Vermouth

I've recently gotten into cocktails, and I've been building up my home bar. What kind of vermouth do people recommend? I'm looking for both sweet and dry vermouth. I've started off with the basics like martinis and manhattans, but I'm sure I'll branch out eventually.

Good question

For sweet vermouth, I alternate between Carpano Antica and Punt y Mes, depending on whether I want a sweeter, more traditional vermouth (the former) or something a little spicier and with more of a kick (the latter). Vya is also good, but expensive. M&R red is just a horrorshow, and I think Cinzano and Stock and the other usual suspects are all pretty mediocre. The experts really recommend the Carpano, especially in a Manhattan.

For dry (white) vermouth, I hear Dolin is unbeatable but expensive. Vya is also a top-shelf name, and I actually think that Noilly Prat, even though it's recently been reformulated, is more than acceptable. I don't think I could tell most of them apart in a blind taste test -- what's more important than anything, especially with dry vermouth, is that you don't allow it to oxidize. Only buy 375 mL bottles, and try to decant it immediately into even smaller containers, limiting its interaction with the outside air.

That's my two cents.

Noilly Prat makes (what I think is) a pretty decent sweet vermouth too. It's not as excellent as Punt e Mes or Carpano Antica, but it's much cheaper and comes in smaller bottles.

This month's Imbibe has a section on Dry Vermouth tasting and their favorite is Dolin and they didn't seem to like Vya very much.

This actually mirrors my own tastes, as I did not care for Vya very much except it came in a 375ml. My favorite sweet vermouth is Carpano by far. I also do a half to half of M+R to Punt e Mes for that carpano flavor when I'm out of it.

My standbys are Noilly Prat for dry and Cinzano for sweet. I usually have Punt e Mes around also, esp for drinking on its own (with a twist of lime). When Vya goes on sale I usually try to pick some up.

Love Carpano Antica and it's definitely my favorite but it's so distinctive and aromatic, I almost don't count it in the vermouth category. It really brings a bit extra to the party. Definitely agree with the recommendations for Punt e Mes on the sweet side and Dolin and Noilly Pratt on the dry side. I happen to like the Vya products (on both sides) but again, their very distinctive and don't always fit well into classical cocktail recipes.

Remember also, that these are not like many other spirits in that they don't have an indefinite shelf life. They do go bad and become raisin-y over time (6-12 months after opening in my experience), so if you don't use them very often, you might be better off with the 375 ml bottles over the 750's.

=R=

ronnie_suburban wrote:Remember also, that these are not like many other spirits in that they don't have an indefinite shelf life. They do go bad and become raisin-y over time (6-12 months after opening in my experience), so if you don't use them very often, you might be better off with the 375 ml bottles over the 750's.

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Wow, that is being extremely generous in my opinion, and the reason I just don't keep vermouth around the house. Dry I think noticeably changes after a month or so. Sweet, up to three months or so. Of course in both cases assuming it is refrigerated, and the better product you start with, the longer you can get away with it. I've found that the better vermouths change at about the same rate as the others, but while the flavors change, they stay acceptable for use longer.

SSDD

headcase wrote:

ronnie_suburban wrote:Remember also, that these are not like many other spirits in that they don't have an indefinite shelf life. They do go bad and become raisin-y over time (6-12 months after opening in my experience), so if you don't use them very often, you might be better off with the 375 ml bottles over the 750's.

=R=

Wow, that is being extremely generous in my opinion, and the reason I just don't keep vermouth around the house. Dry I think noticeably changes after a month or so. Sweet, up to three months or so. Of course in both cases assuming it is refrigerated, and the better product you start with, the longer you can get away with it. I've found that the better vermouths change at about the same rate as the others, but while the flavors change, they stay acceptable for use longer.

SSDD

This doesn't entirely line up with my experience but it certainly reinforces the point that even under optimal conditions (refrigeration, headspace removed), vermouths don't hold up very long.

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So the conventional wisdom on oxidation is that if there is less air in the bottle, the liquid will oxidize less? This makes sense, but I wonder if transferring to a smaller bottle causes more oxidation in the transfer than just letting it be in a bigger bottle.

turkob wrote:So the conventional wisdom on oxidation is that if there is less air in the bottle, the liquid will oxidize less? This makes sense, but I wonder if transferring to a smaller bottle causes more oxidation in the transfer than just letting it be in a bigger bottle.

I don't transfer containers, I use a stopper system which purportedly removes oxygen from the bottle. It definitely works, though I'm not sure how truly effective it is.

=R=

Intriguing

How long does regular red wine stay good using such a device?

Ha, it says so right in the description. 7-10 days.

Looks like a worthwhile purchase, thanks for all the input guys!

turkob wrote:Intriguing

How long does regular red wine stay good using such a device?

. . .

Ha, it says so right in the description. 7-10 days.

Looks like a worthwhile purchase, thanks for all the input guys!

I use this vacuum stopper system from time to time on red wine. Use the vacuum pump to get all the oxygen out and then refrigerate to further slow things down. Most run-of-the-mill reds stay drinkable for a day or two, but you notice some reduction in quality (a very few wines actually improve, but those are types that often need an extended breathe in any event). Beyond a day there is even more of a decline, but less so than if you were to simply re-cork it or put a screw top back on or something. My general approach is that if I don't drink it by day one or two post opening, I will use it for cooking or toss it. While I am sure it is "drinkable" 7-10 days later, I am not sure you would really want to drink it.

I am very partial to Noilly Prat and Boissiere for martinis.

On the other hand I find virtually all sweet vermouth, and similar aperitifs, acceptable in cocktails. While I experiment like crazy with them all, and while I prefer bitter to sweet (I especially like substituting with Cynar), even Gallo and B&D work in a Negroni or Manhattan for me. I like Stock, Tribuno, and whatever is on sale for mixing. I generally would not mix with Pent e Mes or Carpano Antica, but would drink those chilled or on the rocks.

Vermouth and sherry are two things I cook with a lot even though I can't stand to drink either of them straight. Vermouth works well any time a recipe calls for a dry white wine, even tomato-based sauces and meat-based gravies. Sherry's more distinctive aroma seems to me better suited to dishes containing milk, butter, mushrooms, or chicken (or all of those together!). Both are inexpensive, and add a lot to a dish. If you do drink vermouth and cook with it as well, you don't have to worry about its short life.