Why use fish when you don't know the conditions?
1) Short time. 1.25 hours is a challenge on its own. Fish cooks quickly, any many can be served raw or seared. Its marinating time is also shorter.
2) Wide variety of cooking methods. If you don't know if you can get a good char on red meat, or have a low slow heat for a braise, fish starts sounding smart. You can adapt when you get there and say, "Hey, I'll steam this" or "I'll grill this".

The only other thing I can think of with such flexibility is shmoo: boneless, skinless chicken breast.

I wish that instead of the usual 'pack your knives' send-off, Padma had told Mattin to pack his red kerchief and go.

Also, even though I'm certain that Robin's dish was awful (based on the judges' reactions), at least she cooked something on the fire pits. Those who avoided doing so -- cevichistas, in particular -- really skirted the spirit of the challenge, IMO.

=R=

ronnie_suburban wrote:Also, even though I'm certain that Robin's dish was awful (based on the judges' reactions), at least she cooked something on the fire pits. Those who avoided doing so -- cevichistas, in particular -- really skirted the spirit of the challenge, IMO.

Except they didn't even know there would be fire pits until they got there and had already done their planning and shopping. They didn't even know if there would be fire!

Which is why I think these "plan and shop now, we'll tell you what you have to work with when you get there" are the stupidest of all by a wide margin.

Dmnkly wrote:

ronnie_suburban wrote:Also, even though I'm certain that Robin's dish was awful (based on the judges' reactions), at least she cooked something on the fire pits. Those who avoided doing so -- cevichistas, in particular -- really skirted the spirit of the challenge, IMO.

Except they didn't even know there would be fire pits until they got there and had already done their planning and shopping. They didn't even know if there would be fire!

Which is why I think these "plan and shop now, we'll tell you what you have to work with when you get there" are the stupidest of all by a wide margin.

That's true and I agree. Still as was posted above, ceviche was not such an intuitve choice, given what they did know about the challenge.

=R=

Dmnkly wrote:Except they didn't even know there would be fire pits until they got there and had already done their planning and shopping. They didn't even know if there would be fire!

Which is why I think these "plan and shop now, we'll tell you what you have to work with when you get there" are the stupidest of all by a wide margin.

You're usually right, but I've gotta call B.S. on this one, Dom.

You're on a cooking competition and they tell you that you're going to be cooking for a bunch of ranch-hands at a desert campsite. What do you think there's gonna be when you get there? Nothing but an ice cream machine and a microwave?

Any of those chefs could have thrown up a guess at what exactly the cooking situation would be, and they would have all been exactly right: open fire, cast iron, slim pantry, no appliances, harsh weather.

Heck, if there wasn't a fire, you could have built a pretty nice fire-pit the night before when they were toasting marshmallows.

I would have bet the farm that there wouldd be a flame and a place to prep, just like Bryan did.

Best,
M

Intuitive or not, 3 of the 4 winning dishes were fish dishes. As usual, good food cooked well trumps all. If you cook bad food, then not "fitting" the challenge might send you home.

As suggested above, I think the ceviches were chosen because of the unpredictability of the facilities and location: I don't know what we'll have but I should be able to marinate fish.

With all the running around, I'm surprised we didn't see a dish with sand in it. And despite (I think) Robin commenting that she chose shrimp because everyone else would choose pork or beef - well, there was very little pork or beef.

Tom Colicchio noted in his Bravo blog that he was also surprised no one chose steak. However, I remember hearing the words "high-end" uttered when the challenge was being presented to the contestants. Maybe they all equate seafood with high-end?

But I have to agree with the idea that, knowing you are going to be cooking & serving in the desert, as well as, sleeping their overnight with questionable refrigeration, highly-perishable seafood is a poor choice for a protein.

Also per Tom Colicchio's blog this morning is a note that the fire pits all used propane. Not that the contestants knew that beforehand, but it kind of takes away from everyone who claimed they knew how to work a fire (at least I think some people tooted their own horn about being able to handle an open flame).

