Bill wrote:Feeding the employees one product and pushing out another is, in a way, dishonest

Bill,

Not dishonest in the least, staff meals, as has been pointed out, are common in all types and varieties of restaurants. For example, Evil Ronnie, executive chef in an extremely busy upscale Chicago kitchen, has raved about one of his line cooks posole to the point where I plan on wangling an invite to staff meal.

Far as the small off-set outside of Smoque I snapped a picture of....I peeked inside and it looks, if not unused, at the very least, seldom used. If that is the only device Smoque is using to feed the staff the staff is going hungry.

As an aside, I saw Smoque on Diners, Drive Ins and Dives and thought they came off particularly well. I predict an upsurge in an already busy BBQ enterprise.

Enjoy,
Gary

Call me a BBQ snob but it was ok.. The rib were a preheat and dry, pulled pork seem more of a NC style (lite sprice rub or none)with a chicago twist (pretty good taste). We found the brisket to be the best item on the menu with good texture and some smoke flavor..
I'm not fond of BBQ made in a electric oven and perfer the traditional way. With real wood and real fire, just look for the smoke ring it will tell the whole story..

Smoque's food is prepared by wood fire.

The electric, commercial smoker they do have just regulates when the fire needs to be stoked. Cheating? in a roundabout way, kinda. But - when it comes down to serving hundreds of customers every single day - following every BBQ "rule" in the book seems to be tough at a commercial level.

I've had mediocre meals at every BBQ place - just the nature of the method of cooking. However, smoque does use genuine wood fire to slow cook their food.

Here we go again. Did someone ring the bell for the next round and I missed it?

eatchicago wrote:Here we go again. Did someone ring the bell for the next round and I missed it?

Nope, not if facts count it hasn't.

bronco wrote: With real wood and real fire, just look for the smoke ring it will tell the whole story..

Smoque's meats have a smoke ring, in fact the Southern Pride smoker they use tends to accentuate smoke ring as the convection fan in the rotisserie can pull in ash from the smoke box. Smoke ring has to do with temperature of the meat* and the presence of ash in the smoke. Also, importantly, smoke ring is not the same as smoke flavor.

djenks wrote:Smoque's food is prepared by wood fire.

The electric, commercial smoker they do have just regulates when the fire needs to be stoked.

Smoque's Southern Pride rotisserie cooker uses wood in the smoke box to impart smoke flavor, not as a main heat source.

Enjoy,
Gary

*Smoke ring stops forming when the meat reaches 140°

i must've misunderstood barry when i sat down with him and talked about his set up.

I was under the impression from our converstation that his electric smoker acted as more of a stoker and fire regulator - with the heat source coming from the wood combustion - but that must've been where the misunderstanding was.

We do also of traveling down south and also hit many BBQ joints.. I hate to say we hit 5 in one day (not a good sleep night ). I would have to say it's 40/60 mix between "commerical 40%" and real wood fire 60% that we found. It seems like the small joints use old traditional methods (Oil tanks ,drums or some other homemade smoker HA HA HA). They also had the best "We all " thought.
I have buddies with the Southern Pride smoker and it does its job. Its ok but it's no fire/smoke PIT... To me a smoke ring will tell you how long the meat was cooked,temp and the amount of smoke that was used. The smoke ring has a highlighted flavor,texture and smell of the wood used, sweet,bitter or sour.. True the SPS does use wood but very little. They get away with it by keeping the smoke trapped in the chamber.. Were's the fire in it?? Yes it has a smoke taste and a accented smoke ring but how long does it take to get to 140 degrees.. The commerical smokers take half the time to cook the meat of choice. Yes, they are more efficient but that cuts down time letting the fat/smoke slowly run thru the meat and its connective tissues. Low and Slow
To me BBQ is like music , many styles and ways of doing BBQ . None are really bad ways of doing BBQ but just the taste of the person enjoying it..
Didn't want to beat a dead horse...
It's time for a road trip to Memphis in May or the Jack Daniels World Championship Barbecue Contest ... Till then I'll use old school methods and fire up the smoker this weekend. Hummm butts,brisket, or ribs???
I would and will go back to Smoque and enjoy the BBQ it was pretty good.
Thanks

G Wiv wrote:

eatchicago wrote:Here we go again. Did someone ring the bell for the next round and I missed it?

Nope, not if facts count it hasn't.

bronco wrote: With real wood and real fire, just look for the smoke ring it will tell the whole story..

