Restaurants that avoid HFCS? pubs, sushi, et al.

...I'm to the point where if I see a burger on a bar's menu and they're charging $15, I'll never go back if they serve it with standard Heinz ketchup and not the organic non-HFCS version. High fructose corn syrup was originally intended as a cost cutting measure in place of sugar, yet somehow has weaved its way into our entire food culture in the US. The way I see it, any place charging a "gourmet" price should be serving something vaguely resembling gourmet ingredients. I'm all for bars serving bar food at bar food prices, but if they're trying to pass a $15 pub burger off as bar food, they should have the proper condiments to accompany that price (and for that matter, at this point I'd be willing to pay the quarter it might cost for them to just have it as an option). If they're being so cheap at the front end in such an obvious way, what are they doing in the back?

Though not exactly a gourmet place, I really had my Epiphany a few weeks ago after leaving Au Bon Pain and researching what they put into the chai latte I just paid $5 for... it's pure HFCS almost. (Ironically, the company that makes it is named Mont Blanc Gourmet -- http://www.montblancgourmet.com/Syrups/Chai-Syrup.php). If Starbucks and 100 other coffee shops can use organic Oregon Mountain Chai, it can't be hard for Au Bon Pain to find something similar or the same.

There are restaurants out there serving the real sugar-based version of Heinz (labeled as "organic"), which really cost-wise isn't much more money. But finding them mostly is trial and error... and usually more error.

Has anyone gone out of their way to compile a list of restaurants in Chicago that avoid the standard cheap condiments, HFCS free bread/buns, or other items that are typically rife with HFCS? I'm not talking about just the places that make an actual attempt to be sustainable (Big Jones, Crust, Heartland Cafe, Uncommon Ground, etc come to mind)... But if a joe schmoe pizza place goes out of their way to tell you their pizza sauce is made with real sugar and not HFCS... can we get a list compiled?

I've recently realized something I hadn't really previously considered... Sushi is full of crappy ingredients. Most sushi at most restaurants contains high fructose corn syrup. The sushi ginger served at sushi restaurants contains aspartame. Anything with teriyaki sauce contains HFCS. Anything fake crab is full of HFCS. Unagi contains HFCS because of the sauce they marinate/serve it in. Most startling, though, is that apparently the rice wine vinegar used in making sushi rice is apparently always the "seasoned" rice vinegar type, which contains HFCS (also known as Mirin, and sometimes to as "sushi vinegar" apparently)..and this is used in every roll you can buy. This is mind blowing--to me at least. When you head to Subway and order one of their "new" whole wheat subs, you should really expect that that roll is made with HFCS (...because it is). But who on earth knew sushi was rife with it?? I always feel super healthy when eating it. Guess not anymore.

My general operating assumption is that unless a place is specifically mentioning doing something different than "the norm" that they're using the same cheapo ingredients that True World foods sends them. (if they're paying extra for anything that isn't the standard bargain basement ingredient, most restaurants will make that known on their menu)... I have to think there must be some sushi joint out there that's not going with "the norm" and trying to do something healthier?? anyone have any of those to throw into a list as well?

dddane wrote:...I'm to the point where if I see a burger on a bar's menu and they're charging $15, I'll never go back if they serve it with standard Heinz ketchup and not the organic non-HFCS version.

The Bristol offers homemade fruit-based ketchup with it's burger and fries. I absolutely love the Bristol, but this concoction left me longing for Heinz. HFCS or not, Heinz Ketchup has no equivolent. It is the condiment of all condiments.

I try to keep HFCS-filled products out of our home, which is where the bulk of our eating takes place. But when we do go out to eat, I personally don't worry about it. Worrying about ingredients is stressful enough when they're printed right on the label...the last thing I want to do is spoil a nice evening out by stressing about which insidious ingredients might be lurking in the bread or condiments.

Kennyz wrote:HFCS or not, Heinz Ketchup has no equivolent. It is the condiment of all condiments.

...so you don't like the organic Heinz and will only accept their HFCS version? or did you just not realize that it's an option?

