Indianapolis - two BESTs in USA

I moved to Indianapolis from San Francisco Bay Area about two years ago, and I also visit Chicago from time to time because my sister lives there. The restaurant scene in Indianapolis is quite pitiful in general, with lots of fast food chains. However, there are two restaurants here with two dishes that are absolutely the best I've tasted in USA:

1. Best Korean Soon Dubu (Spicy Tofu Soup)
MaMa's Restaurant
8867 Pendleton Pike
Indianapolis, IN
- I've been to a lot of Korean tofu soup places both in SF Bay Area and in Chicago. None of them even come close to the tofu soup at MaMa's, which is just soooo tasty. The small appetizer dishes at MaMa's are also outstanding. Beware though: MaMa's charges about $12 for tofu soup at dinner time. I recommend going at lunch time because the same tofu soup costs only about $8.

2. Best Pho (Vietnamese beef noodle soup)
King Wok
4150 Lafayette Road
Indianapolis, IN
- Likewise, I've been to a lot of pho places both in SF Bay Area and in Chicago, and the pho at King Wok just excels over all of them. The beef and noodles are okay. But the soup is just splendid. Their skillful use of a touch of sliced onions makes the soup taste just absolutely wonderful. They charge $6 for a bowl of pho about the size of the small/regular size at Pho 777. Kinda on the expensive side compared to Chicago, but the soup is just much much better than Pho 777.

I wonder if anyone has been to these places and can let me know if you think likewise, or if you have other comments.

docinthebox wrote:MaMa's Restaurant

I haven't tried that particular dish
at MaMa's, but I've always been
impressed with the overall quality
of dishes I've had there - love their
side dishes (banchan).

Another Asian place around town
that has always been consistently good -
fresh, quality, tasty - is Thai Taste
on the Northeast side, 82nd St in
the same stripmall as Trader Joe's.
There are a half-dozen or so Thai
places in town, but Thai Taste never
fails to please, IMO.

With PF Chang's as the only
downtown Chinese option,
I've found myself there many
times, and have yet to find a
decent entree, but damn if their
Hot and Sour Soup isn't some of
the best I have ever had, in or
out of a Chinatown. Rich without
being corn starchy or salty.
$6 for a bowl big enough for
3 or 4 people.

I hate to admit that I've still not been to Mama's House. I even have a friend whose mother was Korean and a good friend of the owner. I'll definitely be heading up there soon.

As far as Chinese downtown, my favorite is Cafe O in the lobby of the Chase Tower (enter off of Pennsylvania). It's high-quality Americanized Chinese food and they have outstanding hot and sour soup. It's run by the nicest family and they have a very loyal customer base (myself among them). I've been eating there for the 10 years that I've worked in the building and I don't think that they've ever raised the prices! They're only open for lunch.

I'm wondering if the OP has tried the Pho at Saigon (3103 Lafayette Rd). I've had the Pho at both Saigon and King Wok. I believe that King Wok's is a tad better, but that the overall dining experience is vastly better at Saigon. Plus the rest of the menu at Saigon rocks! The quail appetizer is one of the best things produced in a commercial kitchen in the city of Indianapolis! The last time I was at King Wok (last summer) it was 100 degrees outside and about 99 degrees inside the restaurant. I was drenched in sweat by the time we were finished eating. My wife had some non-Pho item off the menu and it was pretty unremarkable. The service also tends to be pretty bad.

Our favorite Thai place is Thai Spice down on County Line Road in Greenwood.

I'm a big pho fan. =) I've had pho at quite a number of places in Indianapolis, including:

King Wok
Sizzling Wok Hai (4351 Lafayette Rd)
Saigon
Sizzling Wok Thien Huong (7280 N Michigan Rd)
Viet Bistro (5763 E 86th St)

If you've been to a Vietnamese grocery store, you know that they sell a pho soup extract cube that you can use to make the soup base for pho. Most restaurants (including Saigon) use this cube, I suspect, because their soup taste about the same. King Wok is about the only place where the soup tastes significantly better than this standard flavor, in my personal opinion.

For Thai, I've been to Thai Spice for lunch once. They are indeed quite good. I also like the Basil Chicken at Thai One On in Avon. Avon is a lot closer to where I live so I've been there a lot more often. I have yet to try out Thai Taste. But I know where that is. Have been to that Trader Joe for a few times. Have also been to Asaka right across the street from Trader Joe (behind Hooters) for lunch and it was pretty good too.

I'll have to try out the Hot and Sour Soup at both PF Chang and Cafe O sometime!

I need to retract my recommendation for the Korean Soon Dubu at MaMa's Restaurant. I recently went there and it seems the cooking has gone down *a lot* in quality. The taste is very different, much inferior to what it used to be. When I visited the restroom, I saw a Mexican guy in the kitchen. I suspect MaMa is not in charge of the kitchen anymore, and the Mexican guy was the person who cooked the tofu soup. It's just pretty bad. Even for the lunch price of $8.50, I wouldn't go for it, not to mention the dinner price of $12.95.