Smoque's meats have a smoke ring, in fact the Southern Pride smoker they use tends to accentuate smoke ring as the convection fan in the rotisserie can pull in ash from the smoke box. Smoke ring has to do with temperature of the meat* and the presence of ash in the smoke. Also, importantly, smoke ring is not the same as smoke flavor.

djenks wrote:Smoque's food is prepared by wood fire.

The electric, commercial smoker they do have just regulates when the fire needs to be stoked.

Smoque's Southern Pride rotisserie cooker uses wood in the smoke box to impart smoke flavor, not as a main heat source.

Enjoy,
Gary

*Smoke ring stops forming when the meat reaches 140°

Binko wrote:Me and the sweetheart went to Smoque tonight at about 4:30 p.m. after stocking up on frozen pierogis for the holidays at Alexandra's. The place was empty when we got there, but it was kind of a between-meals time, so I wasn't surprised.
[...]

Unfortunately, the brisket (chopped) that I had must have been like stevez's. It was flavorful, but very dry, and disappointing. But like it has been said, timing is everything, and it seems from these posts that the brisket is the best that Smoque has to offer, so I'll have to try it again some time.

Wow. What a difference a year makes. Today, same sweetie and I went to Smoque after popping into Alexandra's for pierogi. It's a pre-holiday ritual, it seems. I always give a restaurant a second chance, and I know a year ago I would not have gone out of my way to go to Smoque. I'm so glad I did give it a second chance.

Today was the first time I have ever, in my life, had a brisket that stood out as a truly exceptional meal. I ordered the sliced brisket sandwich and I did not get the dry, disappointing brisket of last year. It was succulent, moist, soft yet holding its shape and not stringy in the least. Everything was perfect about the sandwich. I forgot to ask for sauce on the side but, no matter, they were very conservative with their saucing. Pretty much exactly as much as I like. The only thing is I tend to like my BBQ smokier, and I don't know how smokey brisket should be, but I would have liked it to be a little more so.

But, other than that, I now understand that this is the brisket y'all have been raving about for so long. I would now, definitely, make a special trip to Smoque for the brisket alone. I'm still not crazy about the ribs, but the brisket is worth it.

edit: One big difference between this year and last was the place was absolutely PACKED during lunchtime. Last time, I went at an off-hour between lunch and dinner, when almost nobody was there, even though I should have known better doing this at a BBQ joint.

Hi,

Just as I was about to open this thead, I noticed it is just over 100,000 views and 277 posts. All this conversaton about Smoque is well deserved.

Regards,

We drove my brother home to Rogers Park today (since he had bought a computer on Friday, hard for him to take the train) and made the trip to Smoque. I unsuccessfully campaigned for a Kuma's/Smoque twofer but my husband and brother don't read this board and so don't understand that two consecutive meals are not 'weird'. But, Husband had seen the "Diners, Drive-Ins and Dives" show featuring Smoque so was totally up for that.

We all went for the brisket, my husband and I got the chopped platter with beans and mac and cheese as our sides. My brother got the sliced platter with the same sides. I also got an add on of pulled pork; wanted St Louis ribs, but there was a sign that they wouldn't be available till after 2:30. Oh, that brisket! It was meltingly good! The chopped brisket was the better choice, I thought..although my brother was definitely happy with the sliced. For me, I hardly needed the sauce on the side; there was enough going on with the meat itself. We also loved the beans and slaw. I'm definitely not a mayo based slaw person. Especially when the mayo type slaw is in those tiny little microbits. It's like eating shredded paper. Smoque's vinegary, chunky slaw was perfect. I wasn't as crazy about the mac and cheese--it was a tad too soft and gloppy for me. Not that I left any of it, but.... Pretty good sweet tea to drink. (We came out from McHenry and while we waited for our number to be called, a very enthusiastic woman asked if it was our first time. It was also her first time and she had come from Waukegan. She was in line for a take home order of the brisket. )

Almost as good as the food was the deft way Barry handled a disgruntled customer. The guy ahead of us (with two kids) totally missed the sign saying "Order first and the host (ie, Barry) will seat you". As we got behind him in line, he was giving Barry an earful about not 'seeing' him when they walked in..I guess to get his seating arranged before ordering or something. Barry started to say something about the pretty obvious sign, thought better of it and just bent over backwards to placate the guy. The guy proceeded to ask questions about childrens' meals (found on the REALLY obvious menu board), which Barry also patiently explained. After he ordered, Barry took the guy and his kids to one of the long communal tables and the guy naturally sat everyone in his party so no one else could sit at the end or close to them. (At this point, we were ready to ream the guy out ourselves.) Barry brought their order out for them and checked on them periodically. He went the extra mile--although I suspect this guy was the type that the extra mile was totally lost on him. But, it was impressive nonetheless on a busy Sunday afternoon.