Khaopaat wrote:when we do go out to eat, I personally don't worry about it. Worrying about ingredients is stressful enough when they're printed right on the label...the last thing I want to do is spoil a nice evening out by stressing about which insidious ingredients might be lurking in the bread or condiments.

well that's your prerogative, but not really what i asked. (it would be one thing if there was zero interest and everyone agreed with you, but clearly by the fact that there's any restaurant out there that has the option, there are interested people.). my position on the matter is almost more political in nature than the actual wanting to avoid HFCS for health reasons... ultimately our reliance on corn products has ruined every aspect of the american food chain, and there are a lot of very poor farmers out there as a result...

p.s., I'd also be curious what local barbecue joints use real sugar in their sauces. (For instance, Sweet Baby Ray's and Calvin's BBQ in Chicago both have HFCS in the sauces they sell, and I assume at the point they're large enough to be bottling their own sauces they're probably using the same sauce recipe in house. I'd be curious of Smoque, Honey One, Honky Tonk use real sugar in their sauces...)

dddane wrote:I've recently realized something I hadn't really previously considered... Sushi is full of crappy ingredients. Most sushi at most restaurants contains high fructose corn syrup. The sushi ginger served at sushi restaurants contains aspartame. Anything with teriyaki sauce contains HFCS. Anything fake crab is full of HFCS. Unagi contains HFCS because of the sauce they marinate/serve it in. Most startling, though, is that apparently the rice wine vinegar used in making sushi rice is apparently always the "seasoned" rice vinegar type, which contains HFCS (also known as Mirin, and sometimes to as "sushi vinegar" apparently)..and this is used in every roll you can buy. This is mind blowing--to me at least. When you head to Subway and order one of their "new" whole wheat subs, you should really expect that that roll is made with HFCS (...because it is). But who on earth knew sushi was rife with it?? I always feel super healthy when eating it. Guess not anymore.

Wow. More power to you finding the products you want.. but I just had to step in here. I'd believe that most of the crappy foodservice teriyaki and unagi sauces have some corn syrup in them, but the pre-seasoned rice vinegar? The marukan brand stuff uses real sugar, so I guess I'd be surprised if the competition doesn't.

I would also hope that most LTHers are going to sushi bars that season their own vinegar rather than buying a premixed vinegar. If they can't be bothered to add their own sake/sugar/salt/mirin to rice vinegar, they probably aren't worth eating at.

So discerning, yet you put ketchup on a hamburger?

On the stuff about sushi, HFCS can be pretty easily avoided (or minimized) if you don't settle for the mediocre stuff...

1. No one should be eating fake crab anyway.
2. How much ginger are people really eating with their sushi? If you're one of those people who puts a slab on every piece you eat, you shouldn't be doing that anyway. It's a palate cleanser. A couple of bites should be fine, and I can't imagine that would really harm anybody.
3. On unagi, I can't stand eating it most places because they're probably buying mass-produced from some outside source. I would imagine if a place is making their own, you'll be getting a much higher quality product (I'm not aware of any places in Chicago that do their own unagi, but I'd be curious to hear if there are some).
4. I'm with gleam on being a little skeptical on the mirin issue.

Epic Burger practices what they preach. Not only do they have Heinz organic on their tables, but also in the packets they put in your take-out bag.

I don't like corn syrup much either, but mostly for taste reasons. Several preventative measures come to mind:


Stop eating at Subway

No more "sushi" that involves teriyaki sauce

Carry own ketchup

Boycott BBQ guys who breathe smoke and aerosolized lard for a living if using corn syrup

(Or) no sauce, or NC-style only

Avoid pizza places with any kind of sugar in sauce (because pizza sauce = tomatoes)



Corn fed beef -- fad?

gleam wrote:I'd believe that most of the crappy foodservice teriyaki and unagi sauces have some corn syrup in them, but the pre-seasoned rice vinegar? The marukan brand stuff uses real sugar, so I guess I'd be surprised if the competition doesn't.