Was it just me, or did the editors decide between last week's episode and this one that we need to dislike the tattoo'd brother? I didn't find him nearly as obnoxious as he was made out to be last night. I have to wonder if he never watched previous seasons... of course you're going to cook with unusual/different ingredients... of course you're going to cook in difficult environments... I don't care how many Michelin stars he has and how young he was when he got them - stop whining!

(FYI, from the Bravo bio: He has been the recipient of several awards including the "AAA 5 Diamond" and "Mobil Award" while serving as Chef de Cuisine at the Dining Room at The Ritz Carlton in Naples, Florida as well as a Michelin Star while serving as Chef de Cuisine of Charlie Palmer’s Dry Creek Kitchen in California.)

eatchicago wrote:

Dmnkly wrote:Except they didn't even know there would be fire pits until they got there and had already done their planning and shopping. They didn't even know if there would be fire!

Which is why I think these "plan and shop now, we'll tell you what you have to work with when you get there" are the stupidest of all by a wide margin.

You're usually right, but I've gotta call B.S. on this one, Dom.

You're on a cooking competition and they tell you that you're going to be cooking for a bunch of ranch-hands at a desert campsite. What do you think there's gonna be when you get there? Nothing but an ice cream machine and a microwave?

Any of those chefs could have thrown up a guess at what exactly the cooking situation would be, and they would have all been exactly right: open fire, cast iron, slim pantry, no appliances, harsh weather.

Heck, if there wasn't a fire, you could have built a pretty nice fire-pit the night before when they were toasting marshmallows.

I would have bet the farm that there wouldd be a flame and a place to prep, just like Bryan did.

I don't disagree right up until betting the farm. And I'm not saying that I would have done differently myself. But I can't fault somebody who's reaching for the pork if they stop and think, "Oh, crap... what if there's no fire or the fire's no good? Maybe I should just pick something I can make with my knife and a bowl and nothing else."

Plus, yeah, it turned out to be wildly inappropriate. But I've been to some "ranches" that served food far more froofy than anything we saw last night, including the ceviches. And the fact that they were told to do high-end might've made some of them think they were going to more of a resort than a working ranch. "Ranch" can mean a lot of things. Whether or not it should is another discussion

Back when I still had the Triple-R, if any city slicker'd tried to serve us a bunch of raw fish, we'd have had a necktie party.

Or a red kerchief party.

Ceviche outdoors in the hot sun is just gross.

I gotta go with Michael, the very nature of the setup pretty much guaranteed a cookout, but even if you didn't believe that (maybe we'll do sous vide in a geyser!), I believe there are one or two other things that don't require cooking. (For instance, if Preeti was still around, she could have made a pasta salad!) Ceviche is puke-worthy under those conditions.

Mike G wrote:I gotta go with Michael, the very nature of the setup pretty much guaranteed a cookout, but even if you didn't believe that (maybe we'll do sous vide in a geyser!), I believe there are one or two other things that don't require cooking. (For instance, if Preeti was still around, she could have made a pasta salad!) Ceviche is puke-worthy under those conditions.

Allow me to reiterate... I don't mean to suggest it was a good choice, just perhaps not quite as ridiculous as it seems on face value

DeathByOrca wrote:

JoelF wrote:It is Bravo's highest-rated show, and they appear to have substantial corporate sponsorship, just based on the product placements (GE, Glad, Lexus in TCM, Toyota in the plebe version, Whole Foods... did I miss anyone?

Yeah. Diet Dr. Pepper.

Add Sprint to the list.

finally got around to watching Wenesdays episode. All the fish that was prepared was kind of ridiculous for the type of challenge it was, especially the 2 ceviche's, and the questionable shrimp, anyone of those 3 could have easily been sent home. I probably would have sent the shrimp preparer home myself.

If the shrimp went bad, though, it could be because the production company mishandled them between prep the day before and arriving at the campsite. Still doesn't excuse her serving them without tasting them, but I don't think they should send somebody home for their employees' screwup.

Dom, I should never have doubted you.

Ashley in the final four, after serious fakeout by the editors.

got around to watching Wednesdays episode. Kind of disappointed to see Ron go, but he just couldnt seem to grasp some of the challenges. With that said I thought Ash should have gone, too many excuses for not being able to get all of his dishes or components done.

