tem wrote:What you're basically saying is that it's the public's fault for making them so popular that he can afford to conduct business like a jackass and piss people off. Perhaps if the Chef were a bit more organized, he wouldn't have to go 'on hiatus' due to 'personal issues'.

This is absolutely NOT what I'm saying. I'm saying there's no fault here, it's simply the reality of demand outstripping supply many, many times over. You can dress it up, put a pretty face on it, throw money at an expensive system and a phone staff, but that isn't going to make it any easier for you to get a seat.

Per Se has far far more resources than Schwa (I mean, have you seen the back offices there? Just the office space alone is larger than Schwa). I think the basic point remains the same though...they're both hard to get into, especially for the exact date and time that you want. The path to getting a reservation differs for obvious reasons.

jesteinf wrote:Per Se has far far more resources than Schwa (I mean, have you seen the back offices there? Just the office space alone is larger than Schwa). I think the basic point remains the same though...they're both hard to get into, especially for the exact date and time that you want. The path to getting a reservation differs for obvious reasons.

For an exact date and time, true. But if you are flexible, you will get a Reservation at Per Se with one phone call that takes less than 5 minutes.

Kennyz wrote:

At Per Se and French Laundry, they'll politely tell you that they're completely booked and the only way to get a reservation is to keep hitting redial and hope you get through. But I fail to see how that's more convenient than a full mailbox. Same effect -- one just looks nicer.

I'm not sure what you mean by hitting redial. Per Se has an automated system that places you on hold until a reservationist comes available. There's no need to redial. If you call Per Se between 10 and 5, you will speak to someone after no more than a few minutes on hold.

Having done the reservations dance with Per Se (successfully), yes, you do have to keep hitting redial, and here's why...

First, when the reservations open, the lines are swamped. Starting 5-6 minutes before the appointed time, it's like the old days of trying to get through to Ticketmaster -- busy signal after busy signal.

Second, once you actually get through, you're dropped into a queue. While I don't have intimate knowledge of their phone system, I've read that the queue is ordered and holds more people than they can accommodate for the day. So if you aren't one of the first into the queue, you can wait for 25 minutes to get somebody, but you still won't get a reservation (on that last part, I speak from experience).

So no matter how nice their system and their staff is at Per Se, the reality is that the only way to get a reservation there is to be on the phone during a 5-10 minute window at a specified time on a specified day, dialing like mad, hoping to be one of the first to get through and hoping that you won't wait on hold for almost half an hour for nothing. Personally, I fail to see how, despite Per Se's expensive system and staff, that's functionally better than simply picking up the phone seven or eight times a day whenever it's convenient for me to see if Carlson's cleared the mailbox.

Kennyz wrote:

jesteinf wrote:Per Se has far far more resources than Schwa (I mean, have you seen the back offices there? Just the office space alone is larger than Schwa). I think the basic point remains the same though...they're both hard to get into, especially for the exact date and time that you want. The path to getting a reservation differs for obvious reasons.

For an exact date and time, true. But if you are flexible, you will get a Reservation at Per Se with one phone call that takes less than 5 minutes.

That was not my experience... perhaps mine was atypical.

And as pointed out above, we're talking about the resources and backing of the Keller empire vs. the resources and backing of Carlson's dad.

Dom - I wonder if Per Se changed it's system since you last tried, because the process you describe isn't at all what they do currently. The are currently open for reservations every day from 10-5, and they'll take a reservation for any available day in the next 2 months. I just experimented with a call, spoke to someone in about 2 minutes, and asked for a reservation on any date and time they had available. She offered me next Tuesday at 6PM.

but the point is that if you're speaking strictly from a business standpoint, he's only an idiot if he isn't filling his tables. Which he is. In fact, if you're arguing business and setting aside courtesy and convenience for his customers, he'd be an idiot to upgrade his phone system and bring in somebody to return calls, because then he's spending money to fix a problem he doesn't have.

Gotta agree with Dom on this one. As long as his vm continues to be filled and he's booked up as far in advance as he wants, why change? His business plan seems to be working to perfection. And who knows, maybe it's because of the difficulty of reserving that he's achieved a certain kind of desireable notoriety that fuels his success (that's not a totally ridiculous concept for business success as some NYC restaurants with unlisted numbers and unsigned fronts have proven). Perhaps it's all temporary, but it's really up to his customer base to determine that. Until then, if it ain't broke (i.e., I'm doing all the business I can handle and I'm happy with that), why fix it?

Dmnkly wrote:And I stand by my statement that this comparison doesn't make sense... and when I say that, it's not a personal attack and it's not an assassination of your character.

This goes to everyone, including Dom, who subscribe to the view that just because you say that you're not making a personal attack, doesn't mean you're not making a personal attack. Telling people that their statements don't make any damn sense is tantamount to a personal attack and indeed insulting and condescending. We all know better than than to describe to such playground logic!

Moreover, the statement "that doesn't make any sense," instead of "I disagree with you for the following [xyz substantive reasons]," is an intellectual cop-out. We can do better.

[Rant over.]

