Though I'd rather spend time at a party like listed above than the way I spent it recently, babysitting for kids who with whom every food was a struggle. Knowing this ahead of time, I had gone so far as to stock things that never cross our threshold - "breakfast nuggets" and wonder bread - to no avail. Even McDonalds happy meals apparently contain condiments rendering them completely inedible.

I don't expect the world to enjoy lengua a la vinagreta, but I would like parents to teach their kids the skill of politely choking down plain Cheerios without complaint!

PS. I finally decided (after they complained about bluberries in their pancakes) to put my money where my mouth was and have them cook. A make-your-own pizza bar was a moderate success.

Aschie30 - I'm with ya on this one.

Mrs. Davooda and I routinely put out a nice spread for events like this because it's just what you do. I care not if they get their noses out of joint because it's not store-bought...my stuff happens to taste a lot better Where I live in central Illinois most of our friends are still doing this.

We do this because of the example our mothers made - when you have guests coming you undergo some effort.

We had something like this happen in our family when my youngest brother had bought his first house and was going planning a housewarming. When I asked what he planned to serve and could I bring a dish or two to help out, he shared that his menu plan involved the upper section of the chip and dip aisle, pre-cut veggies and dip and hot wings from the deli. I asked him if he thought that was adequate since his guests would be bringing him all kinds of nice things for his new home and he had plenty of time to prepare for the event. More importantly, I asked him if he thought Mom was going to be happy being served Frito Lay's finest and hours-old, half-spiced flappers. He ultimately did it right - I think passing the "Mom" test was the clincher

Sometimes the hosts are just plain clueless, though their hearts are in the right place. I remember being invited to an employee's housewarming party. There was a nice spread of munchies and homemade potato salad and cole slaw to accompany the cheeseburgers that were grilled (over charcoal) and served without any buns. When one of the guests inquired after the buns, he said that there weren't any. He looked at her like it had never occurred to him to eat a burger on a bun. This is a true story, believe it or not.

aschie30 wrote:

jlawrence01 wrote:Bringing in store-bought goods are completely acceptable.

Wow - you mean people can make heads or tails of a store-bought label? People can tell the difference between hydrowaxiglutencose and fructalicioussorbatenverboten on the ingredient list?

Maybe not, but the top 8 allergens (soy, milk, peanuts, tree nuts, eggs, fish, shellfish, and wheat) must be clearly labeled by law. If it is not clear in the ingredient statement whether the product contains one of the listed allergens, then a "Contains xxxx" statement must be below the ingredient statement.

I attended a wedding not long ago at a small Holiday Inn at the top of an exit ramp on an Iowa interstate. Lavish it wasn't. The families involved were neither rich or poor, but were fairly well-educated people. There was some very small attempt at making the meeting room where the ceremony was held not look like a conference room for a regional conclave of pharmaceutical reps. Bows were tied to some of the folding chairs, and there was a cellist and a few flowers scattered about. Each guest was given an elaborately designed program, listing the order of service and musical selections. It was die-cut and had a gold ribbon threaded through. I recall thinking the ceremony would be very long, since the program had at least 20 items on it. I also thought this was a rather odd thing to put so relatively much money into.

The service was over in 10 minutes. So much for the list and the expense.

The 150 guests were asked to leave the room so it could be set for dinner, and enjoy an hour of cocktails in the hallway. One problem. The bar wasn't yet set up. So people stood for 45 minutes before the bartender arrived with his stock. I wasn't having any of this scene for one second, and got myself immediately to the hotel bar, where I downed a couple of quick G&T's--not bad at $4.50 each for Tanqueray. I also enjoyed the free pretzels and fresh popcorn.

When I returned to the hallway--crammed with people trying to get in a drink order to the lone bartender--I noticed an easel-backed sign sitting atop the bar, reading that drinks were $6. As if a late-opening cash bar at a wedding isn't bad enough, they're charging a buck-and-a-half more for a drink than at the hotel bar? It couldn't be true, but it crossed my mind that whoever was paying for this wedding was using this as a profit center.

