LTH Tour??

Dining with LTHers is a lot of fun, so I thought I'd ask if anyone was interested in taking it to the next level -- traveling with LTHers. I know someone in the travel business who could arrange a cool tour for a small group (say, 12 to 14), not entirely food oriented (there are other things to see), but with home-hosted dinners, visits to markets, cooking lessons, etc. Possible destinations are Russia, Africa (subsaharan), India, Vietnam, Egypt and Jordan, Costa Rica, and Peru. Trips would be anywhere from two to three weeks, depending on people's availabilty.

Any interest?

I figure we'd aim for something between the "stay in the kitchen" culinary holidays and the culture vulture outings, getting the best of both.

Hi Cynthia,

I would be very interested in merging two of my interests - food and travel.
With some exceptions, I am more likely to be able to participate in a week long trip rather than two weeks.

Jyoti

LTH Travel is something the the new Roundtable has been discussing, though it will probably not be in as grand a scale as Cynthia is suggesting...at least not at first. Once Spring has sprung, I'll probably be talking about it a little more because I'm not going to have much time to devote to fleshing out the idea until then. Stay tuned.

I'd like to throw in an idea that arose while talking with Gaylon Emerzian, the producer/director of "Living on the Wedge," the documentary about Wisconsin cheesemakers. She mentioned the possibility of renting a bus and visiting the Madison Farmer's markets and, perhaps, a few cheesemaking operations. This would probably be a two-day, weekend trip, small scale and, seemingly, do-able.

HI,

Gaylon threw out the idea to me as well. I proposed instead of a bus tour, to make it a caravan. If I am going solo, then bus tour can be comfortable. I am rarely on my own. Going by car, making my own sleeping arrangments and joining the group for tours and meals works out better for me financially as well as flexibility. On bus tours you have to leave at appointed times. By car I can stay later or leave early and catch up with everyone eventually.

Personally before I embarked on a trip abroad, I would be inclined to see how a road trip within our region would work out. I'd hate to be in some lonely location on this Earth with a person who is behaving like a pill. Plus the United States has plenty to offer, which really shouldn't be overlooked.

My current dream vacation is pulling out of the drive with no particular itinerary. Take off and scan the websites for great food along whatever path I happen to take. Probably I will have to find the great food on my own, though I think I could handle that. Of course, you have to pick your travel companions carefully or simply go solo. This kind of serendipity trip might drive some crazy.

Regards,

Cathy2 wrote:HI,

Gaylon threw out the idea to me as well. I proposed instead of a bus tour, to make it a caravan. If I am going solo, then bus tour can be comfortable. I am rarely on my own. Going by car, making my own sleeping arrangments and joining the group for tours and meals works out better for me financially as well as flexibility. On bus tours you have to leave at appointed times. By car I can stay later or leave early and catch up with everyone eventually.

It's a personal preference, of course -- I'd rather leave the driving to others (and there are gas costs to consider which are minimized on a bus). Plus, I think Gaylon was planning to have "presentations" in the bus (cheesemakers talking, etc.), and if I'm eating a lot of cheese I'd like a glass of wine now and again, so a bus would definitely be my choice.

HI,

I would make a final determination once I know the cost.

There was a bus tour to Southern Illinois to visit food destinations there. When the cost hit over $300 pp and I would likely come with 3 people, then I could do a whole weekend for less than one bus tour participant.

Regards,

I don't think there is any reason we couldn't pick "d. all of the above." Shorter bus tours, tours in the US, car tours, and overseas adventures are all options. However, the ones I would be interested in organizing would be ones that take me further from home. But I'd certainly consider shorter, closer trips organized by others.

Perhaps we could have a travelers luncheon or dinner sometime, once the whole travel idea has been more developed by those who are working on this front. That way, we could meet up with people ahead of time and figure out if we think they are the sort of people we'd like to travel with. At such an event, we might also find people we'd like to travel with even if no LTH tours ever materialize.

Of course, any time you take a tour, whether with LTHers or not, there is the chance that there will be a "pill" in the group. Even though, on those occasions when I go on tours, I always take small tours (5 to 16 people), I've found that, when traveling overseas in small groups, my score is about 50 percent "perfect" group and 50 percent great group with one pill.

If we do a tour to Wisconsin, I'd be more inclined to join in with the crowd on a bus or driving with someone else, rather than driving myself. I enjoy having company when I'm on the road. Are small buses available, so we don't need to get 35 people in order to have the tour?

