Awesome! It sounds like everything's okay then. If the beer tastes fine now racking it to the secondary, it should be much better by the time it bottles and carbonates. Phew. I was getting a bit worried for you there...shoulda just stuck with Charlie Papazian's famous words: "Relax, have a homebrew!"

Seriously.

And you know I activated my Wyeast pack for a brew later today!

One of the initial questions of this thread was if there was a place open on Sundays. Bev-Art brewer and winemaker supply http://www.bev-art.com/ on the far south side came to my rescue on a Sunday once and they will open after-hours as indicated on their website.

Additionally, my opinion on "kits" is they are no good. Invest in the basic equipment and learn how to brew not with the liquid extracts but at least with grains and basic malt dry extracts. Brewing should be experimentation and you can not experiment with a kit. I've no more than $200 in my equipment and I'll spend $25 to make a 5-gallon batch.

Also, get this book: The Complete Joy of Homebrewing Third Edition by Charles Papazian. It is informative and is a great start to the home library on brewing.

As for bottling, I use Grolsh bottles, granted they are green so store them in the dark (other swing-tops work too such as the lemonde from Treasure Island). They are super easy to clean, cap and to reuse. I have never had one explode. Brew-n-grow on Besly, which is between Ashland and Elston off of Cortland has gaskets for them. 1824 N Besly Ct.

They also have a wort sampling tube which is really handy for grab samples to gauge progress.

It also helps to be drinking during this entire process... In fact you should be drinking right now.

Cynic -

Thanks for the input!

We wanted to use the kits to get our feet wet and get one or two good brews under our belt. My buddy and I have co-invested in aeverything so we both thought it would be an easy way to slip into it all to see if we enjoy the art.

Just picked that book up yesterday. Some good stuff.

Ok, so just got done brewing the Oberon Clone from a kit we got out at Perfect Brewing. Everything went well until after we took the pot off of boil.

We are trying to figure out how to make your trub into the cone at the bottom and so the guy I am doing it with gave it a stir. In hindsight I htink this is the source of our issues.

Move forward. So we chilled the wort. Then went to siphon and we used a strainer (sanitized of course). We were pulling soo much trub up we had to stop every minute to clean the strainer.

Is the stir what killed us on this? And is it bad to have trub in your fermenting beer?

You can get socks that you can place the grain or the hops into when you are boiling. They help cut down on the amount of trub that you need to deal with. For now though, I think you'll be OK.

Hmm. Didnt think of putting our hops into a sock.

Nice idea!

wrapped in cheesecloth works as well.

I only use the sock for grains, not the hops. Hops in the fermenter is not a problem at all--they will settle to the bottom over time. If you dry hop (as I do most my beers), you usually put an ounce to two ounces of hops into the secondary, so it's not at all anything to be alarmed about. I just use big sanitized strainer when I pour the wort into my primary, but if some slip through, I don't worry about it.

Also, I personally don't think there's anything wrong with using extract syrups, as long as you use the unhopped ones. I do all grain brews from time to time, but I usually don't have the patience and go for a mixture of syrups (~ 6.6 lbs), dry malt extract (~ 2 lbs) , and steeped grains (usually crystal malt for the beers I brew).

FWIW, "trub" usually refers to the protein sludge that results from the hot break and the cold break, maybe with some hop deterius - I've never heard of steeped grains as being considered trub. Or maybe I just hang out with the wrong people.

nr706 -

I am new to this whole thing, so I am probably using the term incorrectly.

On a side note, anyone have any good ways to strip labels and the glue residue from bottles?

jpeac2 wrote:nr706 -

I am new to this whole thing, so I am probably using the term incorrectly.

On a side note, anyone have any good ways to strip labels and the glue residue from bottles?

I soak them in very hot water until they come loose (usually a couple hours). Sometimes, I just leave them overnight in the hot water and get to it in the morning.

Binko,

I tried that yesterday with some bottles and the labels came right off, but the residue was left behind.

