Green City Market - Organic OR Sustainable vendors

So Time Out Chicago recently wrote about Bleeding Heart Bakery not getting their space back at GCM, presumably because they weren't sustainable (sourcing ingredients within 250 miles) enough. The article mentioned that the owner gave up her organic certification in order to be more 'sustainable'. I found all of this sort of surprising because I assumed (obviously naively) that the vendors were all organic (although I had heard rumors that Nichols is not). Further inquiry led me to the GCM website which says the vendors are either sustainable OR organic. And the websites of some of the vendors make no mention of organic production. My preference would be for sustainable AND organic, not OR. So, I guess I'm asking if anyone knows which vendors at GCM use organic practices. For me it's all about the produce as I don't buy baked goods there, but I'm curious about both.

http://www3.timeoutny.com/chicago/blog/out-and-about/2009/04/bleeding-heart-nixed-from-green-city-market/

update on above article:
http://www3.timeoutny.com/chicago/blog/out-and-about/2009/04/update-on-bleeding-hearts-green-city-market-issue/

As Oriana Kruszewski observes in my podcast about her, organic certification takes a lot of paperwork, a certain amount of land to segregate yours from the non-organic neighbor, etc. In a situation like GCM, where you can talk to farmers about their practices, far better to admit small farmers who don't meet the requirements but who you know to have good practices, than to keep new and promising and choose-to-be-small vendors out for the sake of legalese.

There are also vendors who are in the process of going organic, but since you have to wait years to be certified, it's not possible to say they are certified. I wonder about the Bleeding Heart thing, because I remember wanting to buy their molasses ginger cookies and they couldn't bring them - something about GCM requirements.

From the second of the two linked Time Out pieces:

That means even if Green City issues a get-out-of-jail-free card for sugar (local honey and flour are in fact available), there’s a no-tolerance policy on chocolate, citrus and baking spices like cinnamon and nutmeg, making it difficult, but not impossible, for bakers to stick within the market’s guidelines. So turns out it isn’t personal, but Allen and Garcia will just have to go their separate ways. And with that, I’m officially hanging up my marriage-counselor hat.

Not sure how the coffee on offer at the Market's information table jibes with that "no tolerance" policy.

Back to the original poster's question, I think Mike G hit the nail on the head. The beauty of the market setting is that you have an opportunity to talk to the farmers, get information about their practices, and assess whether you are comfortable with those measures. I have overheard numerous conversations between shoppers and vendors regarding whether such and such crop was sprayed, how certain things are grown, etc. Organic certification requires farms to jump through a lot of hoops; some find it worthwhile and in their economic interest to do so, while others who largely maintain the same standards do not. We participate in a CSA with Genesis Growers (a GCM vendor), which more or less practices organic farming, but has not sought the certification (although apparently may be doing so in the near future).

I like the idea of both. You will never be able to get citrus fruits here that are sustainable. Part of the problem, IMO, is that the developers of the movement were in CA where you can get pretty much all produce ( so the mileage thing makes sense). I have enjoyed GCM for years. I purchase from both sustainable and organic vendors.

If what you want is organic, then try Irv and Shelley's Fresh Picks. They clearly list what is organic, what is sustainable, and what is both, but you don't get to pick your own or talk to the vendors like you do at GCM.

http://www.freshpicks.com/cms/

My understanding from talking to one of the producers is that there is a big push this year to clarify the purpose of having prepared food vendors, including bakers. The GCM, I understand, wants to be clear that these folks are there primarily to showcase the fresh produce available at the market. It's a nice secondary or tertiary result that the baked goods draw additional traffic to the market, and that they make the market a more interesting place, but the primary purpose is to highlight for the average home cook what can be done with all the great local fruits and vegetables available at the market. It's not enough to be organic, sustainable, or whatever. You have to specifically show that you are putting forth effort to feature GCM ingredients.

