Peccati Culinarii: Over- and Misused Ingredients

Peccati Culinarii
Over- and Misused Ingredients in Italianoid Cooking

Last summer I had intended to post a short list of the most overused or misused ingredients in the American approach to Italian food. The project was delayed by our moving home and then the notes vanished somewhere in my hard-drive, stored in a forgotten file. Today's Tribune article about Marcella Hazan and more specifically the following quote from her, reminded me of the long delayed list:

The unbalanced use of garlic is the single greatest cause of failure in would-be Italian cooking.

I'm very happy to see that not only Mario Batali (see link here) but now also Marcella Hazan agree with me. ( )


Of course, one should eat what one wishes in the way that one finds most pleasing. The following remarks are intended only to be taken as a critique of general tendencies in the making of Italianate food in this country from the standpoint of the traditionally oriented Italian cook.

1. Garlic. I've already written about this issue in a number of places and will just state here that Italians, both in the north and in the south, use garlic far less often and in far less prominent ways than most people outside of Italy think.

2. Basil. Basil is a sublime herb but it is used far too promiscuously by folks here. The overuse of the herb extends to the overuse of pesto, which when properly made is quite delicious but not something that should be indiscriminately added to other dishes. In the article about Hazan mentioned above, she also denounces the overuse of rosemary and she is right that this herb is also becoming an excessively favoured 'Italianoid' touch.

3. Tomato. The profligate use of tomato sauce has long been regarded as a feature of Italian-American cooking and this vice continues to have its victims. The overuse is again both with regard to the frequency of use and the amount used in specific dishes.

4. Grated cheese and in particular parmigiano reggiano. For Italians, there are many pasta recipes onto which it would be considered inappropriate to grate cheese, not because of any strange taboos but rather on aesthetic grounds. Beyond that, there are also many recipes in which a grating cheese is called for but parmigiano is not the appropriate one. Romano and in recent years asiago and ricotta salata have become more widely known and used and that's a positive development, and yet in certain Italianoid styles here they are both mis- and, of course, overused.

5. Balsamic vinegar. Balsamic vinegar seems to have become the only vinegar that one should use in Italian cookery in the minds of some people. Indeed, I have been in Italian stores where one could choose from an astounding array of balsamic vinegars and couldn't find a single bottle of good old red wine vinegar. Again, balsamic vinegar is wonderful, but it has specific applications and used in the wrong context it can offend.

The following item is not of the same basic nature as the ones listed above but it is a pet peeve of mine. To make a more general point related to the following item, I think one could quite legitimately say that -- from a traditional Italian point of view -- many people in this country (or generally outside of Italy) often mismatch pasta shapes and sauces. Be that as it may:

6. Angel hair. Angel hair should not be used for pasta asciutta preparations, where it almost inevitably is overcooked and from a textural standpoint interacts poorly with most condiments. Angel hair is best used in soups or other 'brothy' contexts.

Again, these points of criticism are made from a very specific standpoint: in effect, there is an implied assumption that those who make the above listed 'mistakes' are trying but failing to make dishes as closely as possible to the traditional Italian way. That assumption cannot apply universally and I recognise the fact that there are, for example, people who just like to use lots of garlic and have no interest in attempting to make a dish according to a traditional recipe. May they do so happily and without guilt. On the other hand, there are also people who have been to Italy and would like to be able to approximate at home what they ate over there and for them it is, I believe, worthwhile to call attention to the ways in which Italianoid or -- as Ms. Hazan says -- "would-be Italian" cooking generally differs from the traditional approach.

Antonius

Post-site-move character problems fixed.

A,

I must plead guilty on almost all counts, except for the use of angel hair, which I have never liked as much as regular old spaghetti noodles, but which I find that my daughters (especially when young) much preferred (probably because it's petite and, of course, has heavenly connotations).

Of all the cited offenses, the overuse of garlic is the most common in my house. I just love the stuff, and it takes some conscious constraint to remember that it can easily overpower other flavors and imbalance the meal. Unfortunately, like an alcoholic who doesn't feel he's had a drink until he can't walk, I hardly feel I've had a plate of macaroni if I don't get that cool garlic burn that lasts for hours after a meal.