Any thoughts on how to get that off? I was thinking about getting some goo gone and a razor blade.

jpeac2 wrote:Binko,

I tried that yesterday with some bottles and the labels came right off, but the residue was left behind.

Any thoughts on how to get that off? I was thinking about getting some goo gone and a razor blade.

Isopropyl alcohol should get it off. Also, gasoline. Exercise the proper precautions.

For most of my bottles, though, I've never had to resort to this. I just use a nylon or steel pot scrubber and that usually does the job.

edit: Put it this way, if it takes more effort than the pot scrubber, I just toss the bottle and use one that doesn't have the thick, rubbery adhesive. I actually can't remember which brands of bottles I have downstairs, but most of the labels slid off without leaving behind much gooey junk.

Yeah, I just use a Scotch-Brite pad.

All -

One more thing i forgot to mention. With both of the brews we have started, we are coming up low on our starting SG reading.

First batch initial read: 36
Should have been: 50

Second batch initial read: 40
Should have been: actually dont know, but figured higher.

Any explanation for this?

Could it have to do with us doing a partial boil? We are using a 3 gallon pot and are using 2 gallons of water plus extract. At no point during the boil are we adding the ~.5 gallon to compensate for the boil-off. Is that the problem?

jpeac2 wrote:We are using a 3 gallon pot and are using 2 gallons of water plus extract. At no point during the boil are we adding the ~.5 gallon to compensate for the boil-off. Is that the problem?

If anything, that'd drive your SG higher. Sure there are no air bubbles attached to your hydrometer? I usually give mine a good spin before taking a reading.

We spun it quite a bit as there was a bunch of bubbles on the top (on the second batch at least).



Well we will be bottling our first batch tomorrow. How do you all sanitize your bottles?

I think our plan at this point is to fill the sink (cleaning it first) with sanitizer and then soak bottles for maybe 15 minutes. What do you think? Take out and some how dry.

I soak 'em for a while (10 - 15 min) in a dilute bleach solution, then rise 'em out with a J-spray (tube/valve that attaches to the faucet and produces a high velocity spray that knocks out any particulates that might be hanging around inside the bottle).

There's no need to dry the bottles before filling.

nr706 -

Thank you for all your help. When all is said and done I will be very thankful for all the input you guys have provided. And I will need to share some beers at some point!

Unfortunately that spray device will not fit onto my faucet. I have one of those faucets (at least on my kitchen sink) where it pulls out and will switch from a direct stream to a spray.

Oh well. I guess just a good rinse will work.

I just use one of those no-rinse sanitizers, soak my bottles, and drain.

Have you checked your hydrometer in plain water to make sure it registers 1.000 like it should? Also, make sure to take your reading from the bottom of the miniscus (but that should only affect your SG reading by about a point or two).

'Rubbery' label adhesive is soluble in xylol. I use it to clean those nasty labels off Oz wines. Use just-been-boiled water plus dishwasher detergent to get most labels off with a bit of a scrub.

The residue comes off with a bit of xylol. Do it in an open space, the stuff is pretty volatile.

Geo

Well we just bottled.

Got to tell you, we tried the beer and I am not that impressed. I will be excited to see what some time in a bottle will do for the batch. At this point i can't help but wonder if we missed something along the way and did not take enough precaution to de-contaminate everything.

We shall see, 18th is first beer day.

Wow - that's a fast secondary - but if everything dropped out and you had clear beer (it wasn't a hefeweizen, right?) then it sounds good. Did you fine the beer in the secondary?

As far as the possibility of insufficient sanitization, did you detect off flavors, like Band-Aid, "sweaty socks" or "ball-point pen" flavors? If so, that's a contamination, and won't go away in the bottle.

If it's just not hat great in general, it's possible the carbonation from bottle conditioning could help.

At any rate - you have at least a 2 - 3 week window before you'll find out.