well.. i should say: i'm no sushi chef. I've never made it myself. I've read how to make it though, and any instruction I've ever seen starts out with seasoned rice vinegar... I was led to believe this was "the norm" after reading a number of things online. You're saying it's not typical in a sushi kitchen? I do know i've seen seasoned rice vinegar being sold by the gallon full at an asian grocery or two, are people consuming these bottles for personal use? probably not. and just because something is easy to make in house, doesn't mean the majority of places do (many condiments are very easy to make, very few places make them in house). most condiments don't affect a meal as greatly as the whole, I assume a pre-made sushi rice vinegar is no different... (i would think people are more likely to notice the quality of fish vs if the rice has a pre-made vinegar in it). general laziness to save time vs some financial benefit is probably where the failure in "the system" often starts. (For instance, I have a friend who works at a fairly well known bar.. he pointed out that they buy pre-made simple syrup containing HFCS, even though it's actually cheaper to make it themselves with real sugar).. if 95% of sushi restaurants in Chicago are sourcing the cheapest fish they can buy from True World, what would make me think they're going out of their way to make such a minor ingredient of higher quality? i'd be curious to know if anyone who works at a known sushi place would be willing to say if they use a pre-made seasoned vinegar (and/or what brands are most common).

jesteinf wrote:On the stuff about sushi, HFCS can be pretty easily avoided (or minimized) if you don't settle for the mediocre stuff...
1. No one should be eating fake crab anyway.
2. How much ginger are people really eating with their sushi? If you're one of those people who puts a slab on every piece you eat, you shouldn't be doing that anyway. It's a palate cleanser. A couple of bites should be fine, and I can't imagine that would really harm anybody.
3. On unagi, I can't stand eating it most places because they're probably buying mass-produced from some outside source. I would imagine if a place is making their own, you'll be getting a much higher quality product (I'm not aware of any places in Chicago that do their own unagi, but I'd be curious to hear if there are some).
4. I'm with gleam on being a little skeptical on the mirin issue.

-"can be pretty easily avoided (or minimized) if you don't settle for the mediocre stuff..."
It's extremely presumptuous to assume that by just going somewhere not considered "mediocre" in taste or price, you're avoiding crappy ingredients altogether. But feel free to name places you can avoid it. so far you haven't.
1. i agree. but sometimes you order an appetizer containing crab, and you don't really know what's going to be used in it.
2. i agree, it's a palate cleanser and nothing more. I was pointing that out for mere awareness of what's in food... Did you know aspartame was in your sushi ginger? I'm sure those who avoid Diet Coke out of principle of avoiding aspartame wouldn't mind knowing.

spinynorman99 wrote:Epic Burger practices what they preach. Not only do they have Heinz organic on their tables, but also in the packets they put in your take-out bag.

thank you for being the only person so far that's actually answered the question that was asked.

OK, for good sushi I pretty much stick to Katsu, Mirai, Ai, and Ponzu. I went to Itto for the first time a couple of weeks ago, but I want to try it a couple more times before I add it to the list.

On the crab issue, I use a pretty novel approach for avoiding fake crab in any of my dishes. I simply ask what kind of crab they're using before I order anything.

dddane wrote:

Kennyz wrote:HFCS or not, Heinz Ketchup has no equivolent. It is the condiment of all condiments.

...so you don't like the organic Heinz and will only accept their HFCS version? or did you just not realize that it's an option?

didn't realize.

dddane wrote:

spinynorman99 wrote:Epic Burger practices what they preach. Not only do they have Heinz organic on their tables, but also in the packets they put in your take-out bag.

thank you for being the only person so far that's actually answered the question that was asked.

so is the Bristol not an answer to your question, or did you just not realize it was an answer to your question?

spinynorman99 wrote:so is the Bristol not an answer to your question, or did you just not realize it was an answer to your question?

OK you win on that :]

dddane wrote:

spinynorman99 wrote:so is the Bristol not an answer to your question, or did you just not realize it was an answer to your question?

OK you win on that :]

And on this.


Seriously, I thought Bristol was a good answer. Custom House is another preparing its own condiments. Kuma's and Paramount also whip up many of their own sauces, but may start with something containing HFCS (have never asked them if they're specifically avoiding it).