David "Nothing if Not Italianoid" Hammond

No no. It's not "garlic" it's "gaaaaaaaaaaaahlick".

If we can't trust emeril to give us authentic italian recipes, who can we trust?

and I, too, hate angel hair used in place of spaghetti. It's truly impossible to cook properly, and it always ends up with a texture like mush.

Next, Antonius, how about a list of the ingredients and techniques that are far more prevalent in real italian cooking than in most american renditions. I'd be curious to see what garlic, basil, tomatoes, and parmigiano reggiano are replacing.

I suspect baccala would be high on the list.

-ed

David Hammond wrote:I must plead guilty on almost all counts, except for the use of angel hair...

Bless me, brother, for I too have sinned... I have been known to transgress on some of the above counts, including with regard to the use of garlic. But then, there is nothing wrong nor even un-Italian with making a dish that really features garlic. Indeed, there are a number of recipes of a traditional sort from all over Italy that do just that. I think the problem -- insofar as one can use that word here -- is one of awareness. For example, in the recent discussion of alla matriciana I argued in favour of the traditional approach that shuns garlic for this dish. The point being not that one shouldn't eat maccheroni with guanciale and garlic but that (a) one should at least once try the traditional way (and reject it as unsatisfying if one wishes) and (b) should apply the name alla matriciana only to versions that fall within the traditional range of acceptable variation for the dish, which doesn't include garlic.

Where I most often transgress is in the application of grated cheese on dishes which include red chile and which for many Italians are not to be adorned in a caseous fashion. Of course, there are traditional recipes that include both chile and cheese and so I don't feel too barbarous in putting some incanestrato atop a bowl of maccheroni with a spicy element. After all, it's my maccheroni!

What I find most irritating are the people who claim to have knowledge of Italian cuisine and then teach people things that are just plain wrong. Emeril is perhaps the greatest or at least most visible and well-known chef to do this, with his shows on the cuisine of X which just touch on some obvious, even stereotypical, stuff and then degenerate into the 'kick-it-up-a-notch' style for which he is so famous.

Antonius

Post-site-move character problems fixed.

Antonius wrote:What I find most irritating are the people who claim to have knowledge of Italian cuisine and then teach people things that are just plain wrong. Emeril is perhaps the greatest or at least most visible and well-known chef to do this, with his shows on the cuisine of X which just touch on some obvious, even stereotypical, stuff and then degenerate into the 'kick-it-up-a-notch' style for which he is so famous.

Antonius

The one thing that I've seen Emeril do (a lot), that is notoriously bad in "real" Italian cooking, is add oil to the pasta water.

Antonius, as you note, a lot of this segues into, the, well if I want to do it, I can do it argument. I am very close with someone who loves to wasabi up her, (I mean their) sushi, and she (I mean this person) is notorious for dunnking the rice in the soya sauce. I always tell her (I mean this person) that one is only suppose to allow the fish to grace the condiment. She (I mean this person) cares not. So, yes there is a fine line between upholding traditions and maritial bliss, (I mean respecting other people's tastes).

Rob

Antonius,

Not that I am an expert, but I would whole heartedly agree with you on all counts. In regards to #6 (angel hair), I know that you are concentrating on ingredients, but I have a couple of comments about "our" technique too. I would say that we often times overcook and oversauce our pasta (of all kinds). We also fail to properly combine our pasta and sauce together to finish the dish. And finally we eat gargantuan portions (which I am certainly guilty of) instead of serving it as a course, which I suppose is something that we learned to do as children, when our mom's served us our (beloved) spaghetti and meatballs for supper.

Kristina

P.S. Another misused/overused/misrepresented menu item: Crostini or Bruschetta. Seems like anything besides butter slapped on a some bread is considered a crostini of some sort.

gleam wrote:Next, Antonius, how about a list of the ingredients and techniques that are far more prevalent in real italian cooking than in most american renditions. I'd be curious to see what garlic, basil, tomatoes, and parmigiano reggiano are replacing.

