works very well, and I don't have to worry about them getting my order wrong, which I've had a lot of issues with at Bari. Also, they have Filbert's soda!

Definitely consider this as a stop for the sub-athon.

Vinnie's Sub Shop
1204 W Grand Ave
Chicago, IL 60642
(312) 738-2985

Perhaps, if a sub-athon happens, I might be able to bring something from Stefanelli & Sons in Blue Island, of which I am a fan. I don't see anything under Events yet, and my schedule is pretty rough for the next month and a half or so, but I'll keep an eye out just in case.

Stefanelli & Sons
13012 South Western Avenue
Blue Island, IL
(708) 389-0300
http://stefanellisitalianimports.com

Still trying to figure out a good date. My upcoming schedule is very full and with the picnic coming up, some of us thought maybe it'd be best after the picnic. If someone else wants to set the event, please feel free! Otherwise, I'll try to figure out something soon.

Now that sub quality has been extensively covered, I would like to ask about restaurant atmosphere, which is relevant to where I go for my birthday lunch next Wednesday. I want to try one of these great sub shops for lunch with my aunt. She can't walk very well and sometimes uses a cane. So, of all these great-sounding sub shops, which one has the nicest sit-down space and most convenient parking? Most of them seem to be deli counters, which won't do for Favorite Aunt. Also, someplace on the north side would be preferable.

Thanks, Jen

Pie-love wrote:Now that sub quality has been extensively covered, I would like to ask about restaurant atmosphere, which is relevant to where I go for my birthday lunch next Wednesday. I want to try one of these great sub shops for lunch with my aunt. She can't walk very well and sometimes uses a cane. So, of all these great-sounding sub shops, which one has the nicest sit-down space and most convenient parking? Most of them seem to be deli counters, which won't do for Favorite Aunt. Also, someplace on the north side would be preferable.

Here's what I remember of the seating options at the nine places I mentioned above. Updates and corrections are very welcome.

Graziano – Recently added some sidewalk tables along the Peoria Street side. Looks pleasant enough but I haven't yet taken advantage of their outdoor seating.

Italian Superior – Their charming dining room makes ISB the clear choice of the nine for dining in. Your sandwich will be served on an actual plate. Note the sandwich menu is limited, though high quality. Don't forget the excellent pizza and daily specials. Parking shouldn't be a major problem.

Vinnie's – A few tables in the bright, busy ordering area.

Conte di Savioa – A few tables by the windows, somewhat removed from the bustle of the store.

Bari – No seating.

Fontano – A few tables in the middle of the store (I think) but I don't remember the details.

Gio's – About ten tables in the middle of the grocery store. Somewhat of a restaurant atmosphere, including table service (I think).

Fiore's – I think I remember a few pleasant outdoor tables behind the store.

Miceli's – Maybe a dozen tables but less atmosphere than Gio's.

Graziano's has indoor seating now as well--about 3-4 tables if I recall correctly.

Vinnie's, and now D'Amato's, also have outdoor seating in the summer months, and parking is readily available on May St.

Thanks everyone! I think ISB will be my choice and I will report back!
Cheers, Jen

Italian Superior Bakery was a big hit with everyone-- even my husband, who had to work, but will be super-excited about the muffaletta sandwich leftovers. Also, the owner and employee were so pleasant and helpful-- they even gave us a quick tour of the bakery. 300 pounds of dough at a time, shaping and baking at 1AM.... cool.

I asked the owner how the muffaletta compares to those served in New Orleans-- he seemed faintly insulted and said that his version "uses real meat"-- I have to agree, it was one fine version. The bread had what I think were ajwain seed-- they added a nice, thyme-like taste to the meat and olives. The meats were excellent and the olive relish was abundant. Also, that's one big sandwich-- even I could only eat half. The aunt and kid had pizza (not heated), which was also judged to be excellent. My daughter was hoping for soup, but they don't do that until it cools off a bit.

And there was gelato! Woo! I was tempted by some of the frozen products, like the balls of bread dough. Next time...

Great place, thanks to LTH for the recommendation! My aunt mentioned how I "have not led her wrong yet"-- well, that's because I read th LTH.

Cheers, Jen

laikom wrote:I have received a 3rd answer. I called up bari. They do use the same coal fired bread that everyone else uses. I even asked to be transferred to the back to talk to the guy who handles the bread orders. Everyone was very nice and helpful, maybe even slightly amused at my insistence. I was transferred to the bread-master and was told the same thing. Same bread that everyone gets, no special orders, no special preference etc.

gastro gnome wrote:Now that D'Amatos is serving sandwiches, is it time for an update?

Two buddies reported (and Yelp hints) that Bari is officially off D'amato's bread. If true, there's a story there I haven't seen.

Torpedos los !! Submarine warfare on Grand Ave !! Word has it that Bari and D'Amato are in some sort of spat with each other and that Bari has stopped using D'Amato's bread.
I stopped into D'Amato's a few weeks back for some pizza and the girl at the counter was pushing their new subs. I asked if she thought they could compete with Bari and she replied "why not, they're not using our bread anymore" when I asked whose bread Bari was using she explained that they were using "some chewy crap from somewhere else!"
I ordered an Italian with my pizza and have to say that except for the giardiniera , the sandwich was a dead ringer for the old Bari product.
Adding insult to injury D'Amato's has started selling prepared foods as well.