The food -- not surprisingly -- was atrocious. It was served (and tasted like it was prepared) by teenagers. There was no single wedding cake, but pre-cut hunks in the middle of each table, serving a centerpieces.

Dinner was followed by a powerpoint show (bringing the room back to the pharma rep feel), engineered by the groom. It was technically incompetent, and neither sweet nor funny.

So here's my question. Was this whole fiasco an example of forgiveable cluelessness or unforgiveably poor manners and hospitality?

Olde School wrote: it crossed my mind that whoever was paying for this wedding was using this as a profit center.

More likely, I think, is that the venue saw an opportunity to further squeeze the party-givers and goers. It amazes me what hotels and conference centers charge for, say, a coffee cart with a few crappy pastries. They bill maybe 300% over regular market prices...because they can.

Let's not forget that the best-laid plans of mice and men...I've given a bad party or two in my day....

Completely different from parties whose hosts would rather have gifts sent from a website that auto-replies with thanks to the giver...

Mhays wrote:Completely different from parties whose hosts would rather have gifts sent from a website that auto-replies with thanks to the giver...

Now THAT officially takes the Tacky Cake.

Olde School wrote:I attended a wedding not long ago at a small Holiday Inn at the top of an exit ramp on an Iowa interstate. Lavish it wasn't. The families involved were neither rich or poor, but were fairly well-educated people. There was some very small attempt at making the meeting room where the ceremony was held not look like a conference room for a regional conclave of pharmaceutical reps. Bows were tied to some of the folding chairs, and there was a cellist and a few flowers scattered about. Each guest was given an elaborately designed program, listing the order of service and musical selections. It was die-cut and had a gold ribbon threaded through. I recall thinking the ceremony would be very long, since the program had at least 20 items on it. I also thought this was a rather odd thing to put so relatively much money into.

The service was over in 10 minutes. So much for the list and the expense.

The 150 guests were asked to leave the room so it could be set for dinner, and enjoy an hour of cocktails in the hallway. One problem. The bar wasn't yet set up. So people stood for 45 minutes before the bartender arrived with his stock. I wasn't having any of this scene for one second, and got myself immediately to the hotel bar, where I downed a couple of quick G&T's--not bad at $4.50 each for Tanqueray. I also enjoyed the free pretzels and fresh popcorn.

When I returned to the hallway--crammed with people trying to get in a drink order to the lone bartender--I noticed an easel-backed sign sitting atop the bar, reading that drinks were $6. As if a late-opening cash bar at a wedding isn't bad enough, they're charging a buck-and-a-half more for a drink than at the hotel bar? It couldn't be true, but it crossed my mind that whoever was paying for this wedding was using this as a profit center.

The food -- not surprisingly -- was atrocious. It was served (and tasted like it was prepared) by teenagers. There was no single wedding cake, but pre-cut hunks in the middle of each table, serving a centerpieces.

Dinner was followed by a powerpoint show (bringing the room back to the pharma rep feel), engineered by the groom. It was technically incompetent, and neither sweet nor funny.

So here's my question. Was this whole fiasco an example of forgiveable cluelessness or unforgiveably poor manners and hospitality?

I've been to this wedding, except it was in Itasca, and the minister made inappropriate comments during the ceremony about the different ethnicities of the bride and groom. Made me squirm.

If the bride and groom hired the bartender and provided the cash bar, it does sound like there was a profiteering motive. I find that is increasingly the case. Some couples have no problems passing on the costs of the wedding to their guests. Now, don't get me wrong, I've attended some lavishly expensive affairs and felt treated like a queen, and I've attended budget affairs that were amazing. Not every wedding I've been too has been a blunder in hospitality and a study in tackiness. But, like I said, more and more, I see the wedding treated like a fundraiser. It seems like the inquiry goes something like this, "If I pay X amount for the wedding, how much in cash will I reap in return from the guests?" So if your motive is to reap more in cash than it cost to put on the wedding (minus Mommy's and Daddy's contribution), then you might have a nice little downpayment for a house or a honeymoon. I've actually heard brides and grooms discussing this.