Mike V's deconstructed Ceaser looked amazing, as well as Kevins's dish. Jennifer's lasagna didnt really do much for me.

Good episode with a tough call at the end.

Who do you send home: The guy who can't cook rice or the guy who didn't put a potato on the plate for his shepherd's pie? FWIW, Ash also blew it in the Quickfire. My money was on him going home. I figured Ron would get a slight pass because his misunderstanding "deconstruction" is a cultural/language issue (just like his misunderstanding of "vice" earlier in the season). But I guess if you can't cook rice, you should go home. Still, Ash is way out of his league, he even said so at Judge's Table, and I'm sure he'll be gone in a week or two.

Overall, I liked the focus on thought exercises in this episode rather than high-stress catering situations. It was a welcome change. Still there was no major shake-up in the performances of the chefs. The only real story is the establishment of Ashley as a good contestant.

I felt terrible for Jennifer when she drew lasagna. Deconstructing that dish has got to be about as far from her comfort zone as you can get. But, she proved she can rely on her technique and her understanding of flavor to put out a great tasting plate of food, no matter what. It's amazing that what she considers to be well below her own standards is still better than 2/3rds of the field. In my mind, she's the one to beat.

eatchicago wrote:But, she proved she can rely on her technique and her understanding of flavor to put out a great tasting plate of food, no matter what. It's amazing that what she considers to be well below her own standards is still better than 2/3rds of the field. In my mind, she's the one to beat.

More so than in any other season I can remember, mastery over technique and cooking fundamentals seem to be distinguishing factors. Those who possess them seem to excel, regardless of the specifics of the challenge.

=R=

Although it's clear that they're getting into a phase of high-end, upscale-2009 cooking that Ron simply doesn't work in, and he was clearly a goner soon enough (even if he'd made a traditional pi-yella, it appears he's unfamiliar with the concept of soccorat, the crispy rice edge, so what he knows how to make is a big bowl of rice), I thought Ash should have bit the dust for one reason: scrapping one part of your dish because it didn't work is brave. Having to do it twice in one episode just means you're a screwup.

Ron is a chef at a hotel restaurant in Hollywood, FL. I don't think anyone REALLY expected him to get that far... but he sure was colorful!

I agree, I didnt think Ron would win, but he was entertaining to watch.

my money (if I was a betting person) is on Mike V., to me he has been the best week in and week out.

I'm torn between Bryan Voltaggio, Jen, and Kevin. I think Mike Voltaggio is the most likely of the presumed-final-four to go home early.. and I think the final four is going to be three of those four, plus Ashley.

We shall see.

Yeah, Ash has fallen down too many times just completing his dish to stick around much longer.

The Robin hating is silly. If you think Robin shouldn't be on the show, just cook better than her. And when she beats you all in a Quickfire, don't go bitching about it or you might just end up in the bottom yourself (Laurine).

Ashley has put together two good weeks. But clever editing or not, she looked pretty shaky the first few weeks. She's been up for elimination twice, which is tied for the most times of anyone left (with Laurine and Ash).

I'm not saying she hasn't looked good the last two weeks - she has. But she she put out a bad panna cotta because she was bored and let Mattin go down with the ship rather than try to impress any of the French culinary demi-dieux. This shows some poor competitive judgment. It also seems that she doesn't work well with others and prefers doing her own thing; when she does, she has showcased some skill. While the show focuses more on individual performances as the season goes on, she's still got a few hurdles to get through before I start taking her seriously.

edited to fix nonsensical sentence

I don't know that I really think Ashley's headed there, that was kind of a joke re: earlier posts in the thread. She's had more outright failures than Karla did by this point, I think; Karla just seemed mediocre, middle of the pack to this point. But if you can keep surviving, who knows?

(I still think Kevin's the one to beat, more than Jennifer. They both have perfect records in terms of never having been on the bottom, making it unlikely they'll screw up and get sent home in the runup to the finals, but on the other hand, Kevin is the one who consistently turns out the food that makes people swoon. So they both get to the final because they don't screw up, and then the one who wows them the most wins, which to me looks more like Kevin. Slightly...)