I suspect baccala would be high on the list.

Ed:

Here are some notes in response to your request:

1. Garlic. Obviously Italians do use garlic a lot and I can certainly remember well a time when most Americans of northern European ancestry didn't use it and in many cases imagined it to be an offensive thing that only nasty sorts of people would eat (nota bene: the same was true in Northern Europe and I've had first hand experiences with that in several countries). Things have obviously changed a great deal and garlic has become a commonplace. But as much as it was shunned, I think now it is often overused, at least in certain contexts.

In Italy, a very common way of using garlic is to fry it gently in olive oil (or butter) and then discard it, leaving just a hint of garlic flavour.

As I've mentioned elsewhere, there is a strong tendency to use only garlic or onion in a tomato sauce in a good chunk of Italy. Of course, there are recipes that use both together but for a simple sauce to dress pasta, I like the simple either/or approach, for the two simple sauces come out remarkably different.

2. Parmigiano. I remember Jeff Smith always suggested for any and all pasta dishes he discussed that you could use "parmigiano or romano", as if they are interchangeable. Other t.v. chefs have been known to do likewise.

There certainly are places where -- again, from a traditional sort of perspective -- either would be fine and it is then a question of personal preference or mood as to which of the two one uses. But for me, I don't think parmigiano works well in contexts where it has to compete with other, more assertive flavours (e.g., red chile, massive amounts of black pepper, olives and capers, etc.). In such contexts, sometimes no cheese should be used or else one that has a little more punch, e.g., romano or incanestrato. On the other hand, in contexts where the sauce is quite delicate or unassertive, parmigiano can really shine and elevate the dish to a much higher level.

3. Anchovies. Anchovies are extremely underused in most American approaches to Italian cooking. They are used extensively in all parts of Italy as the means of salting a dish and adding a little hint of flavour and they are also used as a featured element in lots of dishes (nothing is better than spaghetti con le alici if it is prepared properly or a pizza dressed with just a touch of tomato and pieces of anchovy).

4. Bread crumbs. In Italy, toasted or briefly fried bread crumbs are used widely to garnish finished pasta dishes, something that is largely unknown in this country.

5. Tomato. As someone who was raised eating Southern Italian food four or five days a week throughout my childhood, I have a deep and abiding love of tomatoes and tomato sauces. But having said that, in a family where pasta is eaten four or five or more times a week, it was and is extremely rare for me to eat pasta with any manner of tomato sauce more than twice in a week and most weeks it's only once. There are countless recipes without tomato for pasta with vegetables, pasta in soup, pasta with oil and garlic, with butter, etc. etc. As much as tomato sauce is central to southern Italian cooking, it is used in far greater moderation than one would gather from the American approach to Italian food.

Anyway, there's more to say -- for example, about herbs and spices -- but that's a start.

Antonius

Post-site-move character problems fixed.

Antonius, indubbiamente siamo d'accordo, but permit me to add my pet culinary peeve: the deluge of sauce many 'mericani appear to believe is appropriate for pasta. And in that belief they are fully abetted by restaurants. I say, let the pasta speak for itself (pasta ipsa loquitur?). Also, in re Sig. Batali, clicca qui per "l'inganno Batali", and note that Chef 'O Serpe commits a peccato himself, though I prefer to believe it's a venial one given my own maculate past.

Can we possibly pass over in silence the infamia of grating cheese over linguine alle vongole? We are all diminished whenever that crime against food occurs.

Rob, I sin pretty consistently with respect to sushi. I've been travelling to Japan for twenty years and admire the variety, subtlety and conception of the food, but I cannot shake the belief that sushi is really just a carrier for the wasabi.... Well, except for anago or unagi, that is, which represent the apotheosis of sushi.

Call me Dr. Radish, I guess.

Antonius wrote:3. Tomato. The profligate use of tomato sauce has long been regarded as a feature of Italian-American cooking and this vice continues to have its victims. The overuse is again both with regard to the frequency of use and the amount used in specific dishes.

