Olde School wrote:John Barleycorn

The Wife and I walked by the new John Barleycorn a few months ago and could not believe our eyes. What used to be a somewhat funky, friendly, neighborhood place has apparently been exposed to some radioactive substance, causing it to migrate to a new neighborhood and morph into a monsterous pleasure dome. The place is a stadium...and it was packed to capacity. Oddly, they still show old movies on giant screens in back.

Hammond

kuhdo wrote:Vernon Park Tap.

Kuhdo,

I love Tufano's Vernon Park Tap, been going for longer than I can remember. Most of what I love about the place is the lemon chicken, juicy flesh, crispy skin with charred edges and extra crisp cottage fries, luxuriating in a puddle of olive oil, garlic and lemon juice, with the potatoes on the bottom soaking up olive oil and chicken juices.

I'm also a fan of the fried calamari, broccoli and shells and Tufano's bread with a liberal application of giardiniera. Though really, it all boils, or should I say broils, down to lemon chicken.

Enjoy,
Gary

Tufano's Vernon Park Tap
1073 W. Vernon Park Pl.
Chicago, IL
312-733-3393

Comments on prev posts -
I agree w/ Mike G on Bob San. It's a pretty good place for some good 'shi,
if you go for sushi and japanese food, and not the 'scene.'

I think potbelly's is a decent sammich with decent condiments (although some have started using fake jello turkey) It's a head above subway which uses all fake jello meats, and an elongated wonder bread roll with no texture or flavor. And come on - potbelly Oatmeal Choc chip cookie?
YUM!

Hackney's=yawn. Wow. A half pound burger on rye for 10.00. I'll pass.
Cheesecake factory - King of the Sheeple places.

Totally second saps' comments on portillo's. I rarely go there since I have a few neighboorhood places that are better at certain things, but if I'm in an unfamiliar place, and I don't want to be disappointed with a bad beef (an all too common occurrence) I'll head to a portillo's if I see one.

My addition to the list:
Sorry, but it's Salpicon. 3 times now. Just bland everything. No flavor in anything I've had there. I give up. The chef must have pegged me and whoever I go in with. Whole table has commented each time on how bland all of the food was. I WANT to like the place. I really do, but I can't go back.

AND:
About 98% of the taquerias around Chicago after the bars close.

OOOOH - one more:
Lalo's.

seebee wrote:About 98% of the taquerias around Chicago after the bars close.

People throng sheep-like to these places? Really?

Well, I wasn't going to get into the sacred cows, but out of 5 times at Honey1,(once being the old location)-I've only found it to be good twice. My main bitch is that I can't find more than the faintest hint of smoked flavor-and I don't like super-heavy smoke. A place like Lem's blows them away for my money. I understand that bbq is timing and all that-but after awhile giving a place one more chance gets old. (Having said that, I'll probably return.)
Sacred cow #2-Spacca Napoli-only been twice-both times the dough was spongy with really no significant crispyness anywhere. One time, to add insult to injury-the toppings-(sausage and rapini) were bland and tasteless.
The stewed calamari app tasted like it slipped right out of a can. Had a way better example of this kind of pizza in N.Y. at Una Pizza Napoletana.(Having said this I will probably return.)
Now excuse me while I run for cover.

David Hammond wrote:

seebee wrote:About 98% of the taquerias around Chicago after the bars close.

People throng sheep-like to these places? Really?

Ya, rly.

You should see flash taco at 2am or 4am.

I love Potbelly's vegetarian sandwich. But now that I think about it, I don't love it for its complex variety of flavors; I love it because it is warm, cheesy, and comforting, resembling a grilled cheese more than anything else. I would imagine that that comforting warmth and texture would be more than a little dull if applied to any other sandwich.

gleam wrote:

David Hammond wrote:

seebee wrote:About 98% of the taquerias around Chicago after the bars close.

People throng sheep-like to these places? Really?

Ya, rly.

You should see flash taco at 2am or 4am.

I'll will take your word on that.