Sad.

docinthebox wrote:I suspect MaMa is not in charge of the kitchen anymore

Wow, I haven't been there
for a few weeks myself, but
at that time it was all Korean
women cooking (and cutting up
meat with scissors). I actually
thought about going there myself
last night; hopefully it was just
some off night.

The most outrageous part of the tofu soup is this: I saw a large piece of very raw soft tofu in the soup, *as well as* very cooked tofu (they differ in color - it's pretty obvious). My theory is that maybe they didn't put in enough tofu in the beginning, so they add another piece right before it's about done.

Also, the scallions are not cut completely so four pieces would stick together in a chain. Then there's no nori anymore, and the soup was not served bubbling like it was before. Finally, it just tasted very different than what they used to serve, say six months ago.

This is just the soon dubu though. Their other dishes may be better, I don't know. I would think the bbq beef would be okay, since it's basically well marinated beef that you cook yourself.

Their side dishes are still very good nevertheless.

unfortunately, the metropolitans used for reference in this post is pointless. the amount of Koreans in SF is puny compared to Koreans in LA. just drive down La Cienega/Wilshire (or anywhere in Torrance for that matter) and you'll understand.

this post back in '04 on Korean food in Chicago is still mostly valid.

Another best to add to that for Indianapolis is Shaprio's Deli (a few threads on it in here), but simply the best Deli possibly in the United States, but certainly in the Midwest.

jpschust wrote:Another best to add to that for Indianapolis is Shaprio's Deli (a few threads on it in here), but simply the best Deli possibly in the United States, but certainly in the Midwest.

Besides the best, it's also the most expensive deli I've ever been to. $9.60 for a corned beef sandwich, $13.50 for the dinner (sandwich + couple side dishes), $15.50 for corned beef by the pound. Wow, this is more expensive than the most upscale grocery places I had been to in San Francisco Bay Area like Andronico's. I bought the sandwich for take-out and it's now sitting in my fridge. I do have high expectations. It'd better be good!

jpschust wrote:Another best to add to that for Indianapolis is Shaprio's Deli (a few threads on it in here), but simply the best Deli possibly in the United States, but certainly in the Midwest.

Here is a major thread on Shapiro's.

Cathy2 wrote:

jpschust wrote:Another best to add to that for Indianapolis is Shaprio's Deli (a few threads on it in here), but simply the best Deli possibly in the United States, but certainly in the Midwest.

Here is a major thread on Shapiro's.

I'm just curious why no one commented on the price in that thread. Am I the only one to think that $9.60 ($10.30 after tax) is a little steep for a corned beef sandwich on rye? (They do charge 50 cents extra *each* for tomato and onions. That means if you want both tomato and onion on your sandwich, that's another buck extra to shell out.)

docinthebox: a corned beef sandwich at Manny's here in chicago, no side except a pickle, will run you $10. Maybe that's why?

Similarly, a corned beef at Zingerman's in Ann Arbor will run you $9.50, or $10.50 if you want extra CB.

So $9.60 for a top-notch corned beef sandwich seems in line with the prices at the better delis in the IL-IN-MI region.

Never mind the IL-IN-MI region, docinthebox, I take it you haven't been to a deli in New York.

The fact is that these days a deli that is serious about its corned beef/pastrami (as in, actually having something to do with its preparation beyond just slicing a premade product) seems to demand at least $10 for its efforts. I don't like it, but there you go. Jake's in Milwaukee is the obvious exception. (Any others?)

Well, I finished the sandwich. I think the saving grace is that the portion of corned beef included with the sandwich is *a lot*. In fact, it's hard to finish in one meal. I split it into two meals so it's 5 bucks for each meal. That seems more reasonable.

Cilantro it's hard to compare prices between Shapiro and a New York deli. The same job here (say, in software engineering) in Indianapolis pays about 30-50% lower salary than in New York City. So deli sandwiches should be a bit cheaper here as well.

docinthebox wrote:So deli sandwiches should be a bit cheaper here as well.

Definitely, but it doesn't work out that way, for whatever reason. Maybe it's lack of volume, I don't know (although my impression was that Shapiro's is fairly popular with the locals -- never been there myself, so I don't know if that's accurate). In some cases it could also be the Zingerman's factor, although I doubt that has much influence on old-school places like Manny's and Shapiro's.

docinthebox wrote:The same job here (say, in software engineering) in Indianapolis pays about 30-50% lower salary than in New York City. So deli sandwiches should be a bit cheaper here as well.

Or, looking at it another way , deli sandwiches should be 30% to 50% more expensive in New York, yet through some miracle they aren't. Apparently the New York delis are losing $5.00 per unit. If it weren't for volume, they'd be out of business!

Cilantro: Yes, Shapiro's is tremendously popular, with two locations (original Southside, expansion location in Carmel) that are regularly swamped. The costs relate to the fact that the meats and the bread are all house-made with no compromises allowed. After 100 years in business, Shapiro's remains a family-owned business.

docinthebox: Yes, as you observed, the size of the sandwiches is really a two-fer, as are New York City deli sandwiches. Presumably, San Francisco delis serve smaller sandwiches?