I would say that the tomato is overused period. Why do we demand tomatoes this time of year, when they are usually so bland and tasteless? While there is taste created in making a tomato-based sauce in January, eating fresh tomatoes this time of year just leaves you with a bland taste that dulls what should be the joyous return of fresh tomatoes in the summer.

Rich4 wrote:

Antonius wrote:3. Tomato. The profligate use of tomato sauce has long been regarded as a feature of Italian-American cooking and this vice continues to have its victims. The overuse is again both with regard to the frequency of use and the amount used in specific dishes.

I would say that the tomato is overused period. Why do we demand tomatoes this time of year, when they are usually so bland and tasteless? While there is taste created in making a tomato-based sauce in January, eating fresh tomatoes this time of year just leaves you with a bland taste that dulls what should be the joyous return of fresh tomatoes in the summer.

I do not think the sinners when it comes to tomatoes are Italian places (except in the case of January insalata caprese ). After all, one can make good gravy with canned tomatoes. On the other hand...

Why do nearly every Mexican, Indian/Pakistani, Greek, Thai, Vietamese and Middle-Eastern restaurant insist on offering a tomato slice (or two) with their meals, no matter how desperate such tomato is.

Rob

Vital Information wrote:Why do nearly every Mexican, Indian/Pakistani, Greek, Thai, Vietamese and Middle-Eastern restaurant insist on offering a tomato slice (or two) with their meals, no matter how desperate such tomato is.

1. Because people expect them (if I have a Green Papaya Salad in February, I have to admit: I want to see red).

2. Because tomatoes provide good color contrast.

3. Because tomatoes are in the SOP recipe, and many chefs-for-hire may be loathe to "improvise."

Hammond

Oops, I Ctl-Ved the wrong link. Ms Ray's sins are all cardinal and cannot, of course, be blamed on Sig. Batali. But, here's Monzu Batali's food peccadiglio. He advocates using garlic in the 'matriciana and onion in the tomato sauce.

I'm sure I'm not well versed enough in "traditional" ital. cuisine to really comment. I am also steeped in peccato aglio. I grew up in a very 60s Craig Claiborne household. The cooking was very good, but very refined and there warn't no garlic in it. When I discovered garlic, I went nuts. Like a college kid in Amsterdam, if you get my drift. I have only recently been able to hold back and let other subtler flavors shine forth from time to time.

But here are my candidates for overuse/misues:

How has the now ubiquitous "sun-dried tomato" escaped scrutiny thus far in the thread? When I first tasted these back in the 70s, they were incredibly expensive but, like real balsamic, unbelievably intense. Almost like a genetic cross between tomato and anchovy. One didn't need any encouragement to use them sparingly.

Now, they're everywhere and also leathery and flavorless, as often as not. (Just as supermarket balsamic is really just overpriced coke syrup.)
I used to get a wonderful Chianti vinegar from Convito Italiano with the label Club du Faison. It seems to have disappeared.

I would add artichoke hearts to the overused list. Especially when they are commercially processed and have a horribly metallic, commercial chloride smell and flavor attached, obliterating the delicate flavor of actual artichoke.

There was also the Great Prosciutto Epidemic of the 80s, now somewhat abated. It was in cream sauces, it was on pizza, it was everywhere. Worse it was thickly sliced. Worse still, it was domestic, because the real stuff was not allowed to be imported. Salty and ghastly as well as overused. Oddly, just when the laws changed to allow importation of real San Daniele, the tide seemed to turn. One doesn't see so much of it now.

Misuse is an even broader category. People and mid-priced restaurant chains think that anything "Italian" is good with anything else "Italian." So one sees phrases like, "creamy alfredo carbonara sauce" on menus. Gevalt.

Under miscellaneous: Vodka cream sauce. I just don't get it. Do Italians really make this? Why? Is there an actual flavor component to the vodka addition once the alcohol has cooked out? Can you really taste it under the cream?

Choey wrote:Under miscellaneous: Vodka cream sauce. I just don't get it. Do Italians really make this? Why? Is there an actual flavor component to the vodka addition once the alcohol has cooked out? Can you really taste it under the cream?