Honestly though, I think at 4:00 in the morning after a night of drinking, we're all sheep (as in, "Hey, we're driving to Vegas like NOW!")

Regarding H1, I have always remarked that those guys present a more subtle version of Chicago Q, largely because of the lack of seasoning. They let the taste of the meat shine through, and I think many prefer it that way. My personal taste tends more toward what UJ and Lem's does. Based on my own experience, seasoning, salt in particular, picks up more smoke than does well-trimmed pork. I still think H1 is great BBQ. And I hadn't noticed throngs of north-siders lined up there. I wish. Considering the meat is cooked exclusively over hardwoods, with no gas or other source of heat, it's sort of surprising not to detect any smoke at all. But I can see it. I myself have a problem with subtle flavors from years of anchovies, bourbon and Yucateca.

Now, SN does have the throngs, and I think it's worth noting that some had identified a short blip in quality that seems to have been corrected. Una Pizza N. might indeed be the best example of true Neopolitan pie in the US, but why stop there? There are better examples still in Naples.

I generally agree with most of the places discussed above. One big exception is Tango Sur. I never stand in that long line posing with the kids, nor do I order any of the gringoed-up items. Kudos to one of the last of the neighborhood independents (the owners, children of the butcher next door went to the grammar school across the street) for maintaining a place that is both true to tradition and appealing to Atkins Trixies and South American singles.

I wonder what it is about the morcillas, sweetbreads, chorizos, vacio and tortillas de papas that make the detractors think that this S. American emperor has no clothes. They might really be bummed with the food in Argentina, because I find this a very good example.

stewed coot wrote:Well, I wasn't going to get into the sacred cows, but out of 5 times at Honey1,(once being the old location)-I've only found it to be good twice. My main bitch is that I can't find more than the faintest hint of smoked flavor-and I don't like super-heavy smoke. A place like Lem's blows them away for my money. I understand that bbq is timing and all that-but after awhile giving a place one more chance gets old. (Having said that, I'll probably return.)

I have no problem with people taking on "sacred cows", but....

This thread seems to have migrated from "discussing places that people crowd into that aren't really worth it" to "listing the places that we think are overrated".

Are people crowding into Honey 1 these days? I haven't been there in a few weeks, and it doesn't seem that busy. This applies to a lot of others mentioned here. Salpicon? Sure it's full on the weekends (no more so than any other flashy place, though), but I hardly see throngs of people waiting in line to get in. In fact, you can get a reservation for any time this weekend for Salpicon on opentable right now.

eatchicago wrote:This thread seems to have migrated from "discussing places that people crowd into that aren't really worth it" to "listing the places that we think are overrated".

I agree that there's definitely a distinction between a place that has drawn accolades that you think is overrated, and a place that manages to draw crowds day after day based upon little, if any, or undeserved, accolades. The latter is what makes it a sheeple.

Tango Sur definitely seems to be packed with lines out the door in the evenings (maybe less so now that it's colder). The one time I went, the sweetbreads and morcillas were indeed what I focused on. Everything else: meh. But I don't really see the attraction of eating a big platter of meat. I guess I'll stay out of Argentina.

My two cents:

Wiener Circle

Ed Devebic's

Dick's Last Resort

Notice a theme here? Any time a gimmick becomes a draw over your food, I think you're in trouble.

Russell's - any location.

There seems to be some childhood nostalgia attached to this place. I've been dragged there by people who have loved the food since their parents started taking them there after church, or some such. I found the meat to be a notch above what you get at Arby's, and the sauce about as sweet and cloying. To repeat some others in this thread....I just don't get it.

cilantro wrote:I don't really see the attraction of eating a big platter of meat. I guess I'll stay out of Argentina.

Cilantro, you are your own best counsel. Hard to eat in Argentina if you don't enjoy big platters of beef, three meals a day, no vegetables. But, if you do like such things, a South American steakhouse is a decent option.

Notice a theme here? Any time a gimmick becomes a draw over your food, I think you're in trouble.