On the flip side, it seems as if weddings and showers are sentimentalized more than ever -- perhaps as a reason to justify having multiple, overlapping showers and receiving umpteen gifts. "My wedding shower is one of the most important days of my life, so of course I expect all my loved ones to attend (bearing gifts, of course). . ." The flip side is that if you don't go along with the wedding money train, you're ruining someone's life and how could you be so selfish.

So I guess, in answer to your question as to whether the wedding you attended was poor hospitality or just cluelessness, I don't think I know enough about the people involved to make a call either way.

The similar wedding I attended was just ridiculous and almost put me off weddings entirely but I think it was part cluelessness and part cheapness. The bride was doing 99% of the planning and focusing 99% on her dress and makeup. The groom, who is a notorious cheapskate, held the pursestrings and vetoed certain costs he believed to be excessive, which was of course practically everything that the guests would want. So the net result was a terribly disorganized affair, with undue focus on useless things like an elaborate program and weird wedding favors, and little focus on the guests' comfort (to wit, that the reception hall had the look and feel of a dreary, dirty 1970s funeral home, half-dead flowers were affixed by large, visible rubber bands to pews, and the food was a breaded half-frozen chicken cutlet with a side of frozen mixed veggies).

Now, before anyone jumps out and points out how I am ungrateful, keep in mind that all told, my contribution to this couple's nuptials exceeded $500, when factoring in the engagement party, wedding showers, and wedding gift, among other incidentals to attending the affair. Had there been a bachelorette party, that would have been an additional gift.

Loved your story, aschie30, and it makes me think that what's most annoying is when people simply don't give a crap. And this has nothing to do with money, as you also suggest. I have been to grotesque affairs at fancy hotels, yet once attended a wonderful wedding party at a VFW hall with great fried chicken and bowls of potato chips on the tables. Good manners, good form, and welcoming hospitality all come from people, not bank accounts.

To your point about weddings as fund raising events: I once received a wedding invitation with a separate card detailing the gift-giving guidelines. Specifically, it asked guests not to buy gifts, but rather to send or bring cash. Even if this is becoming more widespread, I find it despicable and, frankly, unnecessary. Couples can register almost anywhere and take the gifts back for cash, if that's what they want to do.

Mike G wrote:One of the things that I suspect used to fall under the heading of American middle-class respectability, and was passed down mother to daughter until the great rupture in mores, was the idea that if you had company coming, you put on a spread and then some.

I think it has always varied depending on culture, background and class.

I grew up attending weddings that were lavish, sit-down dinners with elaborate sweet tables, but with alcohol typically limited to a single champagne toast. I was shocked the first time I went to a wedding of a non-family member and found the catering consisted of mostaccioli. salad and wedding cake with a free-flowing open bar. Then there was the wedding -- of quite well-to-do people -- that served only punch and cake. Talking to others, I learned that among that culture, it was quite typical.

the culture has probably taught her that a big spread is bourgeois, suburban (gasp) keeping-up-with-the-Jonesism, and made a sort of virtue out of stinginess disguised as saving-the-planetism or something. (Thus the recent birthday party my boys attended, where each growing, hyperactive 8-year-old was allocated one hot dog alone for the weenie roast.)

Nah, that was probably fat-kid phobia, part of the increasingly hysterical epidemic of prohibitionist, anti-fat fear mongering. I'm surprised they served hot dogs at all. I'm sure some other parents are fuming that their kids were served such a hideously high-fat, sodium-laden food.

I find this whole issue interesting. As a person who often plans things for her job -- it's just my number one concern to make sure that people are fed well. I'm not good at "tablescaping" or design and so I enlist folks who are. But at the same time, what's important is why you're throwing the party -- for who? why? what's the occasion? If you're going to go out of your way, for whatever reason, to throw a party then for god's sake, do it right. I mean...parties are supposed to be fun for god's sake and if you have that attitude about it then whether you serve hostess cupcakes or homemade cupcakes with homemade butter cream, it really doesn't matter.

That said, I provide home made stuff sometimes or store bought stuff sometimes but I always want whatever I provide to be to be tasty. I always want folks to enjoy them. And maybe not everyone has this gene. Not everyone believes in universal health care for all either.