I don't know the Italian angle to this, though I have recently quoted in another post the food science angle.

Shirley Corriher, who wrote Cookwise: The Hows and Whys of Successful Cooking, found to taste something fully you need these elements present: water, fat and alcohol:

A Cook's tips for flavorful low-fat food by Shirley Corriher wrote:If you don't have a little fat in a dish to dissolve and carry fat-soluble flavors, they are lost. Some flavor components dissolve in water and some in fat. If we totally eliminate fat, we lose all these fat-soluble flavors. You might have noticed that some fat-free food is truly bland.

Then there is the dry sherry. Remember that some flavors dissolve in water and some in fat. Alcohol dissolves both fat and water and some things that don't dissolve in either fat or water. Patricia Wells, the famous Paris restaurant critic, once asked me why a little vodka makes such a difference in the taste of a tomato sauce. Vodka doesn't have much taste, and the sauce was boiled for 20 minutes after the vodka was added, so a lot of it boiled off. There must be a flavor component in tomatoes that dissolves in alcohol. Once the alcohol has dissolved the flavor and pulled it out into the sauce, it doesn't matter what happens to the alcohol; it has done its job.

So it all works together.

mrbarolo wrote:Vodka cream sauce. I just don't get it.

Mr. B,

Guilty as charged as I enjoy the occasional penne with vodka, cream and smoked salmon. Costo carries 1-1/2 lb packs of smoked salmon and right about the 4th lox and bagel, scrambled egg with smoked salmon or salmon wrapped around egg salad (made with creme fresh) hors d'oeuvre I'm looking for alternatives.

Here's the recipe I use, not my original recipe, though I have adapted from the original. No attribution as I no longer remember where it came from. Maybe rec.food.recipes 7-8 years ago, possibly an old cookbook.

Please note it contains all three 'elements' C2 mentioned, water/fat/alcohol.

Enjoy,
Gary
==

Penne with Vodka and Smoked Salmon

12 ounces penne pasta
2 tablespoons olive oil
1 whole shallot -- thinly sliced
4 whole Roma tomatoes -- seeded and rough chopped
2/3 cup whipping cream
pinch ground nutmeg
2 tablespoons fresh dill -- chopped or 1/2 teaspoon dried
1/3 cup vodka
7 ounces smoked salmon -- cut into strips
white pepper
sprig fresh dill

Cook pasta and drain well.

Heat oil in a wide frying pan over medium-low heat.
Add shallot and cook, stirring often, until soft but not brown (about 3 minutes).
Stir in chopped tomatoes, cover and simmer for 5 minutes.*
Add cream, nutmeg, chopped dill and vodka.
Increase heat to high and bring to a full boil. Boil for 1 minute.
Add pasta to sauce and mix lightly using 2 spoons, until pasta is well coated.
Remove from heat, add salmon and mix lightly.
Season to taste with white pepper and garnish with dill springs.

*Note:
I sometimes dice the tender upper half of 5 or 6 asparagus and add a minute or two after the tomato.

Choey wrote:Antonius, indubbiamente siamo d'accordo, but permit me to add my pet culinary peeve: the deluge of sauce many 'mericani appear to believe is appropriate for pasta. And in that belief they are fully abetted by restaurants. I say, let the pasta speak for itself (pasta ipsa loquitur?).

Over-saucing is very widespread. I can understand the motivation but, like you, I prefer to have the pasta be more prominent. In fact, the flavour of plain pasta, no dressing whatsoever, is wonderful if the pasta is made with really good wheat.

Also, in re Sig. Batali... and note that Chef 'O Serpe commits a peccato himself, though I prefer to believe it's a venial one given my own maculate past.

Mario Batali occasionally says things that are quite wrong about the historical and cultural context of Italian cuisine or specific Italian dishes, but he's obviously a fine and knowledgeable chef. He does, however, deviate from tradition now and again in some of his recipes and is not consistent enough in noting where and how he deviates. This point is only important insofar as he himself bills the Molto Mario shows as presentations of traditional cooking (and for the most part they are exactly that).