Away from ketchup, a few places that do everything from scratch should fit your bill. Mado, the infamous Terragusto, Avec, Blackbird (and maybe Publican, but I don't completely trust it yet), and Vie probably don't go near anything with HFCS, or would certainly be able to prepare something totally sans on request.

Every barbecue joint I know uses some form of HFCS starter, and I've actually talked to Mack (Uncle John's) and Bart Moccio (Smokin' M's) about this. Other than ordering sauce on the side (but then you have to wonder about rub contents), I'm not sure you could get buy-in from a pitmaster on a no-corn syrup guarantee except perhaps from Willie at Honky Tonk, who would probably put something together for you right there on the stove, as he's that kind of guy.

I just checked a bottle of Russell's barbeque sauce, which just lists "sugar." Not sure what they use at the shack. Since Russell's barbecue sauce is simply thinned tonkatsu sauce, I then checked my bottles of Kikkoman tonkatsu and teriyaki sauces. First ingredient in both: sugar, FWIW.

The last time DH bought ketchup, he got Heinz Organic. Nope. Doesn't taste as good to me as the regular. Sorry!

dddane wrote:2. i agree, it's a palate cleanser and nothing more. I was pointing that out for mere awareness of what's in food... Did you know aspartame was in your sushi ginger? I'm sure those who avoid Diet Coke out of principle of avoiding aspartame wouldn't mind knowing.

Had to come back to this one, also, since I looked at every brand of pre-made gari on the shelves at Treasure Island and Jewel and none had aspartame as an ingredient. So if you're really paranoid, you could always bring your own.

gleam wrote:

dddane wrote:2. i agree, it's a palate cleanser and nothing more. I was pointing that out for mere awareness of what's in food... Did you know aspartame was in your sushi ginger? I'm sure those who avoid Diet Coke out of principle of avoiding aspartame wouldn't mind knowing.

Had to come back to this one, also, since I looked at every brand of pre-made gari on the shelves at Treasure Island and Jewel and none had aspartame as an ingredient. So if you're really paranoid, you could always bring your own.

that's odd. i was just at jewel this morning and the one at broadway/addision had it in stock and it did indeed have aspartame. the same at World Market, theirs had it. i was first pinned into this though when i saw a bucket that a sushi restaurant had... it said it real big on a bucket i saw (and this was no cheap sushi place mind you, quite a well known and touted place)... jesteinf provided us a list with places s/he deemed as "good" sushi places, but it was completely counter to my point that just because you're dropping $150 on sushi for 2 doesn't mean that they're using high quality ingredients (outside of the fish maybe). you don't know unless you have been in the kitchen what's in their sushi ginger. and unless it's a place that is going out of their way to tell you of their fine ingredients, i assume they're sourcing the cheapest side ingredients they can.. (heck, at some of these "fine" sushi places it's not even easy to order fresh wasabi)

All I'm saying is that there are things you can do to minimize the risk of avoiding "inferior" ingredients. I don't know what to tell you. Stay home and eat sushi if you've got such a big problem.

I read a study that shows that 70-90% of all animal feed in the United States is corn protein based. Even farmed fish are fed corn based feeds, so that eliminates many choices, salmon and tilapia especially.

I was listening to NPR a few months back and they had a researcher on who stated that his tests showed that more than 70% of the protein in an average person's body was originally corn protein. One person tested was more than 90% protein from corn.

Whether through meat, fish, tortillas, dextrose, maltodextrin, bread, HFCS, animal feed, pregelatinized corn starch in baked goods, sorbitol in toothpaste and mouthwash, hydrolyzed vegetable protein in what sometimes seems about everything in a jar or can, dry milled corn grits and dextrose used in "lite" beer and processed foods, corn is omnipresent in our diet.

The PBS series "King Corn" challenged people to go "corn free" and report back; most found it difficult, even vegans. Here's a link to the show's website:

http://www.pbs.org/independentlens/king ... kback.html

Unless you make it from scratch yourself or know the person making it for you, I'd assume there will be corn or corn byproducts in a meal somewhere, somehow.