The thing that bothers me about aschie's original party issue (and what I mean is that I see what aschie is saying here) is that I don't get people who volunteer to do something, like throw a baby shower, and just don't live up to the basics of doing such a thing. If they can't do that -- then perhaps they shouldn't host the thing. It's just thoughtless and that tells you a lot about the people involved, i think. Throwing a party is not just about providing the space. It's about celebrating with friends and having a fun time, isn't it? is that too simplistic an attitude? I NEVER think about the gifts aspect -- but that's me. I also hate registries although I do the see the point of them -- but I'm unmarried so I've never gotten the free for all of the shower/wedding bonanza. But that's a whole 'nother thread.

Anyhow....i think a lot of aschie's original issues might have been solved if someone had just made a note of what they were serving in the original invitation. "Snacks and virgin beverages will be available" or "Cake will be served"...or something like that. That way...everyone knows what they're walking into and can prepare for the onslaught.

My 2 cents...

shannon

aschie30 wrote:Has anyone else ever felt like this or is it just because I'm a foodie that I'm placing undue emphasis on food and drink?

The first holiday I ever spent with my now husband's family I was served a canned ham. Now, on Memorial Day, this may be forgiven...but it was Easter and there was a brief moment (right after dinner which was followed by a "Cherry Bomb" which as far as I can tell is cool whip, cream cheese and a tin of uncooked cherry pie filling) that I very nearly called off the wedding.

Everytime that i throw a party, the number one and two priorities are the food and drinks, respectively.

Whether it be store bought or homemade (mostly homemade), it's going to be of good quality.

The intent to celebrate whatever your celebrating will be there regardless - thats what you're throwing the party for in the first place. How enthusiastic people are to celebrate it is dictated by the food and drinks offered - thats how it goes every time. Putting forth homemade food may not be the greatest tasting thing for some people, but it shows the effort is there. Quality store bought items may not have the effort, but they will lift spirits in taste.

Our Bears kickoff party is coming up on Saturday. This is an annual event. Over the past handful of years, the emphasis on the food and drink has taken this celebration of the beloved Bears to well over 100 people. It's now "Invite Only." Everyone I know loves the Bears, but enthusiastic inquiries to our party starting yearly in March would not be occuring if there was some B.S. food/drink spread offered.

So - bottom line, if you're going to throw a celebration - make sure there is fuel for the celebration - otherwise it's going to choke out quickly.

I've been to parties like the original post described, and i'm annoyed the whole time. sorry - i'm not snob, but bad parties are annoying to me. And i'm only 22 - these bad parties are just the beginning.

This thread reminded me of a party my mom attended recently. It was a birthday party for a friend of hers, thrown by her adult daughter, the [name redacted] in the following. Rather than try to recreate the horror in my own words, I'll just post excerpts from her emails:

"Sorry I missed your call. I was at a birthday dinner for ][friend], dear [name redacted] charged everyone $17.50 (plus tax) and bring a gift!"

When I expressed disbelief at the extreme tackiness of charging for a party, she replied:

"Charging for a party is tacky, and usually I would've just ignored it. But [name redacted] is such a piece of work, I just went along and was totally amused! I didn't even tell you the half of it. When she collected ($17.50) I gave her a twenty & asked about change. She said, the tip wasn't included in the price! Then asked where HER birthday present was. And finally (unbelievably) she said everyone was too full so she was forgetting about having the dessert. (Which on the invite said was included, homemade brownies & cake. In other words, she kept dessert for herself.) Oh, and she said if we didn't want to take the leftover dishes, have them pack them for her. Now, is that a piece of work, or what???"

I should also mention that this was a potluck, and held at my mom's friend's house (where [name redacted], incidentally, also lives).

Top that.

Did you leave out the part where your mother beat her to death with an umbrella from the front hall closet?

Charging for a party is illegal in Evanston (and possibly elsewhere) Amusingly, your mother could have forked over the cash and surreptitiously called the cops.