Giada De Laurentis has some fans on this board so I won't repeat my claim that she is in fact a cyborg -- uh oh, sorry -- but she really gets things mucked up sometimes.

Concerning alla Matriciana with garlic, Molto's use of garlic (and way troppo garlic) must be an adaptation to American tastes, for he seems to know that it doesn't belong there (see link in original post above and further link from that link to the eGullet Q&A).

I'm glad Choey accidently put a link to Rachel Rae's recipe; I can't believe that she offers a version of alla Matriciana with 6 cloves of garlic for one pound of pasta. Wow.


***

Can we possibly pass over in silence the infamia of grating cheese over linguine alle vongole? We are all diminished whenever that crime against food occurs.

Well, I know from an exchange back on the General Topics board in Lefflandia* that there are quite a few people who like to put cheese on their linguine alle vongole and find the 'prohibition' against doing so bizarre. I won't preach against such combining of cheese with fish but just note that traditionally that's not done for a number of reasons, including -- most importantly in the context of this discussion -- aesthetics. One should, however, also note that there are some traditional Italian dishes that do combine fish and cheese.

There is something really enjoyable for the individual diner about adding a condiment to a finished dish and, I suppose, it's the same impulse at work with the aforementioned wasabi and sushi or with soy sauce and Chinese food and certainly grated cheese with Italian pasta. For those who are inclined to put cheese on their pasta and fish dishes, I suggest they instead try at least a couple of times the breadcrumbs, which add some flavour but also a nice textural contrast.

Antonius

* Going back and reading some of that CH thread makes me so happy to be here and not there. Maronna mia, ce ne so' tantë ca nu ponnë penzà.

Post-site-move character problems fixed.

I too indulge in the Costco salmon bargain.

Though I'm embarrassed to admit that even after the eggs and the bagels I can still happily scarf more down right off the cardboard, I am, like you, seeking alternatives by the end of the package.

Vodka cream sauce always sounded to me like a sort of fake improvement over plain old cream sauce. But, now, between C2's science and G Wiv's recipe, I stand on the cusp of complete conversion.

I grew up on ground-beef-based tomato sauces, where the final result looks more like chili-mac (more sauce than pasta), and only in recent years have been scaling back to the more reasonable "dressing" of pasta -- and my teenage boys, who had shied away from tomato sauce originally (in favor of just butter & parm), are now fans.

I've also been trying my sushi the "right" way (dipped fish down and held in the fingers; ginger as a palate cleanser between pieces) and I have to say it's quite enjoyable. If I'm eating cheap buffet maki, I'm likely to pile the wasabi and ginger atop it (as an excuse to eat ginger and wasabi), but if there's good fish, by all means eat it right!

Frankly, I'm more forgiving of an overused garlic and onions it my too-sauced pasta than I am the typical Olive Garden sins of garlic in the Alfredo; garlic, cream and cheese over things to the point where they become a solid mass, all while claiming some "Tuscan" authority to their dishes. If I could get a restaurant here to reproduce the pheasant breast with cognac sauce and risotto with trevisano I'd be in heaven.

If you really want a kick from food trends, read "Bellwether" by Connie Willis: the sharpest satirist we've had since Samuel Clemens, skewering office life, fashion, food trends and fads in general.

I've already admitted to my preference toward massive quantities of garlic, so I'd like to add that one of my current favorite ways of adding garlic is in the form of dried slices. This Chinese product (Queens' brand) comes in a 7 ounce bag that cost $1.10 at Mitsuwa, contains only garlic, and probably nets out to a large quanity of pre-dried product (there must be the equivalent of 20,30 or more bulbs in the bag). These dehydrated garlic slices are dried, so some of the oils are not quite so active as they are in their fresh form, but these thin slices pack a decent punch, and are great when you need some garlic goodness fast. I sprinkle them over the top of pasta dishes, which I'm sure is probably not in the Italian tradition, but I guess I just really dig garlic in any form.