Lots of options, lots of places to go.

Cynthia wrote:Are small buses available, so we don't need to get 35 people in order to have the tour?

Definitely.

Years ago, C2, VI and I were looking into vans for some kind of tour, and you can basically go with as few as 6 or so people...all the way up to 35, 50 and beyond.

I'll be posting more aobut what I had in mind along with some destinations in a month or two. I'm very tied up until then.

Cynthia wrote:Of course, any time you take a tour, whether with LTHers or not, there is the chance that there will be a "pill" in the group.

Meaning there is also a chance there won't be a pill in the group. Let's not take any chances. To avoid uncertainty, I volunteer to be the pill.

Jim "Glass Half Full" InLoganSquare

JimInLoganSquare wrote:To avoid uncertainty, I volunteer to be the pill.

There was doubt?

G Wiv wrote:

JimInLoganSquare wrote:To avoid uncertainty, I volunteer to be the pill.

There was doubt?

Perhaps just a little doubt. I felt compelled to dispel it. By the way, if we do the van trip thing, just so you'll know, I cannot sit in the middle seat because of my sciatica and will need bathroom breaks every 70 minutes, for reasons we needn't get into (yet). I hope you will also be a dear about the radio volume; let's keep it at "3" or below. And I don't suppose you need to be told to use your "indoor voices." And one more potential deal-breaker: Please, people, no heavy applications of perfume or cologne. (Gary, David -- a word to the wise, mm-kay?)

Let me know if anyone else has the same opinion - I feel culinary trips with even small groups are going to leave some dissapointed, mainly because of the group dining effect. A restaurant taking a large reservation (10 to 15) suggests a 'special' menu the group can order from, so the kitchen can handle the party (and also to even things out so the bill is easier to split). Picky people are upset they can't special order and adventurous eaters are let down since they missed out on that weird thing on the regular menu. Typically small kitchens are blown out anyway and service and wait times test even the patient.

With this group's focus and 'food attitude' it may not be a problem, and can probably be solved with some experience - I know you guys have had many successful large gatherings, but how does one solve these issues? Do you pick the place's speciality and make that the reason you go there, and insist that's what everyones going to eat?

I went on a group trip to Sicily last year, run by a chef and excellent guide, and while we had some great meals, I was always looking over at some other table's bowl full of sea urchins or plate full of spaghetti con neri trying to figure a way to break away from the group and get my own table.

The Wisconsin cheese trip sounds great, but only if you put beer on it too. (Even more reason to get a bus, but probably increases the likelyhood of pills). I'll be using this Cheese and beer map this summer to do my own touring in any case.

kiplog wrote:Let me know if anyone else has the same opinion - I feel culinary trips with even small groups are going to leave some dissapointed, mainly because of the group dining effect.

I think if you're working under the assumption that everyone has to enjoy every meal together, then yes you're right. But, I think everyone will enjoy themselves even more if groups split up and break off from time to time, even if it's in the same restaurant.

Last year, a group of about 12 LTHers went to NY for a self-guided culinary tour. We were in the same place at the same time for a few meals (once at separate tables in the same restaurant) and often times we broke off individually into smaller groups.

Then there's street food where the group dining effect doesn't really exist...

A couple comments:

Over the years, I have either organized or attended many "special interests" internet get-togethers and generally, they can be fun. In addition, when my wife and I travel, we generally combine a lot of meals in unusual locations with miles and miles of hiking.

What I have found that I enjoy the most is when we go with a large group to another city where the itinerary is very wide open to allow everyone to do a few things on their own. For example, in 1994, a group of Travel Forum people got together in Las Vegas and sponsored five meals and three non-food events over three days. There were 75 people who made an appearance but there were 25-50 people at any of the particular events. Smaller groups got together in informal events. Lodging and transportation was self-arranged although some of the "experts" were always able to recommend a more affordable option.

I would be willing to join in on any activity. However, personally, I can't handle say, three BBQ joints in a day no matter how small the portions. Also, my spouse, while very patient with things like four slices of pie for breakfast, always is ready to embark on a five mile march at the slighest sight of a national park or monument.