Good luck!

nr706 wrote:Wow - that's a fast secondary - but if everything dropped out and you had clear beer (it wasn't a hefeweizen, right?) then it sounds good. Did you fine the beer in the secondary?

Yeah, that is a very fast secondary. I generally do 5 days in the primary and 2-3 weeks in the secondary. That said, it doesn't sound like the type of beer that's being brewed here really needs much of a secondary.

Flavors can mellow and change over time, but that's usually more evident in high alcohol beers (with really high starting gravities). Also, carbonation does certainly change the flavor of a beer. But we won't know until tasting day what's up.

You did add corn sugar (or some source of food for the yeast) for your bottling, right?

I am not that familiar with extract brewing. However, I am concerned with the fact that your OG is so low, and that you have a lot of sediment left after the boil. It sounds like the malt syrup is not completely dissolving for some reason.

Ok the sediment problm was in our second batch. What we bottled last night was our first batch.

The first batch was in the primary for maybe 5-6 days and then another 5-6 in the secondary. So you all typically leave any beer in the secondary for 2 weeks?

We did not fine the beer in the secondary. What does that mean?

But the beer did clear up a ton after the secondary and there was a good amount of stuff at the bottom.

We did use sugars with our bottling, so we should be set there.

jpeac2 wrote:The first batch was in the primary for maybe 5-6 days and then another 5-6 in the secondary. So you all typically leave any beer in the secondary for 2 weeks?

At least. But, then again, I dry hop my beers which need the time in the secondary. And they also have a higher starting gravity, which needs the extra fermentation time.

We did not fine the beer in the secondary. What does that mean?

Fining is the process of adding isinglass or gelatin or something similar to clarify the beer. I've only fined my beer once and see it as unnecessary (plus, depending on what you use, it makes it technically a no-no for strict vegetarians and vegans, as isinglass contains animal products.) I usually let time do the work of clearing the beer.

But the beer did clear up a ton after the secondary and there was a good amount of stuff at the bottom.

That's what it should do, so good.

We did use sugars with our bottling, so we should be set there.

Good.

If your hydrometer is working correctly and showing starting gravities of less than 1.040, I'd be concerned that you've either added too much water or not enough malt extract. Personally, I don't make any beers with SGs less than about 1.055.

Next time, just toss in an extra 2 lbs of dry malt extract in your boil, or go easy on the water you add to your partially boiled wort. You are adding enough water to make 5 gallons, right? Because usually those plastic pails are 6 gallon containers, so there should be a decent amount of headroom left over.

Just out of curiosity, the recipe you're using, how many pounds of extract is called for?

Binko wrote:Fining is the process of adding isinglass or gelatin or something similar to clarify the beer. I've only fined my beer once and see it as unnecessary (plus, depending on what you use, it makes it technically a no-no for strict vegetarians and vegans, as isinglass contains animal products.)

From everything I've read, the fining materials drop out (which is why some people use Polyclar - a plastic - for fining), so I can't see why fining with something like gelatin should be a problem for vegetarians, since it doesn't end up in the finished beer.

But then I try to avoid hanging out with vegetarians whenever possible.

nr706 wrote:

Binko wrote:Fining is the process of adding isinglass or gelatin or something similar to clarify the beer. I've only fined my beer once and see it as unnecessary (plus, depending on what you use, it makes it technically a no-no for strict vegetarians and vegans, as isinglass contains animal products.)

From everything I've read, the fining materials drop out (which is why some people use Polyclar - a plastic - for fining), so I can't see why fining with something like gelatin should be a problem for vegetarians, since it doesn't end up in the finished beer.

But then I try to avoid hanging out with vegetarians whenever possible.

This is what they tell me--I'm not a vegetarian myself, but I try to keep up with these things, if for no reason other than to be a knowledgeable host when it comes to preparing food and drink for those with dietary restrictions. Do a Google search on "vegetarian beer" (yeah, I know how silly that sounds), and you'll see what I mean.