Hammond

David Hammond wrote:These dehydrated garlic slices are dried, so some of the oils are not quite so active as they are in their fresh form, but these thin slices pack a decent punch,

Hammond,

Sounds perfect for a quick spin in the spice grinder. 10-seconds and fresh, or at least fresher than from a jar, garlic powder.

I will say, as a past recipient of Bruce Cook's home made garlic powder, you might consider making your own.

Enjoy,
Gary

mrbarolo wrote:Vodka cream sauce always sounded to me like a sort of fake improvement over plain old cream sauce. But, now, between C2's science and G Wiv's recipe, I stand on the cusp of complete conversion.

Mr. B,

I'm not really advocating eating vodka/cream, or for the most part, cream sauces anywhere but the home. When you make the dish at home you control the level of goopyness. (I apologize for using obscure epicurean terms, but nothing else really sums it up)

I'd venture to guess it's been 10-years since I ordered a cream based dish in a restaurant. Actually, the most egregious is cream and cheese, one particularly horrid goncchi dressed with blue cheese and heavy cream comes to mind. Blue cheese Come to think of it, this may have been the dish that put me off Italian restaurants for 3-4 years.

I'm making a Costco run later in the day, seems a good time to pick up a pack of smoked salmon and make the penne dish. Light on the goopyness.

Enjoy,
Gary

GWiv: Absolutely. When I said "conversion," I meant conversion to making your recipe, not (giusto ciel!) ordering such a thing in a restaurant. Between goopyness of conception and the danger of several minutes under the heat lamp before serving, one has must have better odds of success at Lotto.

Apropos of this discussion, did everyone see Eric Asimov's report on vodka tasting in yesterday's Times?

Spoiler alert: regular old $13 Smirnoff beat the pants off a number of $30 heavy hitters. I'm no vodka connoisseur so I can't comment on either methodology of results, but I'm happy to give it a try. There were some odd ommissions from the field: no Stoli, no Finlandia, among others.

Lots of interesting info in the piece. I was unaware that almost no vodka producers actually distill their own grain. They buy it from huge concerns like Archer Daniels. Kinda takes the romance right out of it for me, no matter how cool the bottle shape is.

A previous poster noted:

I

was unaware that almost no vodka producers actually distill their own grain. They buy it from huge concerns like Archer Daniels. Kinda takes the romance right out of it for me, no matter how cool the bottle shape is

THis puts me in mind of a similar situatuation with Irish Whiskey. For years, there has been an odd, but widely-held belief that Bushmills is Protestant whiskey, while Jameson is Catholic whiskey. However, they are both made by a company called Irish Distillers (which also makes Paddy's, Power's, Midleton, and Dunphy's). While the Bushmills distillery is in Northern Ireland, in the heavily Protestant County Antrim, they also distill Jameson there (the other brands are distilled in County Cork, in the Republic).

john m wrote:Erik M. noted:

I

was unaware that almost no vodka producers actually distill their own grain. They buy it from huge concerns like Archer Daniels. Kinda takes the romance right out of it for me, no matter how cool the bottle shape is

THis puts me in mind of a similar situatuation with Irish Whiskey. For years, there has been an odd, but widely-held belief that Bushmills is Protestant whiskey, while Jameson is Catholic whiskey. However, they are both made by a company called Irish Distillers (which also makes Paddy's, Power's, Midleton, and Dunphy's). While the Bushmills distillery is in Northern Ireland, in the heavily Protestant County Antrim, they also distill Jameson there (the other brands are distilled in County Cork, in the Republic).

Interesting, kinda like European soccer teams.

Vital Information wrote:I am very close with someone who loves to wasabi up her, (I mean their) sushi, and she (I mean this person) is notorious for dunnking the rice in the soya sauce. I always tell her (I mean this person) that one is only suppose to allow the fish to grace the condiment. She (I mean this person) cares not. So, yes there is a fine line between upholding traditions and maritial bliss, (I mean respecting other people's tastes).

VI you are a gentleman and culinary scholar!

mrbarolo wrote:
Apropos of this discussion, did everyone see Eric Asimov's report on vodka tasting in yesterday's Times?