The vendor's that are organic that I know for 100% are as follows:
Orianna's Orchards
Mint Creek Farms
Sweet Earth Farms
Kinkinnick
Genesis Growers
Tomato Mountain
I was a vendor at the GCM market so I got mired in a lot of problems with their guidelines.
For example I use local sugar from Michigan but that was a source of a problem and they wanted me to switch to organic, I did and it was a disaster for my products. The sugar is gray and brown, does not bake through etc etc. Now where does this sugar come from? Brazil and Malyasia, countries that use DDT which has been banned in the US. So next to your organic plot of sugar, planes are spraying DDT next to you. Also this is not sustainable, I do not think that is very green, shipping products 5000 miles away versus getting something from your own backyard. A lot of the organic products also come from China, to me that is questionable and hard to verify. All the scandals with food in that country make me very skeptical of the "organic" labeling. The best way for you to go is to check with the USDA who has organic certification. Some vendors at GCM have organic written on their banner but they are not certified organic so I am curious why the GCM does not make them take down their banner.
I agree with previous writers that sustainable is better than organic, not all organic growning practices are sustainable. But some of the vendors that sell cheese for example at GCM use hormone free and grass fed cows in their dairy and some do not, so why are there all these different standards applied? Blue Marble for example does not use hormones in their dairy and their cows are grass fed. As the Romans said caveat emptor. I will be more than happy to talk to you offline about this as I am sure that this will ruffle some feathers.

This is just silly.

I shop at GCM almost every week. I pay a premium for the best stuff (and looking at GCM, you pay quite a premium).

The idea that you have to be organic to be good stewards of the land is ascientific nonsense. The proof that organic is better for a person's health is at best dubious, at worst a con. Food produced locally naturally tastes better because it is usually picked the day before and ripe when you purchase it.

That said, GCM can do their own thing and I can go elsewhere. Free country and whatnot. But kicking out a vendor because they did not say enough Hail Marys, er sourced their sugar wrong, smacks of zealotry.

Rather than booting non-compliant vendors, I think it'd be pretty cool if GCM were to help them attain the necessary certifications to become compliant.

I bet at least a few of the smaller-scale farmers & other vendors at GCM would embrace the opportunity to get some help in navigating the bureaucracy involved with getting certified, especially if the alternative is to lose their slot at the market.

I agree with you completely. I asked for alternative sources only to be shrugged at, to comply with some of the insane guidelines I called 20 different flour distributors, sustainable and or organic none had the product I was looking for so I used a flour company in Indiana and that was not accepted either. I told their forager to give me a name of a company that has this flour and I will get it in a heartbeat. My biggest concern is that the rules are applied to some people and not to everyone at the same time, so the basic fairness standard seems to be missing. But as the French say C'est la vie and life goes on.

Matt wrote:Not sure how the coffee on offer at the Market's information table jibes with that "no tolerance" policy.

The coffee is free because it doesn't fit the GCM policy.

Cookie Monster wrote:I was a vendor at the GCM market...

I presume this means you won't be back anymore. This is a real blow. Your stuff is excellent!

Unfortunately yes, but we will be at the State Street and Division Saturday market which has an incredible array of vendors. On Thursdays we will be at Daley Plaza and Sunday on Eerie. So don't completely despair.

Cookie Monster wrote:Unfortunately yes, but we will be at the State Street and Division Saturday market which has an incredible array of vendors. On Thursdays we will be at Daley Plaza and Sunday on Eerie. So don't completely despair.

And at the Downtown Farmstand on Randolph, weekdays from 11-7! Where I just picked up some of Cookie Monster's delicious poppy seed strudel.

Cookie Monster wrote:The vendor's that are organic that I know for 100% are as follows:
Orianna's Orchards
Mint Creek Farms
Sweet Earth Farms
Kinkinnick
Genesis Growers

Cookie Monster,

Thanks for your list of vendors. I can add Tomato Mountain to the list (a friend of mine worked there one summer). I also wanted to say think you for sharing your story of trouble with GCM (which sounds similar to Bleeding Heart's). It is a shame that GCM treats its vendors in such a rigid, yet at the same time arbitrary, manner. Makes me much less excited for the start of market season.

