lao Sze Chuan

This was my second time eating at Lao Sze Chuan. I kind of forgot that my dad is a bit of wuss when it comes to eating spicy food. Anyway I was looking around and (learning much from CH-LTH) just started asking questions. I saw a great looking fish dish (whole fish in a spicy sauce with tofu) and ordered it - it was really good - spicy, but not killer. My dad wanted mushu chicken - which was good. My wife ordered a decidedly dull vegatable dish. We also ordered a basily chicken dish which was good, but not (I think) schuan. I saw lots of really other interesting dishes being eaten; however, by the time we ordered I hadn't got around to asking about more dishes that looked interesting (which were the ones in iron pots). When we left, I spoke to the manager (?) type guy who was a really nice guy and took time to answer questions about what other people were eating (while we were eating), I joked that next time we would talk about what we should really order.

Although not an asian food novice, I am not so school on the distinctions between chinese culinary schools. So two questions

1) Can some please not the disctinctions between the basic divisions of Chinese cooking.

2) Is there anyone who can help me out with dishes that I should order at Lao Sze Chuan (maybe Spring World as well) so I feel like I am eating what others are eating and not just food for the white people.

Thanks in advance

me and abraus went there on friday with some friends. i highly recommend the boiled beef in scechuan sauce--great tender pieces of beef swimming in chili oil.
we also enjoyed the spicy sechuan string beans.
on the waiter's recommendation, we got pan fried spicy pork, which some considered the best on the table (abraus and i like the beef better.)
i also think their hot and sour soup is exceptional.

I was at Lao Sze Chuan on Saturday, my lips are still tingling from the leftovers. I'm not an expert on Chinese and thus can't give you any "I don't want to order like a white person" tips, but I can say that their Ma Po tofu is the best I've ever had. Sure, it's kind of oily, but you forget that for all of the flavor that gets stirred up. I find myself spooning the broth over rice just to eat more of it. Such a good balance of heat and savory.

ParkerS, I also had the string beans. They were good but I was surprised that they were chopped up, made it more difficult to eat than when they are served long. Loved the bits of dried black bean and tofu in with them though.

Next time I need to go with someone who will order a hot pot with me, they always look enticing.

j3s,
i think we may have ordered disparate dishes, for our string beans were whole.
there must be more than one dish revolving around string beans on their 900+ dish menu.

I have similar issues of mis-ordering at Lao Sze Chuan. I WANT to order shredded pork sauteed in chili oil. I have seen this dish there but when I order something that sounds like it on the menu, I get something different. I'm tempted to lead the server to another table and point next time I want to order something.

I also would like to try the hot pot, but find that intimidating too. It will have to be sometime when they're not crowded and I won't feel guilty about sequestering the servers to explain all of this. Maybe sometime with a group of people where ignorance is safer in numbers.

Here are a few favorites at LSC:

- lamb with cumin
- tea-smoked duck
- crispy duck
- stir fried potherb with garlic
- boiled beef in spicy Szechwan sauce
- cold tendon in chili sauce
- double cooked chili pork
- beef and maw
- baby octopus home style
- Chengdu dumplings (?)

the last couple of times I've gone, I've gotten the hot pot, not for lack of appreciation of the other dishes, but just because it is so dern good.

After having gotten it several times, i should have, by now, probably migrated to ordering separate items which I really like, but alas, I continue to get the all-u-can, all-everything version which is great:

included:

hot pot - half spicy/half regular broth
dipping sauces (these I don't care for, luckily, they aren't needed if you get the house chili oil)

sliced lamb
sliced beef

squid
shrimp
fish (not sure what kind - white filets of something - one of my favorite things on the tray though)
fish balls
salmon balls
beef balls
tofu
tofu skin
cabbage
other greenery
mushrooms
+ probably other things I am forgetting

and tons of noodles - vermicelli

this is a fun, great dish - $12.95 during the week and $14.95 on weekends. also, the last couple of times they have brought out a complimentary cold rabbit in sichuan oil which is one of my favorite cold app's on the menu.

not really a summery dish, but now that i've got it on the brain I might have to stop before the sox game tonight.

afo

a.f.oneill,
can you maybe explain how one actually does the hot pot? do you cook your food in the broth, like pho, and then take it out or something?
what do you do with the cabbage and the salmon balls?
it sounds great, but i'm just unsure of the procedure here.

Parker -

I guess I never considered there to be a proper way - some things have different cooking times, but beyond that, I think it is pretty much a free for all.

The meats are meant, like pho, to be dipped in the hot broth momentarily until pinkish (or gray if you prefer) and then dipped in one of the sauces (they give you garlic, mustard, and some sweet thing). I dip and then bring to a cup of rice, dipping in hot oil on the way.

