hungryinchicago wrote:While we're all being friendly around here - can anyone point me to a good bagel place in the loop/streeterville vicinity? I can't find any and while running a search on this forum only found suggestions for places that are an hour away on the L.

Hungry,

Sure, soften us up with friendly and then go right for the soft underbelly.

It's been my experience good, which is highly subjective, bagels and bialys are not to be found in the Loop/Streeterville* area. Closeset would be NYC Bagel Deli on North Ave, which is not my personal choice of bagel.

I like New York Bagel and Bialy for both bagels and baily and Kaufman's for corn rye bagels, corn rye bread and pumpernickel with a topknot of caramelized onions.

LAZ did a comparative bagel tasting, Bringing in the bagels in 2005 which will make for interesting reading on the subject.

Enjoy,
Gary

*I would love to be proven wrong.

New York Bagel and Bialy
4714 W Touhy Ave
Lincolnwood, IL 60646
847- 677-9388

Kaufman's Bagel & Delicatessen
4905 Dempster St.
Skokie, IL

847-677-9880
NYC Bagel Deli
1001 W. North Ave.
Chicago, IL
312-274-1278

The take-out place at the East Bank Club brings in good bagels and bialy from the North Shore for its North Shore patrons. (Kaufman's or New York, can't remember which). It's open to the public. They also have decent fish (lox, rarely sable) and chicken soup to go. You could do worse.

Steve's Deli from Detroit (which we hear is nothing to get too excited about) is opening kitty-corner from EBC any time now. Not sure where the baked stuff will be sourced.

Fox & Obel in Streeterville has pretty good suppliers for most of its items. I can't speak particularly about its bagels (their other bakery products are usually quite good), but you may want to give them a shot.

If you are in the loop, I've been favorably impressed by the bagels that they offer at Cellars Market in the basement of the Chicago Board of Trade Building. Perfect? No. But a good bagel with appropriate chew, exponentially better than the chains? Definitely.

I don't know where they get them from, but I enjoy them occasionally.

Get there early if you want your choice.

Cellars Market
Chicago Board of Trade
Lower Level
175 W. Jackson
Chicago

Best,
Michael

hungryinchicago wrote:While we're all being friendly around here - can anyone point me to a good bagel place in the loop/streeterville vicinity? I can't find any and while running a search
on this forum only found suggestions for places that are an hour away on the L.

I keep meaning to get there myself, but Eleven City Diner at 1112 S. Wabash (not very far south of the Loop) is a Jewish restaurant that has many adherents around here, so they probably have a decent bagel.

jbw wrote:Fox & Obel in Streeterville has pretty good suppliers for most of its items. I can't speak particularly about its bagels (their other bakery products are usually quite good), but you may want to give them a shot.

Thanks, but I tried their bagels and they were super hard and chewy - of the kind that would easily break my grandparents' dentures. The taste wasn't too awful, but I like to eat my bagel not fight with it. Their breads, etc., though, were pretty good.

I'll give Michael's Cellars Market a try.

Before venturing down to 11city to test their bagels be sure to read through the following post (and the embedded thread) to avoid expectation/disappointment syndrome:

viewtopic.php?f=14&t=9277&p=91191&hilit=eleven+city+diner#p91191

What about Eppy's Deli? I thought they sourced from NY Bagel & Bialy.

Eppy's Deli
224 E Ontario St
Chicago, IL 60611
(312) 943-7797

Getting back to Zagat's, I always point people to this excellent article by Steven Shaw (co-founder of eGullet):
http://www.restaurantspy.com/articles/zagateffect.htm

I'll echo what a lot of other people said here: I don't know anyone in Chicago who uses Zagat's. Besides LTHForum.com, check out metromix.com (The Chicago Tribune) and http://www.chicagoreader.com/ (stick to the published reviews, not the user comments).

I dont think I have ever looked at a Zagat review, or recommendation for a restaurant in Chicago, or elsewhere.

I use LTH, Chowhound, Roadfood, and Chicago Magazine(even if it is published by the Tribune, which I boycott).

A friend of mine had a Zagat guide to sushi restaurants nationwide.

It really drove home how "repetitive" the "Zagat style" is when it's "confined to a small subject matter."

I think they served a real purpose back in the early 80s by sort of puncturing the pretension of New York food reviewing with a reality check from yuppies who could say, dammit, I eat out as much as so-and-so reviewer does, and I don't see what's so great about such-and-such he just gave 4 stars to. So it served a role in the democratization of food reviewing, leading to, well, right here among other places. But I haven't used one in years, any more than I've played Lode Runner or listened to Heart. Time has moved on.

hungryinchicago wrote:

LAZ wrote: Smile and talk to people you encounter. Chicago is a friendly place.[/list]

So you mean I shouldn't stare at people in amazement when they say hello on the street and wonder if they're about to mug me? Just teasing.