Took my brother home via Irving Park where I amused myself (and probably annoyed everyone else) by excitedly pointing out Laschet's Inn as well as checking every Vienna Beef hot dog sign for tomatoes. After we dropped him off, went home starting on Devon, passed Khan's ("Look! They have great broasted chicken!" "Uh-huh") and ended up back on Milwaukee, where I scored a small victory in getting a side trip to Jerry's Garden Center (but defeat when I suggested a return to Super H Mart).

So, not only did I get some great barbecue (and I have enough for a brisket sandwich tonight), but we found a more enjoyable way than 90 or the Edens to get my brother home.

And I really need to get out more.

So this morning my kids flipped on the various pieces of the audio/video center (a capability I'm not entirely happy they've mastered themselves, and one certainly beyond many of their older relatives) and picked a show off the TiVo to watch. Fetch with Ruff Ruffman? Wishbone? CSI: Orlando? No, Diners, Dives and Drive-Ins, reciting their favorite lines about Smoque as they watched ("Carolina sauce, it's lahk a fahn wahn"). Yes, they are my sons.

Not surprising where they wanted to go for dinner tonight, and an interesting thing happened while there. We were wedged in deep where it wasn't easy to get out, and so Barry (who we had all been chatting with-- he listened very considerately to Liam's suggestion that he keep some extra briskets in a closet so he could pull them out when they run out) brought over our food, telling us that the baby backs had just come out of the smoker, no time in the holding pen at all. Seeing them, and more to the point smelling them, the people at the table next to us promptly switched part of their order to get the fresh ribs.

Well, not terribly surprisingly, these were the best ribs I've ever had at Smoque. In fact, I would say they are the best ribs I've had at Smoque by orders of magnitude. The usual ribs are tasty, well-handled restaurant barbecue, a good tooth to the meat, slightly gummy exterior from the holding device; you will always have compromises in this kind of serving situation versus making your own and serving right at the perfect moment.

In this case the gumminess was completely gone and what you had was the full robustness of hot, oozingly juicy pork trailing a cloud of smoke flavor. When he came back by to check on them, I simply let my eyes roll back into my head and made gurgling noises. I asked Barry if there was some way to get this experience whenever you came to the restaurant and he said "Call ahead." Because the Southern Pride rotates the meat, you can't stagger the cooking times; meat comes out on a schedule (brisket and pulled pork cook overnight, ribs come out a couple of times a day, after 3-hour cooks). If you call, you can find out the next time the ribs are expected to be done; be prepared to go early in case they're early and stand around in case they're late, but catch them right as they come off and taste how good a rib the Southern Pride can actually make in the right hands.

jersette wrote:I unsuccessfully campaigned for a Kuma's/Smoque twofer but my husband and brother don't read this board and so don't understand that two consecutive meals are not 'weird'.

Really this comment belongs in the You know you are an LTH'r when ... thread. I feel your pain having family that just doesn't get it.

Welcome to your tribe!

Regards,

I recently had the pleasure of eating at Smoque and I was very pleasantly surprised. The chopped brisket stole the show for me. I'll definitely return with my camera next time.

Wonderful fresh brisket, awesome breaded mac & cheese. Even the coleslaw is OK, and I hate coleslaw.

ok, i don't mean to be difficult because i really respect the people that post on this site, and your opinions (for the most part) seem to be dead on, but i just don't get this smoque love affair.

i've given smoque several chances, and have been disappointed or nonplussed everytime. the brisket (when they have it) is mediocre at best and their portions are embarassing comparitive to their prices.

i saw the drive-ins and dives segment and was left wondering, are restaurants solicited to appear on such shows? how do they come to feature a place like smoque?

If you think Smoque's portion:value ration is skewed, try the $8 pulled pork sandwich at Honey-1, or the brisket "sandwich" at Honky Tonk - the brisket is amazing, but since you pull it off the limp, tasteless roll, the meat itself doesn't seem to justify almost $9 without sides. I find Smoque's value very strong; I get the half-slab meal with sides, then add a portion of chopped brisket, and walk out very, very full.

krm61965 wrote:i've given smoque several chances, and have been disappointed or nonplussed everytime. the brisket (when they have it) is mediocre at best and their portions are embarassing comparitive to their prices.