Kennyz wrote:Dom - I wonder if Per Se changed it's system since you last tried, because the process you describe isn't at all what they do currently. The are currently open for reservations every day from 10-5, and they'll take a reservation for any available day in the next 2 months. I just experimented with a call, spoke to someone in about 2 minutes, and asked for a reservation on any date and time they had available. She offered me next Tuesday at 6PM.

It's possible. I haven't tried recently. But the incredible difficulty of getting a reservation at Per Se is well-documented, including Bruni's well-traveled piece on how difficult it was for him to get in the door.

these well-traveled, well-documented "facts" about restaurants often take on a life of their own, even when they can be easily disproven by empirical evidence. The myth of how impossible it is to get into Frontera is anotehr example. Maybe this is why so many restauranteurs hate food blogs and discussion boards.

aschie30 wrote:Telling people that their statements don't make any damn sense is tantamount to a personal attack and indeed insulting and condescending.

Telling somebody that a specific statement doesn't make any damn sense because it is not logical (for the reasons that I did, in fact, enumerate) is not a personal attack. If I say kangaroos and koalas both live in Australia so they must eat the same foods, you should absolutely tell me that my statement doesn't make any sense because it doesn't. It's illogical.

If I insist that making this statement makes you an idiot (which I don't believe -- my arguments have holes sometimes), yeah, that's a personal attack. But I fail to see how pointing out an error in analogy or logic is a personal attack or condescending.

Dmnkly wrote:

aschie30 wrote:Telling people that their statements don't make any damn sense is tantamount to a personal attack and indeed insulting and condescending.

Telling somebody that a specific statement doesn't make any damn sense because it is not logical (for the reasons that I did, in fact, enumerate) is not a personal attack. If I say kangaroos and koalas both live in Australia so they must eat the same foods, you should absolutely tell me that my statement doesn't make any sense because it doesn't. It's illogical.

But, surely, you know and can perceive how it is a personal attack. Obviously, the other person believes it makes sense and is not going to fold simply because you say it doesn't make sense. I think it's more effective to actually contain substantive information in your response rather than resort to a blanket judgment.

To your example, it would be more effective if, I, in response, didn't say that your statement "doesn't make any sense," but rather state that kangaroos eat x and koalas eat y, but both live in Australia, so I don't think you're right.

Kennyz wrote:these well-traveled, well-documented "facts" about restaurants often take on a life of their own, even when they can be easily disproven by empirical evidence. The myth of how impossible it is to get into Frontera is anotehr example. Maybe this is why so many restauranteurs hate food blogs and discussion boards.

Perhaps, but my experience was pretty similar to Bruni's:

http://dinersjournal.blogs.nytimes.com/2006/09/20/holding-patterns/

It may not be everybody's experience, but if enough people experience it, it IS reality, not myth.

And again, to be clear, unlike Bruni seems to imply, I have no problem with this. There are only so many tables. It sucks, yeah, but that's just the reality of the situation. Thomas Keller isn't sticking his thumb in my eye by refusing to seat me.

aschie30 wrote:

Dmnkly wrote:

aschie30 wrote:Telling people that their statements don't make any damn sense is tantamount to a personal attack and indeed insulting and condescending.

Telling somebody that a specific statement doesn't make any damn sense because it is not logical (for the reasons that I did, in fact, enumerate) is not a personal attack. If I say kangaroos and koalas both live in Australia so they must eat the same foods, you should absolutely tell me that my statement doesn't make any sense because it doesn't. It's illogical.

But, surely, you know and can perceive how it is a personal attack. Obviously, the other person believes it makes sense and is not going to fold simply because you say it doesn't make sense. I think it's more effective to actually contain substantive information in your response rather than resort to a blanket judgment.

To you example, it would be more effective if, I, in response, didn't say that your statement "doesn't make any sense," but rather state that kangaroos eat x and koalas eat y, but both live in Australia, so I don't think you're right.

You're right in that I worded it firmly in my irritation over the writer's turning "people can't get a reservation" into "the guys running that place are egomaniacs" (not exact quotes). But if you reread my post, I think you'll find that my post did, in fact, contain substantive information refuting the validity of the analogy proffered.

Dmnkly wrote:

aschie30 wrote:

Dmnkly wrote:

aschie30 wrote:Telling people that their statements don't make any damn sense is tantamount to a personal attack and indeed insulting and condescending.

Telling somebody that a specific statement doesn't make any damn sense because it is not logical (for the reasons that I did, in fact, enumerate) is not a personal attack. If I say kangaroos and koalas both live in Australia so they must eat the same foods, you should absolutely tell me that my statement doesn't make any sense because it doesn't. It's illogical.

But, surely, you know and can perceive how it is a personal attack. Obviously, the other person believes it makes sense and is not going to fold simply because you say it doesn't make sense. I think it's more effective to actually contain substantive information in your response rather than resort to a blanket judgment.

To you example, it would be more effective if, I, in response, didn't say that your statement "doesn't make any sense," but rather state that kangaroos eat x and koalas eat y, but both live in Australia, so I don't think you're right.