It does seem to me that Chicagoans are more prone to casual chitchat with strangers than folks in some other cities. That doesn't mean you need to be open to being accosted on street corners or smile at passersby. But don't be surprised if your waiter in a restaurant is a little chatty -- Chicagoans tend to like that from servers -- or if someone at the next table leans over to comment on your food.

Darren72 wrote:Getting back to Zagat's, I always point people to this excellent article by Steven Shaw (co-founder of eGullet):
http://www.restaurantspy.com/articles/zagateffect.htm

Fun article. Thanks.

I definitely feel that service in Philly restaurants is cooler/more distant than in Chicago, but on our recent trip to NYC service there didn't seem much different than it is in Chicago.

Just checked up on your blog Hungryinchicago and it seems you were at Emperor's Choice in Chinatown and slammed the food there just as you have at other Chicago restaurants. I've never been, and there may be some good dishes there, or maybe not, but if you had done a little research on this site you could have found half a dozen very good Chinese restaurants within a block that have received much more positive reviews - complete with pictures and recommendations on the best dishes to try.

There are thousands of restaurants in Chicago, some good, some bad, some wonderful deals, some outrageously overpriced. There are probably a few hundred that really excel in some way and many others where you can have a great meal, but maybe only if you order some specialty. They all combine to make Chicago known as a great food city.

If you wander around eating at random places you will eventually bump into some good ones, but you'll work through a lot of pigs in the meantime. The same would be true anywhere and would be a disappointing experience for a discriminating eater like yourself. Fortunately you have found LTH and have the resource to enjoy wonderful meals for your whole time in Chicago.

I moved to Chicago from Boston ten years ago and for years relied on Zagats, local newspapers, recommendations of friends, and eventually Chowhound and had a lot of good meals, but I'll say that since finding LTH I have been introduced to a world of wonderful food I never knew about before, and on almost any weekend with a little reading on the boards can find some new delicious dining experience. It's through this site more than anything else that I have gained a full appreciation of the depth and variety of culinary experiences in Chicago - everything from the Maxwell St. Market to Alinea. And through the site I've had some excellent cooking tips, learned where to shop for hard to find ingredients, gotten tips on restaurants in other cities, and met some great people.

So the choice is yours on how you plan to eat your way through Chicago, but if you really want to enjoy yourself and take advantage of the years that others have spent searching for the best of Chicago, especially the less well known local gems, I know a good place to start.

Good Luck.

eatchicago wrote:

JeffB wrote:Sorry. I have yet to be convinced that I should eat Thai ever again in the US outside LA or Chicago. Are we talking real Thai food from a specific region or regions, Americanized Thai, gussied up fancy Thai or what? I might take a chance, but need some convincing. Any fermented meats or dishes heavy on shrimp paste?

I have been to Land, and it won't convince you, Jeff. It's "upper manhattan" Thai, all fancy-ed up and tied in with Western cooking techniques and presentations (kaffir lime creme brulee, should tell you all you need to know). It winks in the direction of Thailand but authentic Thai, it ain't.
Best,
Michael

Hi guys,

I've tried Spoon Thai and liked it. I will go back for some more "traditional" dishes, but here http://hungrynchicago.blogspot.com/2008 ... rt-iv.html are my overall thoughts as to how it compares to Land. And Michael, you may be right about the non-traditional Thai accents at Land generally, but I disagree with you on the curries.

Cheers, and thanks for the suggestion.
Hungry.

I'm sorry you weren't crazy about Spoon, which, for about a dozen different dishes (none of which you had), remains one of my top two favorite Thai restaurants anywhere.

hungryinchicago wrote:The one discouraging feature is that the restaurant was ugly, it looked more like a college cafeteria than an inviting venue for a dinner. I would have loved this place if I were a college kid, but as an adult, I actually prefer something a tad more upscale.

Based on this statement from your blog, you may want to ignore my previous recommendations. We're mis-matched, my friend.

Happy hunting.

Best,
Michael

eatchicago wrote:I'm sorry you weren't crazy about Spoon, which, for about a dozen different dishes (none of which you had), remains one of my top two favorite Thai restaurants anywhere.

hungryinchicago wrote:The one discouraging feature is that the restaurant was ugly, it looked more like a college cafeteria than an inviting venue for a dinner. I would have loved this place if I were a college kid, but as an adult, I actually prefer something a tad more upscale.

Based on this statement from your blog, you may want to ignore my previous recommendations. We're mis-matched, my friend.