Out of all the classic subs places featured in this post, I still prefer Al and Joe's in Franklin Park and Alpine in Elmwood Park. I still think both of these classic Italian sub shops are better than Bari on Grand Ave. Growing up over this way, the battle for the title of best Italian sub always came down to these two places.

Al and Joe's in Franklin Park is still the classic Italian grocery store. Their original Italian sub features the standards- mortadella, capicola, Genoa salami, aged provolone, lettuce, tomato, and Al and Joe's own vinegar and oil mix. Their hot giardiniera is excellent, and they sell it by the bottle. Al and Joe's is as old school as you can get in terms of the old world Italian grocery store. Even the look of the place is classic. They just don't have places like this anymore.

Alpine's Italian sub, otherwise known as "The Alpine," is a little different. The Alpine features ham, salami, capicollo, provolone cheese, and Alpine's own oil and vinegar mix. Alpine's hot giardiniera is excellent as well, but The Alpine is a lighter sandwich than Al and Joe's. But what really separates Alpine and Al and Joe's are their respective homemade vinegar and oil mixes/recipes. For whatever reason, they are better than Bari's oil and vinegar recipe. This is not a knock on Bari, for if I'm on Grand Ave., Bari has always been the way to go for me. I just prefer both Alpine and Al and Joe's for the above mentioned reasons. Alpine was recently featured on Chicago's Best on WGN. Both Alpine and Al and Joe's have been around these parts for a very long time, and their traditions run deep in this area.

Thankfully, we, as Chicagoans, have the best Italian delis/grocery stores in the world to choose from. I couldn't imagine growing up anywhere else in America. We are truly blessed as Chicagoans.

deepdish wrote:Out of all the classic subs places featured in this post, I still prefer Al and Joe's in Franklin Park and Alpine in Elmwood Park. I still think both of these classic Italian sub shops are better than Bari on Grand Ave. Growing up over this way, the battle for the title of best Italian sub always came down to these two places.

Al and Joe's in Franklin Park is still the classic Italian grocery store. Their original Italian sub features the standards- mortadella, capicola, Genoa salami, aged provolone, lettuce, tomato, and Al and Joe's own vinegar and oil mix. Their hot giardiniera is excellent, and they sell it by the bottle. Al and Joe's is as old school as you can get in terms of the old world Italian grocery store. Even the look of the place is classic. They just don't have places like this anymore.

Alpine's Italian sub, otherwise known as "The Alpine," is a little different. The Alpine features ham, salami, capicollo, provolone cheese, and Alpine's own oil and vinegar mix. Alpine's hot giardiniera is excellent as well, but The Alpine is a lighter sandwich than Al and Joe's. But what really separates Alpine and Al and Joe's are their respective homemade vinegar and oil mixes/recipes. For whatever reason, they are better than Bari's oil and vinegar recipe. This is not a knock on Bari, for if I'm on Grand Ave., Bari has always been the way to go for me. I just prefer both Alpine and Al and Joe's for the above mentioned reasons. Alpine was recently featured on Chicago's Best on WGN. Both Alpine and Al and Joe's have been around these parts for a very long time, and their traditions run deep in this area.

Thankfully, we, as Chicagoans, have the best Italian delis/grocery stores in the world to choose from. I couldn't imagine growing up anywhere else in America. We are truly blessed as Chicagoans.

How would you rank J.P. Graziano? clearly a fav. on this board. Also, do either of those places have giardiniera anywhere nearly as good as bari?

I think most subs can beat a bari, but to me it's their giardiniera that is truely remarkable.

With the apparent change in bread at bari and d'amatos selling great subs now, it's easier than ever to put bari giardiniera on a superior sub, just grab a jar from next door. in all fairness, I haven't tried a bari sub since the bread changed.

laikom wrote:How would you rank J.P. Graziano? clearly a fav. on this board.

Couple of days ago one of the line cooks I work with asked where he could a great Italian meats sub, without thinking I answered Graziano's. The answer surprised me a bit as in years past my answer would have been Bari. Before someone says Riviera, Alpine, Tony's etc he is from KC and a central city kind of fellow.

Count me in on the J.P. Graziano fan list. Love it. Like I said before, I love Bari, too. If I had to choose between Bari and J.P. Graziano, I'd choose J.P. Graziano by only the slightest of margins. That said, I'd take Alpine probably over everybody, but again only by the slightest of margins. Alpine's oil and vinegar mix, for whatever reason, is just better than everybody else's. I'm not sure why, for my tastebuds are not sophisticated enough to explain my reasoning. Al and Joe's is a very close second to Alpine in my book, but my wife would disagree. She prefer's Al and Joe's, but not by much.

Both places make their own giardiniera, and they're both excellent. Like I said, I couldn't imagine growing up anywhere else. I've yet to try D'Amato's new sub for a comparison to Bari. I've always thought that D'Amato's makes the best pizza bread anywhere, but that's a whole another discussion. Kind of like my recent post on Pizano's deep dish pizza, and who really invented deep dish pizza.