As for the rest, it depends on taste, although some things are, I think, always best cooked awhile (the balls for instance - hehehe). Squid is either real fast or a long time, depending on taste. The cabbage can be cooked for a real long time also - and in conjunction with other things kind of melts into the broth, like japanese Nabe. The tofu skin is another that really softens up with time. The fish and noodles seem to cook instantaneously.

Maybe I'm missing the real nuance of hot pot cookery, and if so, please someone chirp up and let me know. my current technique has been honed over 6-7 times worth of trial and error, with plenty of error along the way (no *bad* experiences yet though). Two things I forgot to mention, tripe and mussels, you may want to cook a bit longer also.

happy hot-potting.

afo

a f o wrote

Maybe I'm missing the real nuance of hot pot cookery, and if so, please someone chirp up and let me know. my current technique has been honed over 6-7 times worth of trial and error, with plenty of error along the way

Actually I think you have pretty much stated one of the essentials of being a chow-venturer (still working on names here) - the courage to try it, be dumb, and be wrong. And if it tastes good, and no one tells you that you are dumb, go with it.

Plus, in this instance, you are pretty much correct, in my experience. Not that being correct is important. If it is, I suggest consulting with the restaurant staff, whose job it is to help you. At some places, for whatever reason this seems most common in Korean places, I have found that when I hesitate over a dish, other patrons come and offer to help me.

Returning to the Hot Pot, isn't enjoying the broth at the end also one of the high points, or am I confusing Hot Pots here?

Reviving an old LSC thread here....

j3s wrote:but I can say that their Ma Po tofu is the best I've ever had. Sure, it's kind of oily, but you forget that for all of the flavor that gets stirred up. I find myself spooning the broth over rice just to eat more of it. Such a good balance of heat and savory.

As a huge fan of Ma Po Tofu, I finally ordered LSC's version. The broth/sauce was nearly perfect, but I was a tad dismayed by the fact that it was a meatless preparation. I much prefer the minced-pork style. It also lacked any major fresh vegetable ingredient like mushrooms or peas.

Very good flavor, but slightly disappointed.

re the mao pao tofu, I don't think I've ever had a good version of mao pao with peas or mushrooms or really any frsh veggies, with the exception of scallions. My understanding based on reading a number of cookbooks, including dunlop's (which is based on her time in the chengdu school of cooking and spending time in sichuan) is that it would be unusual to see those items. Her version surprisingly calls for ground beef rather than pork but I think I also prefer pork versions. The "spicy tander tofu" at LSC is one of the dishes I always order

In terms of the string beans, the chopped version IIRC is from the appetizer section and is an entirely different dish than thew whole dry-fry version, though I do like it as well, it is uneven, sometimes being salty to the point of inedibility, other times being one of my favorite dished ther.

zim wrote:re the mao pao tofu, I don't think I've ever had a good version of mao pao with peas or mushrooms or really any frsh veggies, with the exception of scallions. My understanding based on reading a number of cookbooks, including dunlop's (which is based on her time in the chengdu school of cooking and spending time in sichuan) is that it would be unusual to see those items.

It is true that veggies are definitely not in the base traditional recipe, but I have had more preparations with a veggie than without. Usually a cook or a chef trying to put their own little spin on an old-school recipe. A Chinese friend I was dining with at LSC said she considered peas to be very traditional. Great Beijing's version (which I hate) includes peas and carrots.

Personally, it doesn't bother me if it doesn't have the veggies, but I really missed the pork.

Chef Alan at Friendship used to have Ma Po Tofu on his menu which included minced flank steak and mushrooms and it was excellent. He has since removed it from his menu, saying that customers considered it "too spicy". Quite a shame. He has offered to make it for me on occasion, but it is not the same anymore, as I think he's uses the hot and sour soup broth.

Can anyone speak to the version at Spring World? They're next on my list.

Spring Worlds may be more to your liking - though they also do not use veggies, they do include ground pork. Personally I found the LSC's version more to my liking, I found the higher broth/oil content texturally better with rice and more flavorful than Spring World's

Regarding hot pots... The way we used to do it was to start with the meats, the balls, etc. then we did the vegetables just because the meat would just get lost in the mess of vegetables, and then when it is almost over, we dump in the noodles and have it with the soup. The soup will get so flavorful by that time... yum..

This applies to the clear broth based hot pots tho... Since the spicy one would get so concentrated by the end, it would blow my taste buds away... =)

zim wrote:Spring Worlds may be more to your liking - though they also do not use veggies, they do include ground pork. Personally I found the LSC's version more to my liking, I found the higher broth/oil content texturally better with rice and more flavorful than Spring World's

Zim,

I like the Ma Pa Tofu at Spring World, especially on the combination lunch menu. Spring World's lunch menu, one of the best lunch deals in Chicago, offers one-from-column A, one-from-column B for $3.95 with tea, rice and, depending on the day, fair to good hot and sour soup.