You're right in that I worded it firmly in my irritation over the writer's turning "people can't get a reservation" into "the guys running that place are egomaniacs" (not exact quotes). But if you reread my post, I think you'll find that my post did, in fact, contain substantive information refuting the validity of the analogy proffered.

It did, but you see how the "doesn't make sense" statement detracted from the substantive information? In fact, that was what fusionfan (I believe it was fustionfan) focused almost exclusively on in response.

aschie30 wrote:It did, but you see how the "doesn't make sense" statement detracted from the substantive information? In fact, that was what fusionfan (I believe it was fustionfan) focused almost exclusively on in response.

I do, and it was terse. I could have been more diplomatic in choosing my phrasing, and I take that criticism, but I hope the irony of the fact that I'm being (perhaps rightfully) admonished for giving the impression of a personal attack in response to a post that was criticizing Carlson and the Schwa crew for "cook[ing] for THEMSELVES and their humungous EGOs", based on their reservations system (or lack thereof) isn't lost.

(Cripes, now I'm running in the Democratic Primary, apparently.)

I just got invited to a June dinner at Schwa by some friends, I didn't even have to call. Buuuurrnnn. So, I think the best route is just to wait until you're invited.

ab wrote:I just got invited to a June dinner at Schwa by some friends, I didn't even have to call. Buuuurrnnn. So, I think the best route is just to wait until you're invited.

Dear God, can this be the end of it.

DMChicago wrote:Dear God, can this be the end of it.

Soon I hope, or we may have to call the first ever Put down the mouse, take a walk outside, smell a flower, talk to a bee LTHForum timeout.

HAHAHA!

eatchicago wrote:I actually think that it's hard to get a reservation at Schwa because the Illuminati desire to consolidate their power by creating a sense of need and urgency in our population. By denying people an immediate reservation, Chef Carlson is working towards the government's goal of creating a virtual panopticon, enslaving us in our desires.

Schwa is obviously a step in towards the creation of the New World Order, and I would not be surprised if there was some Freemason or Rosicrucian ownership behind the scenes.

Or maybe it's just a really, really small restaurant that's really, really popular.

Best
Michael

Dmnkly wrote:You can dress it up, put a pretty face on it, throw money at an expensive system and a phone staff, but that isn't going to make it any easier for you to get a seat.

that's not what i'm saying, either. I'm not saying that he should make it easier to get a seat. He should make it easier to simply attempt to make a reservation - ie return messages promptly, don't let the mailbox fill up, etc ..

A potential customer shouldn't have to make endless attempts to *leave a message*. They should be able to call and either a) speak to someone who says "yes, that date/time is open" or "sorry, we're booked" or b) leave a message and have someone call back within a reasonable amount of time to say "yes, that date/time is open" or "sorry, we're booked".

G Wiv wrote:Soon I hope, or we may have to call the first ever Put down the mouse, talk to a bee LTHForum timeout.

I am so glad I just logged on to check things out in Schwa-ziland here...I was getting frustrated and irritable about everything around me because of these $%?!# issues...but then, the advice I needed! So, I put the $%?!# mouse down, went out the $%?!# door and sat down for a lovely chat with one of our apiarian friends. I feel so calm and relaxed now...what a revalation! Thanks G Wiv!

talk to a bee

I did as well, and I just got an angry buzz and threat of a sting. But the flower was nice.

G Wiv wrote:

DMChicago wrote:Dear God, can this be the end of it.

Soon I hope, or we may have to call the first ever Put down the mouse, take a walk outside, smell a flower, talk to a bee LTHForum timeout.

I tried to smell a flower, but it said the in-box was full...

Gotta love the internet. Strangers can fight about nothing without ever leaving the house!

So I wonder if the OP ever got that "reservatation?"

ksbeck wrote:I tried to smell a flower, but it said the in-box was full...

I don't know if the OP got a reservation, but this line caused me to snort!

Dmnkly wrote:In both situations [Per Se and Schwa], I have no reservation because they can't accommodate the demand. The only difference is that with Per Se, I've wasted 30 seconds being told what I already know...

Speaking for myself (providing a "data point," as people around here like to say), I would much rather be told straight up that I can't get a reservation than wonder for days, hoping against hope for a return phone call, hoping that if that return phone call comes I will be able to answer, and hoping that if I can't answer, the restaurant will leave a message that moves the ball forward instead of simply saying, "Tag, you're it."

Posts about Schwa since the last post to talk about the food at Schwa: 87

Posts about Schwa since the last post to talk about the food at Schwa: 87

But...that's not what this thread is about at all. It is titled "Reservatation (sic)at Schwa," right? Actually, I'm very glad that is discussion has been kept completely separate from the Schwa food-related thread. Kudos to the OP.

obviously, many people are frustrated with the way this place handles their reservations. a totally relevant complaint as there is more to a restaurant than the food. however, i agree that people who don't want to deal with this should just not bother going there. i would like to eat at this place but after reading these posts, will not. i refuse to believe the food is worth the aggravation described here (driving all the way from naperville in the hopes of speaking with a human being who doesn't have time to operate a telephone)