Could you be more specific about what you don't like about the food? What places to do you like and what are their prices?

around here i've had the old standards carsons, gale street, etc. for a while i thought merle's in evanston was really good, but i havn't been there in years and i hear it's gone down hill.

recently i tried honey-1 and was somewhat impressed at least by the amount of food. it had a nice smoke even if it was a little dry.

i think i've just been spoiled by kc bbq. there's a place there called arthur bryants were $10 gets you a pile of the best sliced brisket or most succulent sliced pork between two pieces of wonder bread along with a side of fresh cut fries, and an ice cold boulevard draft. it's heaven i tell you. heaven!

don't get me wrong, i want to like smoque. i read these reviews, and i want to have that experience. it's close to my house and everything. i'll keep trying. i think it may all be in the timing

I don't think you'll find many folks here that will argue with you about the quality and value of an Arthur Bryant's experience. But, really, you have to consider overhead costs.

As to the value argument, Bryant's is definitely a bit off the beaten trail and occupies a building that has likely been paid for a number of years.

Smoque and Honey One are both centrally located in a substantially more expensive real estate market. They have to pass that cost on to their customers. I eat great barbeque buffets in South Carolina for six or seven bucks because there's no overhead to speak of at these places.

As for comparisons, its really not fair to compare Carson's or Gale Street to either Honey one or Smoque. Carson's and Gale Street serve a smokless product- the Chicago tavern rib as I like to call it. Honey One and Smoque sell real barbeque, smoked long over good wood, the likes of which you'll find in small towns in Arkansas and Texas (and Kansas City).

i hadn't really thought of the overhead scenario, good point.

i'm not giving up on smogue, as i said i'll keep trying.

thank you

YourPalWill wrote:As for comparisons, its really not fair to compare Carson's or Gale Street to either Honey one or Smoque. Carson's and Gale Street serve a smokless product- the Chicago tavern rib as I like to call it. Honey One and Smoque sell real barbeque, smoked long over good wood, the likes of which you'll find in small towns in Arkansas and Texas (and Kansas City).

Will,

I'd break each place into separate categories. Carson's, at the least the Ridge location, now closed, spun the ribs in a smoker similar to a Southern Pride for 2-hours there was a hunk of wood in a firebox for light smoke, not heat, that interacted with the meat. They'd hold, two by two, slather with sauce and finish on a grill as needed. 2-hours for baby back ribs with a finish on a hot grill yields Carson's characteristic 'chewy' rib. Gale Street is, as you say, a straight-up tavern rib, what I call Chicago Style Pork Ribs, baked in an oven, fall off the bone, "all about the sauce boss"

I would not put Smoque and Honey 1 in the same BBQ category, Smoque uses, to great effect, a Southern Pride yielding what I have taken to calling City BBQ, Honey 1 cooks direct with wood in a Chicago Style Aquarium smoker yielding excellent quality Southern BBQ.

Enjoy,
Gary

Gary -

Good insight on Carson's. That's how I remember the Lombard location as well.

If Smoque and Honey 1 are not in the same category, then where are Uncle John's and Lem's? I'd put Honey 1 with UJ, but then Lem's, which is cooked "hot and direct" and has a completely different texture than the two others, seems to need its own category. And then what do we do with Smoke Daddy, Uncle Bub's, Famous Dave's, Robinson's, and Ribs 'n Bibs (not a particular fan of the last four, but am just trying to present a little taxonomy challenge here). If you think categorization is useful, perhaps we can make a complete list and start a new thread.

Still waiting for your take on Honky Tonk; let me know when and if you'll be in that hood and I'll be happy to join you.

Santander wrote:Gary -

Good insight on Carson's. That's how I remember the Lombard location as well.

If Smoque and Honey 1 are not in the same category, then where are Uncle John's and Lem's? I'd put Honey 1 with UJ, but then Lem's, which is cooked "hot and direct" and has a completely different texture than the two others, seems to need its own category.

I'd say Lems is still in the Honey 1, UJ's style of things. From my experience, and the master can correct me, one of the defining characteristics of Chicago BBQ and the aquarium smoker is that it tends to run hotter and faster than traditional southern barbecue. I personally don't see that much stylistic difference between Lem's, Uncle John's, and Barbara Ann's. The tips I get at UJ's definitely taste like they're cooked over a hotter fire, if not as hot and fast as Lem's.

To me, my main distinction in Chicago is between places that have and actually use the aquarium smokers, and the ones that don't.