Or as Mike G's Law puts it, if there's a reason to eat somewhere other than the food, the food's no good.

I guess I can't say that I have seen throngs of ppl at Salpicon, since I am not always in the area, but I was going off of all the praise I've heard about the place. Usually, I can trust a handfull of ppl's opinions that I trust to figure out if a place is all flash and no substance, but I have only heard all praise for this place - except for when I've gone.
And when I've gone, it's always busy.

People are drinkin the haterade deeply in this thread! Perhaps the least productive thread in LTH history??... I'll just add that even most of the sheeple's mentioned put out a decent product (and perhaps you'd have to put out something halfway decent to even be a sheeple), albeit sometimes trends form and places get overcrowded for seemingly illogical and non-culinary reasons.

I'll throw my hate out there tho, just to add something: Almost all delivery Chinese is sheeple. And most of us are sheeple in that regard, we do it anyway, knowing the product is AAB.

ab wrote:Perhaps the least productive thread in LTH history??

As the great Ali G would say, "No doubt".

Perhaps the least productive thread in LTH history

Now THERE'S an idea for a thread!

ab wrote:People are drinkin the haterade deeply in this thread! Perhaps the least productive thread in LTH history??...

I believe the intent of the OP was to discuss places that seem mediocre and yet draw huge crowds. Now and again, the discussion seems to drift into more of a Places I Don't Like thread, but having lists of places people don't like (some of which others almost definitely Do like) is a lightening rod. My point: though we should be able to talk about places that seem to attract attention all out of proportion to their quality, feathers will undoubtedly be ruffled in the process.

Oh, and stick around longer...you'll definitely see less productive threads than this one.

Hammond

I agree that the thread has gotten a little off track. I understand why people eat at Outback when there are few other choices.

But what I wonder when I see some of these jam-packed and mediocre (or bad) places is often: "Why are they all waiting an hour to get into to Place A when they could have food just as good or better down the street at Place B?"

For example: Why are people waiting an hour to eat at Nookies on Wells (for which people wait an hour on Sunday mornings) when it is no better than Michael's North, (formerly Mitchell's) just around the corner?

or

Why are people standing on the sidewalk in front of the Bongo Room on Milwaukee when a few minutes walk would have them indoors and eating just as well at Las Palmas?

That's the real question, isn't it? Given the choice, why do people choose the crowded place over places of equal (or better) quality?

Perhaps this isn't the most productive thread...
Anyway-to clarify: I do feel that Honey 1 and Spacca are putting out good food-just not what I would expect from either. (I guess I assumed that Honey 1 was doing better business-wise, or I wouldn't have mentioned it.)
Jeff's point about diminishing tast buds is well taken. It is certainly true that as we(especially men, I understand)get older, we need more pizzaz in the food in order to be satisfied, and my lifestyle has certainly not helped.
As far as Spacca-my visits were spaced out by 4 months-again, the food on the last visit was tasty, but the whole reason for going here is the treatment of the dough, and it simply was not executed well either time. I have no doubt that others have experienced better, but I wonder how many visits I need to make.

David Hammond wrote:

ab wrote:People are drinkin the haterade deeply in this thread! Perhaps the least productive thread in LTH history??...

I believe the intent of the OP was to discuss places that seem mediocre and yet draw huge crowds. Now and again, the discussion seems to drift into more of a Places I Don't Like thread, but having lists of places people don't like (some of which others almost definitely Do like) is a lightening rod. My point: though we should be able to talk about places that seem to attract attention all out of proportion to their quality, feathers will undoubtedly be ruffled in the process.

Oh, and stick around longer...you'll definitely see less productive threads than this one.

Hammond

Don't get me wrong - I'm better for knowing the term sheeple, because it's definitely something we all think about, but it's gonna be impossible to separate "I hate this place" from "This place is inordinately popular"... But I'll keep reading anyway. And by least productive - I don't mean least interesting, because it's certainly not. I just think a lot of well-meaning, independent places will get trashed for being decent yet wildly popular.