Most people don' t know how to cook much anymore so store bought things abound when you are invited out. What I see is the real fault here is not enough food. Regardless of whether or not you like or approve of the food offered (I am somewhat of a foodie but I could have made do with what you described), there should have been enough food. Seems like the choices were also sparse and at least two other additional food items should have been provided. Maybe some of the large sub sandwiches cut in pieces would have been nice, or a tray of made up deli sandwiches you can buy at Jewel, etc. Cakes at a shower are traditional and festive but some people hate cake and prefer pie so its a matter of personal preference. Many do not eat dessert at all. A nice bowl of cut up fresh fruit would have been an nice touch. Regarding the punch, not many adults like sickening sweet punch but its traditional. I would have put out several other drink choices, including several kinds of pop, wine, bottled water, and had coffee and tea as well. Generally hard liquor is not served at showers, and some folks don' t serve liquor at all in their homes for a variety of reasons. The critical sin in my family is not having enough food. I come from a family where hospitality is key and having double the amount of food is considered the standard. Providing an abundance of every kind of liquor is considered de rigeur. I have had to come down on my mom not to offer so much food as tons of it have been left sometimes to waste. But to show hospitality you do have to provide enough food to go around with a little left over. JMHO

Mike G wrote:Did you leave out the part where your mother beat her to death with an umbrella from the front hall closet?

The withholding of promised brownies is where I would have snapped.

djenks wrote:And i'm only 22 - these bad parties are just the beginning.

For 22, you're wise beyond your years.

Mhays wrote:Charging for a party is illegal in Evanston (and possibly elsewhere) Amusingly, your mother could have forked over the cash and surreptitiously called the cops.

The imagery here is too much . . . I can't take it . . .

Suzy Creamcheese wrote:I should also mention that this was a potluck, and held at my mom's friend's house (where [name redacted], incidentally, also lives).

Top that.

From where exactly does one garner the nerve to charge $20/person for a potluck dinner held at one's own home??

Seriously. That takes ovarian fortitude.

Wow! This is amazing thread of which I could reply to 20 different posts! Rather, I'll just relate two of my attempts to host NICE meals/parties at my house for friends/co-workers.

My first major party after getting married was a girls only cocktail event. Wanting to make my guests feel welcome and loved, I served good quality liquors and borrowed a fruit juicer from a friend to offer fresh mixers. To make it fun, I got some butcher paper and wrote drink recipes in different colored crayon on it, and then used it for a table cloth. The prep work took under two and a half hours.

The second party was another girls only event where I served about 6 different appetizers, two pitchers of prepared mixed drinks, and a couple of desserts. 95% of the food was made from scratch. Only the desserts were mixes. Nothing was terribly complicated and most apps only consisted of 3 ingredients with minimal prep time. I think it took me 4 hours total (two hours the night before, two hours the day of) to cook and set the table.

The result? I am now, referred to as the "Martha Stewart" or the "Bree VandeKamp"of my group. A majority of these people do NOT mean that as a compliment.

When I am guest in their homes and compliment them on their food and what a good time I am having, I am often met with a slight bit of hostility as the host responds with something along the lines of, "I try, but its nothing like you would have done."

Sometimes I feel that the art of entertaining is a stigma to my generation rather than something to be valued. I don't feel that making an effort when I entertain is old-fashioned or stuffy, but my friends seem to see it that way. My family showed its love for one and other, and friends, by putting out an effort and I do the same.

What bothers me most is that I WOULD never hold them to any sort of impossible standard. They all know that cooking is my biggest hobby and greatest source of enjoyment. I remodeled my kitchen to make my hobby easier. I grow my own herbs and veggies. I never make them feel badly about their hobbies.

Just my $.02

Kim

Kim3 wrote:The result? I am now, referred to as the "Martha Stewart" or the "Bree VandeKamp"of my group. A majority of these people do NOT mean that as a compliment.