One of my other interests is travel, and like some other people here (including the one who pointed out LTH to me), I am active over at Flyertalk. I've gone to probably 10 out of town gatherings over the last six years, was part of a threesome which hosted 95 people here in Chicago in 2002 from around the world, and co-hosted 25 people in DC in 2005 (with only three current Chicagoans) ostensibly to watch the inaugural Cubs-Nationals series.

The best approach IMHO is for an organizer to pick a smaller city (or for this group, maybe two within a 2-hour drive), a cuisine type or two, and a weekend. Have a primary event on Saturday night where everybody is encouraged to attend, and put out some options for Friday evening, Saturday daytime, and Sunday brunch. Everybody pays their own way and organizes their own logistics (with a few recommended options), except often the main dinner is prepaid because there is often a room guarantee.

This thread is an example of an event which I attended in Dublin last year which was very well organized and very enjoyable.

I'd start within driving distance: Madison, St. Louis, or Indianapolis. St. Louis is probably the best choice of those, and one which I'd attend for at least the Saturday if the timing worked out right. I'd also probably be interested in Kansas City, Cincinatti, or Pittsburgh, especially if it was a weekend where the local Chicago team was playing baseball (big hobby #3...)

HI,

Last year when we went to Indy, we had a gathering place on Friday night which none of us arrived on time for. Some of us had breakfast together, then toured. Everyone lunched together, then we broke up for a few hours until everyone met for dinner. Sunday everybody was on their own.

I will admit I didn't expect the Saturday afternoon hours to be free, though I enjoyed my driving tour of Indy. Rene G has since done enough exploring to borrow ideas and make a full day or two just following his trail.

It was my first time at Indy. I'm simply sorry it took so long.

Just for chuckles I checked driving distances between Chicago and a few places within a days drive:

Chicago - Cincinnati: 299 miles
Chicago - Detroit: 283 miles
Chicago - Kansas City: 525 miles
Chicago - Madison, WI: 146 miles
Chicago - Memphis, TN: 534 miles
Chicago - Pittsburgh: 462 miles
Chicago - Springfield: 205 miles
Chicago - St. Louis: 302 miles
Chicago - St. Paul, MN: 398 miles
Chicago - Toronto: 437 miles

I have to admit Toronto is high on my list of desireable destinations. A friend as well as posters here described the Chinese food scene akin to Hong Kong. An opportunity to try Portugese food gets my attention as well. Plus the opportunity to visit a Canadian Costco with all its forbidden fruits doesn't hurt, either.

Regards,

Cathy2 wrote:HI,

Just for chuckles I checked driving distances between Chicago and a few places within a days drive:

Chicago - Cincinnati: 299 miles
Chicago - Detroit: 283 miles
Chicago - Kansas City: 525 miles
Chicago - Madison, WI: 146 miles
Chicago - Memphis, TN: 534 miles
Chicago - Pittsburgh: 462 miles
Chicago - Springfield: 205 miles
Chicago - St. Louis: 302 miles
Chicago - St. Paul, MN: 398 miles
Chicago - Toronto: 437 miles

Regards,

Do realize that Cincinnati, Detroit, and St. Louis are served by MegaBus which offers $1 fares (so many per bus) and boards at Union Station.

Detroit, KC, Pittsburgh and St. Louis are served by Southwest and with some planning, tickets can be had for $117 or less (on occasion).

Also, in most of those locations, you can get a 3* hotel room for $30-40/ night through Priceline (if you avoid Cubs weekends in St. Louis).

Toronto is tricky. You can do an Amtrak-VIA Rail through Windsor, ON but that is time consuming. Flights into Toronto Pearson require a valid passport these days. Flights into Toronto are often attached to some large fees.

Note also that train from Chicago to Toronto via Windsor is made hairier by the bus trip you'll have to take from the Amtrak station in Detroit to the VIA Rail station in Windsor, at least as far as I know. Crossing via bus at the Windsor/Detroit crossing is not fun, especially on your way back in. Even for citizens.

I LOVE the idea of a 1 or 2 day Wisconsin Cheese Tour. Bus or car, either would work for me.

gleam wrote:Crossing via bus at the Windsor/Detroit crossing is not fun, especially on your way back in. Even for citizens.

Especially if you are carrying food or groceries.

When I lived in Cleveland, I used to bring back frozen Australia lamb and fresh beef from the Windsor Public Market. If I went over the Ambassador Bridge, there was never a question or a problem. Go through the tunnel and they would always want to inspect what I was bringing in ... Secondary inspection.

Never went over on a bus.