I think one common thread in most sheeples is that they draw groups, generally friends or family, who like a place probably because the familiarity and history and nostalgia and/or the consistent praise in Zagats or the Trib, deserved or not.

Isn't the truth that most people could fool themselves into "loving" very average places if they're enjoying themselves and with the right people?

(I just had a flashback of Tony Bourdain eating with the Bush people of Namibia, eating the sphincter and lower intestine of a freshly killed boar, the delicacy of the catch)

The sphincter is better than Bourdain deserves. (I'm drivin' the bitter bus!-To hell with productive threads!)
Anyway, ab-what the hell do ya mean-good old American Chinese carries out very well-Get yourself to Orange Garden for egg rolls, mushroom egg-foo, and the like. Or for the real McCoy-Sun Wah for bbq.

David Hammond wrote:
Oh, and stick around longer...you'll definitely see less productive threads than this one.

Hammond

And those are often the best ones

MariaTheresa wrote:That's the real question, isn't it? Given the choice, why do people choose the crowded place over places of equal (or better) quality?

I appreciate MariaTheresa getting to the point. I'll point out the obvious ones:

1. Ignorance. Folks might not know that Las Palmas is good as the Bongo Room and less busy. Enter this forum to hopefully reduce ignorance. However, might I inject a quick editorial comment, if it appears that we're all a bunch of food snobs/haters, it scares the good folks whom might be somewhat ignorant from a culinary standpoint away.

2. People simply LIKE gimmicks. Regarding the Hard Rocks, Ed Debevics, etc. I, too, roll my eyes when I hear of people wanting to eat there, but maybe they ARE more interested in the theater than the food. It's a vaild preference. It might not be how YOU would choose to do it, but if someone wants to gee-gaw at Hendrix's stratocaster and suffer for it by paying $10 for an inferior cheeseburger, so be it! Add that many of these gimmick restaurants provide kid-friendly menus and attractions, then these become even more viable for a family.

A good cheeseburger is not THAT hard to find, just about anywhere in the country. Getting sweared at by the folks at Wiener's Circle is, as far as I know, a unique experience found only in Chicago.

3. As has been discussed, accessibility. There's better delis in town that can make you a superior sandwich than Potbelly's, but if your budget and/or time is limited, which a LOT of people find themselves encumbered by this constraint, than Potbelly's, is, rationally, the best option.

Another factor that can influence why someone chooses to go to the gimmickier/sheeple place is that while there maybe better food around the corner, it may not be as visually appealing. Many here at LTH know that often the little dive-looking/modest places have stellar food, but to the uninformed it just sends them running away. Which in my book is also sheepish behavior

Also, there is slight possibility that many may actually prefer the taste of something you might deem flavorless/over-flavored/whatever. (I said SLIGHT possibility.)

I'll add Uncle Julio's Hacienda and Bar Louie to the list. Pretty mediocre stuff IMO. Not horrible, but I don't see the draw.

Mrs.Monkey would like to add Frontera to the list as well. She's always been unimpressed and had bad service.

MariaTheresa wrote:Why are people standing on the sidewalk in front of the Bongo Room on Milwaukee when a few minutes walk would have them indoors and eating just as well at Las Palmas?

Or

Why are people standing outside Flo for an hour in sub-freezing temps in front of Habana Libre when they can go in and get a very satisfying meal sans wait?

In Zagat Guides, they have outlined two categories related to what's being discussed here.

"Critic-Proof" is their designation for places that do lots of business even though the food is so-so. One example from a few years ago was Bar Louie, with which I whole-heartedly agree.

"Teflons" are similar, with the distinction that these tend to be age-old favorites and long-running acts, even though they're clearly past their prime. Berghoff would have been an example, perhaps the Cape Cod Room and Billy Goat today. There can be wide disagreement in this category, though. Some would put Gene & Georgetti in this bucket, others would say it's Chicago's best steakhouse.