Kim -

I think I know exactly what you mean and you're not doing anything wrong except bein' yourself. I don't know how old you are, but I'm in my mid-'30s, and I've heard that contempt in my friends' voices. In the case of one friend, she grew up in a household where her mother would get up and make dinner in the middle of the night if need be. She had no idea how to boil an egg, and really no interest in learning, either. She would love it when I had a dinner party because what she really loved was that others cooked for her -- not vice versa. After she got married and moved to the suburbs, her attitude changed. I think she thought that once she had the perfect suburban house, with the perfect suburban husband, and the perfect apron, I'm sure, and the perfect cookware culled from her registry, she would morph into Martha Stewart. Whereas anyone who loves to cook knows that, in the beginning of your culinary journey, the mishaps at least equal the successes. After one-too-many disasters, she gave up and resentment and jealously firmly displaced any former appreciation of my efforts.

Kim3 wrote:The result? I am now, referred to as the "Martha Stewart" or the "Bree VandeKamp"of my group. A majority of these people do NOT mean that as a compliment.

You're hearing the tone of voice directly and I'm not, but it could be that they actually feel inadequate, and what they're voicing is low self-esteem cloaked in mild joking aggression, rather than contempt for you. They probably wish they were you when it comes to that, and they don't know how to make that happen. What I'm trying to say is, what sounds to you like devaluing may actually be the opposite. Envy.

Right there with you, Kim - and the funny part is, I've had more than my share of entertaining disasters, so it isn't even about succeeding; it's about having the balls to make the attempt.

Kim3 - I am in the same position but of the male gender so it's really kind of amusing for me to be held in contempt for good cooking! My mother-in-law doesn't serve lasagna anymore because mine is better than hers.

Seriously though, in our downstate circle of friends, our spouses really don't participate in a signifcant way in the culinary preparations for house parties/cookouts because the guys have had to learn to cook in order to throw a respectabe party - and we've gotten to be pretty darn good cooks along the way

However, the Martha Stewart comment has prompted me to ask another potentially thorny question of the forum:

When you have a fabulous get-together with great food you've prepared yourself and the guests begin asking for recipes - do you share the TOTAL recipe with them or do you, maybe, just maybe - leave an ingredient out?

My mother-in-law does

When you have a fabulous get-together with great food you've prepared yourself and the guests begin asking for recipes - do you share the TOTAL recipe with them or do you, maybe, just maybe - leave an ingredient out?

I give recipes as-is without intentionally leaving an ingredient out. I have concluded the person who received may not acquire the same ingredients or may differ in technique. Whether I faithfully give them the recipe or not, the outcome will still be different.

Just last week I was talking to Amy Besa who wrote the book Memories of Philippine Kitchens. She has had Filippinos inquire if she
really provided the recipe as she prepares it. My friend Helen has had a devil of a time getting family recipes from her Filippino relatives.

The only time I will not share a recipe is if I obtained it from a friend who specifically asked to keep it mute. The Chex Mix I make at Christmas is in that catagory.

Regards,

Being a "pinch of this, shot of that" kind of cook makes it hard to get the written recipes right....I never intentionally give a bad recipe...

Davooda wrote:
However, the Martha Stewart comment has prompted me to ask another potentially thorny question of the forum:

When you have a fabulous get-together with great food you've prepared yourself and the guests begin asking for recipes - do you share the TOTAL recipe with them or do you, maybe, just maybe - leave an ingredient out?

My mother-in-law does

First, thanks for the support/comments aschie30, Mhays, Davooda, and riddlemay. I am in my early 30s, FYI.

As for recipes, I NEVER intentionally leave an ingredient out. However, I am the type of cook to throw a dish together based on one I had in the past, but with my own twist. This week, my sister asked me for a recipie and god knows what I did with the dish. 50% was by the book, the other was 50% improv.

I do sympathize with your stories, Cathy2 and mhays. My great-grandmother was just as protective of her recipes surronding any so rt of our cultural traditions (Jewish).

Kim

Kim3 wrote:The result? I am now, referred to as the "Martha Stewart" or the "Bree VandeKamp"of my group. A majority of these people do NOT mean that as a compliment.

This is awful. Since I don't even know you, don't take this the wrong way, but I think you should augment your social circle.

Good thing you found LTH.