My typical combo is kung pao chicken and ma pa tofu, both served in generous portions. If I go with another person we typically split Szechuan Spicy Rabbit (w/bone) and/or Sliced Beef & Maw Szechuan Style. The rabbit is quite good, but is 'hacked' and contains small, sharp bones.

I, also, enjoy the ma pa tofu at LSC, but, in general, I have not met a version of ma pa tofu I haven't liked.

Enjoy,
Gary

Spring World
2109 S China Pl
Chicago, IL 60616
312-326-9966

Lao Sze Chuan
2172 S Archer
Chicago, IL 60616
312-455-0667
Multiple locations

Thanks Gary for mentioning the lunch deal at Spring World, it is indeed one of the better values around - $3. 95 for portions of two entrees (one veg, one meat) as well as soup.

Actually, I can't remember if the ma pao there had meat or not, as I ate it with a veg and we did specify we wanted veg - it is also in column b, which is the vegetable column, but as chinese veg often contain some meat, I am no longer certain.

By the way, we had a bitter melon, szechuan style of the regular menu at spring world that was very very nice.

by the way, here is a link to the dunlop's recipe I referred to earlier as well as a few other selections from the book

http://www.fuchsiadunlop.co.uk/

finally has anyone had the mao pao at sky foods - how does that compares to spring worlds and LSC's?

zim wrote:by the way, here is a link to the dunlop's recipe I referred to earlier as well as a few other selections from the book

http://www.fuchsiadunlop.co.uk/

finally has anyone had the mao pao at sky foods - how does that compares to spring worlds and LSC's?

Zim,

Thanks for the link to the Dunlop book, I think I'll make her pa tofu next week. I have Dunlop's Sichuan Cookery, which you recommended, but have not cooked from there as of yet. The ma pa tofu will be my first.

As Sky, I've been a few times, as recently as last week, but I have not had the ma pa tofu. I will say that what I have ordered at Sky has been good and comparable dishes to LSC have been in the good to very good range. I'll give the ma pa tofu a go next time I'm at Sky.


Enjoy,
Gary

G Wiv wrote:I like the Ma Pa Tofu at Spring World, especially on the combination lunch menu. Spring World's lunch menu, one of the best lunch deals in Chicago, offers one-from-column A, one-from-column B for $3.95 with tea, rice and, depending on the day, fair to good hot and sour soup.

I finally made it to this lunch special. What an amazing deal! I felt like I was stealing from them.

I tried the Ma Po and a Chicken and peppers dish. Both were very good. I liked the Ma Po very much, especially the visible black beans and the fresh scallion.

I also really enjoyed the Hot & Sour Soup, which has a much thinner broth than a normal H&S. It wasn't jam-packed with goodies, but I enjoyed the broth.

Thanks for pointing out this wonderful meal/deal.

Best,
EC

LSC was the only Chinese I hit on my trip. Chinese isn't one of my favorite cuisines for some reason. But usually when I like a place or a dish, it's because it's Sichuan (here, my eating companion would add, read: spicy meat).

We got the rabbit* with bone hot pot and the boil beef in spicy sauce. The rabbit* hot pot was just okay. But the boiled beef was quite good. My friend liked it even better than me. In fact, I think he loved it and would have married it, if he weren't afraid that John Ashcroft would insist that ONE MAN, ONE FIERY SICHUAN DISH, did not a marriage make. He was full and knew we'd be eating a tasting menu at Chilpancingo later, but still kept on eating.

Here's are a couple pics:





[* Edit: replaced duck with rabbit. I need more sleep.]

extramsg wrote:We got the duck with bone hot pot and the boil beef in spicy sauce. The duck hot pot was just okay. But the boiled beef was quite good. My friend liked it even better than me. In fact, I think he loved it and would have married it, if he weren't afraid that John Ashcroft would insist that ONE MAN, ONE FIERY SICHUAN DISH, did not a marriage make. He was full and knew we'd be eating a tasting menu at Chilpancingo later, but still kept on eating.

Here's are a couple pics:

Extramsg,

Oh man, this is really unkind, I don't think LSC opens until at least 11am and your pic of boil beef in spicy sauce has me panting like one of Pavlov's puppies.

I just looked at your other pics as well, the Thai Grocery shots are excellent. I'm a bit surprised at your tepid reaction to Spoon, I was there last week and it was as good, if not better than always. Specifically regarding pork neck larb, dry? I've had pork neck larb at Spoon any number of times and it has always been juicy, a bit fatty and flavorful, with a slightly chewy texture I simply adore.

Truth be told, I have a sneaking suspicion that that Spoon's, and most places around town, pork neck is actually pork shoulder, but I love it anyway. As far as spicy/hot goes, Spoon will most certainly amp up the level to volcanic if asked, but, and in my experience this is true for most, if not all, Thai places, for regulars they know will not run from the restaurant screaming in anguish.