G Wiv wrote:I would not put Smoque and Honey 1 in the same BBQ category, Smoque uses, to great effect, a Southern Pride yielding what I have taken to calling City BBQ, Honey 1 cooks direct with wood in a Chicago Style Aquarium smoker yielding excellent quality Southern BBQ.

Enjoy,
Gary

Isn't it ironic that the Southern Pride yields City BBQ, and the Chicago Style Aquarium smoker gives us Southern BBQ?

Yes.

Tonight we went to Smoque for our first time. It was very good. Our standard for barbecue has always been Carson's, which we still visit occasionally and still enjoy. The ribs at Smoque are similar to Carson's, in that they are both slow cooked and chewy, and both are very meaty without much fat, but different, in that Smoque's ribs have a strong smoke flavor but not much sauce flavor, whereas Carson's have more taste from basting with sauce rather than smoke flavor. We split on which one we liked better; in any case, we both like the ribs at both places.

Some of the other items were very different between the two places. The barbecue sauce is different; Carson's has more of a conventional barbecue sauce, which I prefer, whereas Smoque's sauce is distinctly more vinegary in taste. I did not at all like the cole slaw at Smoque, which is little more than cabbage in vinegar, whereas Carson's has the best cole slaw in the entire Chicago area. Smoque has a few items that Carson's doesn't - the brisket (tender and quite good, although not the ethereal experience some describe) and the mac and cheese (insufficiently hot, and okay but again nothing unusual) - and of course Carson's has a complete steakhouse menu in addition to barbecue chicken and salmon. Presumably, you go to both places with the advance expectation that at Carson's you are served by waiters in a white tablecloth atmosphere, whereas Smoque's atmosphere is not all that different from a fast food place (and a crowded one, at that). Prices are not significantly different between the two; at Smoque, a full slab of baby backs with slaw and two sides is $20.95, whereas at Carson's, a full slab with rolls and slaw and choice of potato is $21.25.

In all likelihood we will keep visiting both Carson's and Smoque, and enjoying what each has to offer.

nsxtasy wrote:The ribs at Smoque are similar to Carson's,

Huh?

nsxtasy wrote:
The ribs at Smoque are similar to Carson's,


Huh?

Yeah, that was a head-scratcher for me, too. Of course, it's also a head-scratcher as to why anyone bothers with Carson's at all. Every time that I've been dragged there, the food has been vile.

Re: Smoque: I visited Saturday afternoon, and had myself a pulled pork sandwich, to which I added the coleslaw. Delicious. I loved the crunchiness of the slaw, and its tang. The BBQ beans were not unlike the wonderful beans I remember at the late lamented NN Smokehouse, though with firmer onions, and a bit less sweetness. In an interesting coincidence, I noted that the BBQ edition of "Diners, Drive-Ins, and Dives" that included Smoque was featured on the Food Network on Sunday night, so I got to find out exactly how those fine beans are constructed. Also, both the show and the beans persuaded me to try the brisket the next time I'm in. I haven't had smoked brisket in a very long time, and very far away from here...

nsxtasy wrote:The ribs at Smoque are similar to Carson's,

stevez wrote:Huh?

I explained exactly what I meant, in the part of the sentence that you deleted in your quote:

nsxtasy wrote:The ribs at Smoque are similar to Carson's, in that they are both slow cooked and chewy, and both are very meaty without much fat, but different, in that Smoque's ribs have a strong smoke flavor but not much sauce flavor, whereas Carson's have more taste from basting with sauce rather than smoke flavor. We split on which one we liked better; in any case, we both like the ribs at both places.

I think the ribs at Carson's are absolutely delicious - very, very good indeed, nice and meaty, and their barbecue sauce is far better than Smoque's IMHO. Also, the sides at Carson's are way better than the mediocre ones at Smoque. The cole slaw at Carson's is superb, the best cole slaw I have had in Chicagoland. I really hated the cole slaw at Smoque, and didn't even bother eating more than a couple of bites; it's the most disgusting food I've had since my last trip to Dave's Italian Kitchen. But if you like raw, hard pieces of cabbage drenched in dishwater, you might like it. I had the beans, too, and thought they were okay, but (as supported by the fact that I forgot to mention them) they were eminently forgettable. The fries at Smoque were incredibly greasy, whereas the twice-baked potatos at Carson's are excellent. If you go to Smoque, go for the barbecue, not for their undistinguished sides.

One other plus for Smoque: You can order taste-sized portions of the brisket or ribs, for $3-4, as an addition to whatever else you happen to be getting, so you can try multiple items that way.

LOL -
It HAS been a few months since Mt. Saint Barbecue last erupted....