As you know politics is in everything and the GCM has exemplified that this year.

Not to disrespect anyone or any of the comments that have been posted thus far but we are not getting all sides of the story here. In fact, this is beginning to feel like piling on to me. I do hope that someone from Green City Market will see this thread and comment.

Meanwhile, there are some 5-dozen vendors who will be a part of the Green City Market this year and I doubt very seriously that political connections were the reason that they were selected. I'm guessing that with so many eyes upon the GCM, those that were approved would hold up quite well under the inevitable public scrutiny. In fact, GCM Director Lyle Allen's in one of the TOC pieces linked above indicates a desire on the part of the GCM for greater transparency in the approval process.

I'd be curious to see the letters that went out to the vendors whose applications were rejected this year.

=R=

Good points, Ronnie. I think that the GCM is trying hard to "brand" itself, and it's making vendor decisions based on what it sees as the best way to do that. We'll never know all the ins and outs of that decision-making process; and we shouldn't expect to, in my opinion. The good news is that the tighter the GCM decides to make its image, the more opportunity that leaves for other markets to open and thrive in the Chicago area. A more tightly controlled GCM could end up being a win-win for everyone.

I also grabbed what appeared to be the last of Cookie Monster's poppyseed strudels yesterday at the Randolph Street location. Since I am currently not working downtown, I will miss stopping by the Delightful Pastries booth on Fridays at Daley Plaza.

Suzy

sdritz wrote:I also grabbed what appeared to be the last of Cookie Monster's poppyseed strudels yesterday at the Randolph Street location. Since I am currently not working downtown, I will miss stopping by the Delightful Pastries booth on Fridays at Daley Plaza.

Suzy

Thursdays

To the previous point of Ronnie. I think that transparentcy in the application process would be great ( as it is not currently there) and the reason why someone has not been accepted should be stated in the letter that the GCM sends out. I do not want to "pile on" GCM or anything of that nature Ronnie, I just was commenting on my experience there and that is subjective to me. I am sure some vendors have had a wonderful experience and they can sing nothing but praises and that will be their point of view. I did also not state that you need to be politically connected but that is has become political which is a type of behavior in any given organization, whether a market, school or work. This forum is for LTH'rs and as someone wanted to have information I provided it for them, I do not want to have a back and forth attack going. Having been involved in the GCM for the last 11 months I think that I got a prettty good picture of what is happening, plus I have heard from other vendors, board members, volunteers, market managers and workers of the GCM. I know you love the GCM and it is a great market, but everything can use a little improvement and that is all I am saying.

Cookie Monster wrote:To the previous point of Ronnie. I think that transparentcy in the application process would be great ( as it is not currently there) and the reason why someone has not been accepted should be stated in the letter that the GCM sends out. I do not want to "pile on" GCM or anything of that nature Ronnie, I just was commenting on my experience there and that is subjective to me. I am sure some vendors have had a wonderful experience and they can sing nothing but praises and that will be their point of view. I did also not state that you need to be politically connected but that is has become political which is a type of behavior in any given organization, whether a market, school or work. This forum is for LTH'rs and as someone wanted to have information I provided it for them, I do not want to have a back and forth attack going. Having been involved in the GCM for the last 11 months I think that I got a prettty good picture of what is happening, plus I have heard from other vendors, board members, volunteers, market managers and workers of the GCM. I know you love the GCM and it is a great market, but everything can use a little improvement and that is all I am saying.

Thanks, Dobra, for clarifying your perspective for me. I wasn't really replying only to your comments but to the one-sided nature of this discussion. Fwiw, I can't really say that I 'love' the GCM (because I don't live close enough to frequent it) but I appreciate what they do and I do really wish that someone from their organization would join this discussion because I think it would be more productive if they did.

On a personal note, I will miss seeing you at the GCM this year but I know that you will always have a significant presence here in town (your shop, other markets) with or without the GCM.

=R=

Thanks Ronnie, I know you are a tough food critic so your good opinion is a high compliment.
I will talk to you about this when I see you because this is one long discussion.