It sounds as if you hit Spoon on the rare off day. I imagine every place has an off day now and then, but I've yet to encounter one at Spoon.

Enjoy,
Gary

btw, I put duck (must have been an unconscious desire). That should have been "rabbit".

As for Spoon: It's certainly possible it was an off-day. It's always dicey basing an opinion on one visit. You guys do seem to have a lot more problems with Thai restaurants treating customers equally out there. That's usually reserved for Chinese restaurants here in Portland. But then again, your Thai restaurants have a lot more variety for those in the know.

am i the only person who doesn't like the spicy boiled beef? I've had it twice, thinking i have to give it another chance after the first disastrous try...

the beef wasn't tender, the boiled soup had tasted like a buncha peppers tossed into dishwashing water. and the 1" thick layer of oil on top? don't get me wrong, i love LSC, it's one of the few restauarants i eat at in chinatown, but that ONE dish...

Interesting. I thought the rabbit hot pot had no depth. But the thing I liked about the beef was that it did have depth. I still didn't absolutely love it like my friend, but I chalk that up to the fact that Chinese food, of any sort, rarely gets me excited.

Like GWiv, I too was mesmerized by your pics so I made up a reason to go to the Downers Grove office today just so I could go to LSC for lunch

I thought about trying something new but as almost always happens, I ended up with the fish filet in spicy szechwan sauce. Its just too good! At just over 6 bucks for soup egg roll and a very healthy portion of food, it is also an amazing deal.

Am I the only person who also eats the lettuce? I am not usually a fan of it but I find that its' "watery" taste actuially goes really well with the sauce if that makes sense. Not watered down but a distinct taste of water when you bite into the lettuce that contrasts with the oil and sauce.

I do like the boiled beef in sauce, I prefer the pork but both are good. I find that eating at LSC makes me think about how the food is traditionally meant to be eaten, with rice as the main ingredient and the meat as a flavoring addition. I find that when I approach it this way, the oil fades as I am simply not pouring it over the rice and making a mush out of it, what clings to the food feels like the right amount. I leave the rest in the bowl.

Octarine wrote:I find that eating at LSC makes me think about how the food is traditionally meant to be eaten, with rice as the main ingredient and the meat as a flavoring addition.

Hi there,

Just wanted to chime in and clarify a bit about the rice. Actually, if you're talking about how Chinese eat "traditionally," then the rice usually comes at the end of the meal, because it's considered a "filler." It shouldn't be the main ingredient, as it would leave less tummy room for all the other tasty dishes on the table. In fact, in China, sometimes you have to specifically ask for the rice or they don't give it to you.

Personally, I love eating rice--and usually a lot of it--with the rest of the dishes, but I just wanted to clarify that traditionally, and despite conventional belief, it comes second to the other courses.

Janet C. wrote:Just wanted to chime in and clarify a bit about the rice. Actually, if you're talking about how Chinese eat "traditionally," then the rice usually comes at the end of the meal, because it's considered a "filler."

let's clarify the clarification above because blanket statement like that are ... well.. dangerous? If I don't get served rice along w/ the first entree at home or at a restaurant , expect a tantrum from me (and my father, and my grandparents). The word "traditionally" here is somewhat akin to "authenticity".

In fact, in China, sometimes you have to specifically ask for the rice or they don't give it to you.

completely depending on 1) where you are in China 2) what you're eating in China 3) if you count Taiwan as China. Northerners (Beijing/Shenyang/Harbin, etc.) historically aren't big fans of rice for obvious reasons, but when in Hunan/Szechuan, rice is served alongside the meal. of course, as you know, no one expects rice to be served @ dimsum, or in a noodle house, etc.

This actually reminds me of a hilarious conversation my husband and I overheard about a month ago during a late evening dinner at LTH. Two (white American) men were sitting at the table next to us, and one was taking the position of being the "China expert" (he actually used those words) and, in one particularly memorable exchange that began with, "China? China's big...", he went on to say, "See, the thing about Chinese food is that you're really just supposed to eat the rice. The actual food is just for flavor -- that's why it's so full of flavor. What you have to do is just pack your head with flavor, just, you know, cram it in there, get it all full, and then eat the rice, and you've got it. "

My husband and I were barely able to contain ourselves. Never again will we eat Chinese food without reminding each other that we must first pack our heads with flavor.

I agree with TonyC - I lived in Beijing, and rice was an accopaniment, but not really the focal point of any meal. As I understand it, that's partially due to the fact that northern Chinese cooking uses more wheat/bread-based dishes (baozi, etc) than the south. It's definitely a geographical culinary difference, although I also agree that there would have been revolt had the father of the Chinese family I lived with not gotten his zhou (jook) for breakfast and his rice for every other meal.