Spoiler alert: regular old $13 Smirnoff beat the pants off a number of $30 heavy hitters. I'm no vodka connoisseur so I can't comment on either methodology of results, but I'm happy to give it a try. There were some odd ommissions from the field: no Stoli, no Finlandia, among others.

I did not see the referenced article (and _which_ Times, btw?) but it reminded me of a post from /. that was both informative and entertaining.
http://www.ohmygoditburns.com/wordpress/index.php?p=4

I suspect on some future family vacation at the beach we may be tempted to perform our own variation on this process and conduct our own tests (long days in the sun can have interesting effects on judgement).

Kman wrote:I did not see the referenced article (and _which_ Times, btw?)

New York Times

Hammond wrote:These dehydrated garlic slices are dried, so some of the oils are not quite so active as they are in their fresh form, but these thin slices pack a decent punch, and are great when you need some garlic goodness fast.

On two occasions recently, I had hot pot over at Mandarin Kitchen. We usually get a split pot with two different broths: spicey and mild. The mild side has tremendous quantities of garlic slices, yet there is a mild to almost no garlic flavor present. I've been questioning this phenomena of phantom garlic taste each time. My tablemates keep suggesting there are so many other ingredients present, the garlic flavor is lost. I had a passing thought maybe dehydrated garlic was used, which has many essential oils missing as you noted, now I am more certain this may be the case.

Fortuitously, my department was "treated" to lunch today at the captioned establishment. The meal, which I hasten to say was much appreciated by all in attendance (save one) - illustrated perfectly various pecati which have become so commonplace as to be barely worth commenting on, except here.

The meal was served family style and the operation operates very smoothly. Our group of about 11 was seated quickly, the servers were all pleasant and efficient and knowledgeable about the menu. Dirty dishes were quickly bussed, water glasses filled, bread baskets replenished, without ever having to prompt the staff.

But the food. Generous portions of pure fakey "red sauce place" cuisine.

Fried calamari: unobjectionable, not too greasy

Stuffed Mushroom caps: just fine; breadcrumbs and a decent white wine reduction sauce. (but i'll take almost any mushroom, any way, anywhere, any time.

Chopped Salad and "Maggiano's" salad: One of the most indifferent chopped salads I've ever had anywhere. The "crispy prosciutto" (little lardons, I suppose) mentioned on the menu were not in evidence that I could see. Neither was the advertised avocado. Lots of chopped lettuce was. Dressing was creamy and flavorless. Diced tomatoes were diced, pallid, winter tomatoes. A complete waste of space.

The Maggiono's salad appeared to be the same as the chopped salad, but un-chopped and omitting the tomatoes.

Shells with vegetables and shrimp: Pasta slightly pre-al dente, or possibly toughened by time under the heat lamp. Medium shrimp were plentiful enoug, but tough. Vegetables were plentiful but very oily and flavorless.

4 Cheese Ravioli: The menu describes the dish as having a "creamy pesto alfredo sauce." Need I say more? Well, yes. Had the word "pesto" not appeared on the menu, I would have had no inkling of its involvement.

The cheese filling was largely ricotta with a muted, generically "not ricotta" note hovering around the edges somewhere. The cream sauce was kind of thin. There was also a ladelful of tomato sauce in the center of the dish.

Chicken parmesan: breaded fried breasts with some pointless cheese on top. Nothing more to be said, really.

Whitefish (daily special): fillets were topped with what seemed to be the same mix of veggies that graced the pasta. Equally flavorless and very oily. There were some capers, however. One could hunt them down individually and bite into one for a veritable LSD trip of flavor amid the oily blandness.

Dessert was the apple crostada and the special spiced pear pound cake. When I say that on tasting both, a heated debate ensued as to which was which, I think I've completed the picture. (Except to note that no one appeared to think that having an apple and a pear dessert be indistinguishable was necessarily a bad thing.

Dulce, ergo dessert. The question of which was which seemed purely academic to the eaters.

However, we did not encounter piles of garlic, or sun-dried tomatoes, or balsamic vinegar. Just endless blandness, oiliness and heaviness.