Sun Times Food Section seeks feedback

Hi all. I'm coming to this thread late, I know, but while we're talking big picture and local food media, I'm curious to hear your thoughts on what the Sun-Times Food section is doing right/wrong/not at all. I've yet to solicit 'formal' feedback but figure this forum is natural for the informal but honest route. (This is Janet Fuller from the Sun-Times, by the way.)

Stop letting Pat Bruno "review" the exact same dishes at two branches of the same restaurant barely a year apart. That would be a start.

gleam wrote:Stop letting Pat Bruno "review" the exact same dishes at two branches of the same restaurant within a month of each other. That would be a start.

In fairness to something that requires no exaggerating to get its much-deserved ridicule, I'll note the reviews were actually a year and a month apart.

Kennyz wrote:

gleam wrote:Stop letting Pat Bruno "review" the exact same dishes at two branches of the same restaurant within a month of each other. That would be a start.

In fairness to something that requires no exaggerating to get its much-deserved ridicule, I'll note the reviews were actually a year and a month apart.

oh, yes, you're right. I've edited my post accordingly, and also changed the link to one that quotes the striking similarities between the two reviews.

I really liked your piece with John Bubala yesterday and I'd continue to push that style of article. In addition, I feel that the multimedia attachments / enhancements are a big plus.

I'd jettison Bruno; he's no longer relevant. I struggle mightily to extract any value from his reviews.

There are at least two dozen better / more interesting / knowledgeable / entertaining / passionate - that's the word, passionate - people writing about food here, imho.

The biggest problem I have with the food section is the 1/4 of a page wrap around thingy that goes to the back page. I don't know the technical term for it, but I don't like it. Sorry.

Re: Bruno - for my own selfish purposes, I was hoping to hear about just the Food section. His reviews run in our Weekend section, not Food - another animal entirely -though on our Web site, he might be packaged under Food.

Is there a desire to see reviews of some form or another in the Food section, rather than Weekend?

As for the Jewel ad, Diane: You're not the first person to say that, but unfortunately - or rather, fortunately for us - that's what's keeping the section going. It makes money for the S-T. And everyone knows we need that.

Thanks. Please keep the input coming.

Link to the recipes in the mobile version like you do in the regular on-line version. Also in the mobile version (and this goes for all stories) - just put the whole thing after the link. Why should I have to click into a second layer?

Yes, I only read on-line, sorry! (btw - I'd happily pay for a good Sun-Times app in the iPhone app store, probably wouldn't pay for a subscription)

Janet, a couple things.

First, my apologies for it taking the Trib to print a tabloid edition for me to realize that the ST has better content and reporting. Your paper is somehow able to produce more of a paper with a fraction of Trib's staff (though the Trib seems to aspire to be as fractional as you).

I want to go back to the subject of Pat Bruno and the comment to "jettison" him and that he's "no longer relevant." He's a smart, oftentimes witty reporter and the challenge for more diversity in what he covers may help to show these qualities more regularly. But let's not in this Chicago media climate be so callous to toss out ideas about jettisoning anyone on the newsroom staff.

On the subject of diversity, those of us from the South Side live in sustained bemusement at the complete and total lack of coverage for anything food related south of 35th Street. I'm afraid that this is the wrong board to come to for quality suggestions on this subject, but it's a fact that a good one-half of the population -- and rumored more than one half of your readership -- lives in the area about which I write.

So, when writing the next piece on who has the best (fill in the food blank) it's completely ok if your reporters take a right at Wells and not a left. And, Trib reporters -- the three of them still working -- too, are invited when stepping onto Michigan avenue, to turn left and head south. One or two families still live there and they eat the occassional meal.

You are smart to come to this board because there's not a smarter, better group of food writers assembled under one desktop. But don't take it too far. While these LTHr's would love for you to pull a Tribune and run your story ideas by them in advance, I'm going to suggest that would be improper.

auxen1 wrote:those of us from the South Side live in sustained bemusement at the complete and total lack of coverage for anything food related south of 35th Street. I'm afraid that this is the wrong board to come to for quality suggestions on this subject...

auxen,

I might suggest that the best way to change this is to post about south side places. Got anything to offer?