By the way, an amusing little editing moment: watch when Michael V. and Michael I. are explaining their dishes. They use the same reaction shot of Teller turning his head and peering more closely at the plate twice in a row.

I think she's headed there because it seems so unlikely that the obvious top 4 from the first episode would actually all make it to the final four. And she seems like the most likely candidate to replace them.. or maybe Eli.

High point of this ep: Michelle Bernstein making it abundantly clear that she regarded Toby Young as an ignorant tool, and her crackling eyes hinting that she would gladly emasculate him bare-handed at no charge. My kinda woman. GET HIM OUTTA HERE!

sundevilpeg wrote:High point of this ep: Michelle Bernstein making it abundantly clear that she regarded Toby Young as an ignorant tool, and her crackling eyes hinting that she would gladly emasculate him bare-handed at no charge. My kinda woman. GET HIM OUTTA HERE!

That was pretty awesome. While Gail remains my primary source of dread in my TC viewing, Toby has quickly cemented the two spot for himself. His infatuation with one-liners rivals Gail's; he's just a little better at it, so Gail gets the gold for (cue Comic Book Guy voice) worst TC judge ever. If they were standing along a red carpet somewhere or a New Years Eve show or some other such banal scenario, they're snarky one liners would be a great fit. But, damn, this is food we're talking about here. If you can't show some learnin', then show some soul, by god. Yeah, Michelle deserves some kind of award for that.

gleam wrote:I think she's headed there because it seems so unlikely that the obvious top 4 from the first episode would actually all make it to the final four. And she seems like the most likely candidate to replace them.. or maybe Eli.

While I definitely understand what that presumption is based on, it appears that the top talent on this show (the brothers, Kevin, and Jen) is much greater than past seasons top talent, and that the darkhorse theory won't necessarily hold this time. It just seems from my seat in front of the tv that even the fallback dishes these four could get by on would probably be better than some of the other cheftestants' more inspired dishes. I mean, Jen got writer's block in this last episode (a common downfall for an odds-on winner), and she still cobbled something together to get her in the top half of the dishes. That's pretty impressive. I'm betting that the rest of the Top Four could work their way through writer's block just as effectively. The only real danger they have (other than pure bad luck) is a team challenge when they're Exec Chef and the bottom half of the team screws the pooch, and they get kicked off because they were "in charge" (a basis I always found rather specious in past episodes).
Cheers.

I'm a little surprised that Jennifer's deconstructed lasagna got so much critic love -- it looked like a mess to me, it must have tasted great.
Unfortunately, everything I can think of to deconstruct a lasagna comes up resembling other pasta, such as a ravioli containing the tomato sauce (soup-dumpling style -- freeze the tomato sauce overnight, cut into cubes for assembling the pasta), a braised piece of short rib to resemble the flavors of the ragu, and some sort of ricotta-based sauce (oh, please, not a foam!). Would the ravioli distract from its lasagna origins?

Admittedly, some of these were easier than others: I can think of a half-dozen ways to deconstruct a paella (starting with something arancini-like). Others were hard just because it's been done so many times before (fish and chips, caesar salad -- on that one I might have featured a grilled anchovy)

Penn and Teller were great, I'm disappointed with the editor who cut away from Teller during Penn's explanation of the misdirection -- it's still mystifying when you can see it close up, they're terrific. It's a shame that Teller stayed in character the whole time -- he's a brilliant guy, and I'm sure would have had something interesting to say -- yes, he can talk, and will talk to you offstage -- they often hawk their souvenirs outside the theater after a show (probably not at the Rio). Just count your fingers if you shake his hand.

JoelF wrote:they often hawk their souvenirs outside the theater after a show (probably not at the Rio). Just count your fingers if you shake his hand.

they hawk EVERYTHING after their shows at the rio, and they'll tell you about what you can buy during the show (notably the metal bill of rights). And teller is very happy to chat up a storm offstage at the Rio, too.

On Saturday, Teller was talking about his recent trip to Amsterdam and Paris ("people just make out CONSTANTLY in Paris"), and Penn was calling everyone "Boss" at a rate of about one Boss every 4 seconds.

Unrelated: did you see the news about their detective show?