Not to mention about 95% of the GNRs.

I'm sorry you feel that way, hungry... that's just going to keep you away from most of the best ethnic eats in Chicago (or any city, really). But that is, of course, your prerogative.

Incidentally, as Michael mentions, you didn't even get to the good stuff at Spoon. I suppose if you needed to try the Ameri-Thai standards as a basis of comparison with your old favorite -- well, that's a reason -- but you're willfully ignoring what has gained the restaurant its reputation.

If decor is a major factor in your restaurant choices, this is probably not the best site from which to glean your recommendations. For that, you'd be better off with Zagat.

LTHers sometimes don't even bother to mention that a restaurant doesn't offer seating.

I haven't been to the Thai restaurant you like in New York, but based on your comments, it sounds as if you might like VTK.

VTK
312/644-8664
http://www.vongsthaikitchen.com
6 W. Hubbard St.
Chicago

I'd venture to say there is not a Thai restaurant in the country prettier than Arun's. I imagine the OP in this thread would love the place - the goldfish-carved carrots are sure to earn in a 10 in at least a few of his/her categories. Apologies if you look through the linked thread and see my derision of NYer palates.

LAZ wrote:I haven't been to the Thai restaurant you like in New York, but based on your comments, it sounds as if you might like VTK.

Funny you should mention that, as VTK was the restaurant with which hungryinchicago kicked off the blog.

It was a random choice late at night and it turned out to be quite pleasant. The atmosphere is sexy: low lighting, soft playing non-elevator music, tables comfortably far apart, private booths; a warm modern decor. This place would certainly be good for a date.

Maybe Spoon Thai's food in VTK's space would have pleased. I've never been to Arun's but it's always sounded to me a bit more "nice but a tad stuffy" than "sleek, urban, sexy" as seems to be this poster's desire.

I'd be curious to see hic's take on Arun's, though.

I'd be curious to see hic's take on Arun's, though.

It places very high on Zagat, far more than any other Thai restaurant in the city.

Interesting comment in the OP's blog about the other patrons at Emperor's Choice.

As in NYC, LA, SF, London and all other cities that I can think of:

Cops, firemen and/or sanitation workers: Good Sign

Fanny-packed tourists and roaming groups of recently enlisted military on leave (in Chicago's case, particularly teen sailors from Great Lakes wearing dixie cups): Not good sign. You might be in a tourist trap or something.

There are, quite obviously, exceptions. And kudos to the young sailors for serving our country and for not being at Bubba Gump's on Navy Pier. But they should have asked a cop or a fireman in Chinatown for a better reco than EC.

I think this thread proves that if you want to up traffic on your blog, post on a Chicago-centric food forum and simultaneously make sweeping, negative generalizations about Chicago's food. Presto -- you now have readership.

aschie30 wrote:I think this thread proves that if you want to up traffic on your blog, post on a Chicago-centric food forum and simultaneously make sweeping, negative generalizations about Chicago's food. Presto -- you now have readership.

Yes but it will likely be short-lived, as folks come to understand that the opinions expressed there are generally on a completely different plane than those which are typically expressed in these forums. Beyond that, though, I would much rather see 'Hungry' post his entries here. On a strictly personal level, I've lost my patience for 'clicking through.'

=R=

Kennyz wrote:I'd venture to say there is not a Thai restaurant in the country prettier than Arun's. I imagine the OP in this thread would love the place - the goldfish-carved carrots are sure to earn in a 10 in at least a few of his/her categories.

Awesome goldfish, but I don't think I'd want to spend that much money on Thai food, especially since I can go back to Spoon Thai and have a 10 course dinner for like $20. However, if I find some people who'd be willing to foot the bill, I'll definitely give it a try.

Oh, and in case you guys didn't know, restaurant.com has gift certificates for Spoon Thai, which make the place outrageously cheap.

Interesting article in the NY Times here comparing Zagat to Yelp that touches on some of the issues with Zagat raised upthread. I think the benefits of Yelp that are extolled in that article apply to an even greater extent to LTH.

I think the major differentiation is the quality of writing here. Yelp and Zagat both often rely on single-line blurbs - here, that's rarely tolerated: anyone posting "X restaurant is rad, man! {emoticon of hand of rock}" would be instantly peppered with all kinds of questions, eventually extracting actual information.

I think a lot of Yelp's reviews are more than just one-line blurbs. I like LTH better, but Yelp isn't nearly as bad as it's usually painted here

This is true (I do occasionally post on yelp.) However, the one-liners on Yelp are usually left to their own devices - where here, the community either goes out and finds more information to flesh out a thread, or demands more info from the poster, unless there's already a lot of coverage.