Kennyz

One thing I use this board for that I don't often use newspapers for - but would - a regular HT section on the wealth of international ingredients in the Chicago area. I just ran into a non-LTH friend who was telling me how much she loved H-Mart, but how she wished she knew how to use more of the foods there. I'm not talking just recipes, more general information - how to choose a good one, what the flavor-texture profile is like, a traditional use, a way it might work in a more conventional use, the nutritional value of said product. Then the online paper could be an index and a resource.

I know a lot of newspapers are doing this in a limited fashion already, but I think a more systematic approach might be of interest to many readers.

I might suggest that the best way to change this is to post about south side places. Got anything to offer?

Off the top of my head...

Maple Tree Inn was consistently very good...it's now moved further south into Blue Island.

Palermo's on 95th street.

Between Top Notch and Palermo's on 95th is an old joint named Petey's Bugalow. Petey cooks his fried chicken in butter. The steaks are decent, not great. But you go there to sit in disbelief at the number of complimentary courses that precede the entree including the world's largest relish tray. Why north of Garfield did they stop serving complimentary salad trays (cole slaw, three bean and macaroni)? Tough to push a bill for two over $50.

Jack Gibbon's Gardens for the dinner hash browns.

Koda's was good when it was run by the guy that managed Bistro 110 (and before that Hat Dance). But he's been gone a few months.

Fox's Pub (the one on Western, not Cicero or Pulaski) for cracker crust pizza preceded by ice berg lettuce and an unhealthy dollup of thousand island dressing. Which reminds me that there used to be a south side sandwich called a Freddy which was inoculation for a hangover. Fried Green Pepper. Fried patty of Italian Sausage. And then pizza sauce and mozzarella on a gonnella roll. Never ordered one earlier than midnight and never woke up with a hangover. Not original but that's really not the point. But, alas, Geno's is long gone.

Near Midway in the Lithuanian suburb (versus the old 47th and Kedzie "little Vilnius") is Grand Dukes. It's an adventure.

The Harold's Chicken Shack on 91st and Ashland is the best of his chain.

I'd appreciate a little more obvious differentiation between general "Food" pieces and ones that have a specifically local aspect. I'm not interested in the fact that the caipirinha is the new trend that will replace the mojito. What, do I own a bar? But if the story is actually about the 3 best places in the area to get a real caipirinha, as well as local sources for the ingredients -- should I want to make them at home -- well, then I'm considerably more interested. The online version, at least, could break down some stories into the general-for-anybody-on-the-planet part and the Chicago-oriented part.

In general, I think I'd like a little better sorting. How can I find food writers I like and whose taste I trust, if the newspaper doesn't distinguish among them? Frequently, headlines tell me that this is a "quick recipe" or "a new twist on [some dish]". But some of these recipes are by good food writers, some are from some random news service, some are from god-knows-where and written by "staff". How am I supposed to rely on the food section for good tips if the food section itself makes it hard for me to develop any relationship with its writers or any sense of trust in its offerings? The paper undermines its content by making it too generic.

And another thing -- could the paper offer extras in its online version, like pictures of dishes in restaurant reviews, or images of the steps in a recipe?

auxen1 wrote:On the subject of diversity, those of us from the South Side live in sustained bemusement at the complete and total lack of coverage for anything food related south of 35th Street. I'm afraid that this is the wrong board to come to for quality suggestions on this subject, but it's a fact that a good one-half of the population -- and rumored more than one half of your readership -- lives in the area about which I write.

If you search, you'll find that pretty much all the restaurants you've listed above have been written about here on LTH, although perhaps not as extensively as North Side locations. But plenty of LTH favorites, Steve's Shish-Ka-Bob, Chuck's, Uncle John's/Lem's/Barabara Ann's, etc., are South Side joints. I don't think it's quite fair to say this is the wrong board to come to for quality suggestions on the subject. As pretty much a life-long South Sider, I've found more than one place down in my neck of the woods because of LTH.

Agree that "quality" is a poor choice of words and neither reflective of my sentiments nor accurate. The suggestions are all high quality, but they are few in number as compared to northerly environs.

Other LTHr's far more prolific than I have raised the issue of under representation. Sniffing out the great places to eat on the South Side is a challenge. But the Sun Times is up to it.

....let me just add...now that Michael Cook is gone.

I'd appreciate a way to search or a separate link for Supermarket Sampler or other food stories, since the only searchable databases seem to be for recipes.