Next - Childhood Menu - Grant Achatz
Next - Childhood Menu - Grant Achatz
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Post #61 - November 11th, 2011, 9:49 amI've now read a number of reports from people who say that the "Autumn Scene" was the greatest culinary success of the evening. I'd be interested in understanding why people thought that. The dish did have one of my favorite bites of the night: an intensely flavored miniature piece of broccoli. But beyond that it just seemed like a dozen discordant fried leaves and things designed to look like hay. Then some hardened powders with indiscernible taste; they were there to remind people of pebbles, if I recall correctly. Though there were some tasty bits of food on the plate, as a composed dish I thought this was close to a disaster....defended from strong temptations to social ambition by a still stronger taste for tripe and onions." Screwtape in The Screwtape Letters by CS Lewis
Fuckerberg on Food
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Post #62 - November 11th, 2011, 10:58 amKennyz wrote:I've now read a number of reports from people who say that the "Autumn Scene" was the greatest culinary success of the evening. I'd be interested in understanding why people thought that. The dish did have one of my favorite bites of the night: an intensely flavored miniature piece of broccoli. But beyond that it just seemed like a dozen discordant fried leaves and things designed to look like hay. Then some hardened powders with indiscernible taste; they were there to remind people of pebbles, if I recall correctly. Though there were some tasty bits of food on the plate, as a composed dish I thought this was close to a disaster.
I'm definitely in the best of the night camp, Kenny. The poetic way of saying it would be that I imagined this is what it must be like when a deer finds a really fabulous bush to munch on. It felt like I was putting a handful of the forest floor in my mouth -- leaves and berries and twigs and soil -- except that it was intensely pleasurable. The textures, aromas and flavors somehow managed to capture the forest, but did so in a way that was palatable to humans rather than deer.
Corny, but that's the best way I can think to describe it.
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Post #63 - November 11th, 2011, 11:43 amKennyz wrote:I've now read a number of reports from people who say that the "Autumn Scene" was the greatest culinary success of the evening. I'd be interested in understanding why people thought that. The dish did have one of my favorite bites of the night: an intensely flavored miniature piece of broccoli. But beyond that it just seemed like a dozen discordant fried leaves and things designed to look like hay. Then some hardened powders with indiscernible taste; they were there to remind people of pebbles, if I recall correctly. Though there were some tasty bits of food on the plate, as a composed dish I thought this was close to a disaster.
This is what I wrote above:For me, the Autumn Scene was the star. If you can't tell from CrazyC's photo, dish is served on top of a carved out section of a log. Inside the log are various aromatics (twigs, applies, etc) that give off an intense woodsy fragrance. The dish on top is an earthy satisfying composition. Notably, and surprisingly, this dish is contains no meat. I thought the whole thing worked so well. I loved the burst of smells that hit you when you put your head over the dish.
The only thing I'd add is that I thought the individual components had quite a bit of flavor and worked extremely well together.
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Post #64 - November 11th, 2011, 11:59 amI didn't find the autumn dish my favorite, but it was a highlight. As above, the smell and presentation evoked the flora of a forest on an autumn day. Not necessarily the food of autumn.. more like an edible scene.. atbleast for me.
As for people watching on my visit. I wasn't able to people watch as I was facing the mirrored walls, and seated next to the bathroom hall entrance. Add to that a semi overly drunk couple who was arguing ( and left at the foie and cider donut course) I believe that that guys date had a bit too much of the wine pairings. Luckily that was early in our meal, as they had an earlier start time. But it prevented me from looking around.
Lastly, I really hope they continue adding special pricing on certain tickets. Those $35 dollar seats were a steal. With tax and tip with no pairing for the four of us was $187 and change. (I did add a pairing that night but that was my initial purchase price)Far less than what I paid for for my same day tix for Paris or my tix for Thailand. This is such a great deal and makes it affordable for those who otherwise might skip going as the menu is priced out of their range.
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Post #65 - November 11th, 2011, 12:08 pmI probably haven't spent enough time in forests to fully appreciate the Autumn Scene. I'm also biased against the practice of adding artificial scents as a component of a dish. I don't mean that the scents come from unnatural compounds, just that they are not the scents of the food I'm eating. I dislike that. I like to put my nose down into the bowl or plate, and smell what's about to enter my mouth. I felt deprived of that enjoyment by the Autumn Scene dish and, frankly, most of the things I had at dinner that night. Sometimes because various burning elements distracted me, and sometimes because elaborate plating required the food to be served at a cooler temperature than what would be required to produce full, natural food aromas....defended from strong temptations to social ambition by a still stronger taste for tripe and onions." Screwtape in The Screwtape Letters by CS Lewis
Fuckerberg on Food
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Post #66 - November 11th, 2011, 4:09 pmpacent wrote:So tip and tax are included in the meal, but not the pairing?
I don't know if it's possible to purchase pairings along with the tickets, since a friend bought our tickets for us. However, you can certainly purchase pairings at the time of your meal, as we did (and I assume individual beverages are also available). Three different pairings were offered: an upgraded wine pairing, a standard wine pairing ($62), and a pairing of various non-alcoholic beverages ($38, which I thought was rather steep). They add the tax and tip on the beverage bill they provide at the end of the meal, and it has no space to add an additional tip even if you want to do so.Last edited by nsxtasy on November 11th, 2011, 4:12 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Post #67 - November 11th, 2011, 4:11 pmKennyz wrote:I probably haven't spent enough time in forests to fully appreciate the Autumn Scene. I'm also biased against the practice of adding artificial scents as a component of a dish. I don't mean that the scents come from unnatural compounds, just that they are not the scents of the food I'm eating. I dislike that. I like to put my nose down into the bowl or plate, and smell what's about to enter my mouth. I felt deprived of that enjoyment by the Autumn Scene dish and, frankly, most of the things I had at dinner that night. Sometimes because various burning elements distracted me, and sometimes because elaborate plating required the food to be served at a cooler temperature than what would be required to produce full, natural food aromas.
All fair. What can I say? It really grabbed me.
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Post #68 - November 12th, 2011, 12:03 pmKennyz wrote:I've now read a number of reports from people who say that the "Autumn Scene" was the greatest culinary success of the evening. I'd be interested in understanding why people thought that. The dish did have one of my favorite bites of the night: an intensely flavored miniature piece of broccoli. But beyond that it just seemed like a dozen discordant fried leaves and things designed to look like hay. Then some hardened powders with indiscernible taste; they were there to remind people of pebbles, if I recall correctly. Though there were some tasty bits of food on the plate, as a composed dish I thought this was close to a disaster.
I listed it (above) as one of my favorites, but I have to be honest, I can't easily explain why it was included in that list. Why not? Well, it was one of the more complex dishes that can't be boiled down to just a few words, it came in the middle of a long, late dinner, and the wine pourings were quite generous. But at the time, everyone at my table all proclaimed it our favorite dish thus far and that it held the top spot throughout the rest of the dinner.
Feed it to me sober where it's not preceded or followed by 4 other courses and I'll give you a better description of why I like it!
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Post #69 - November 12th, 2011, 6:14 pmOf all of the dishes the Autumn Scene was the most intellectually challenging of the dishes. It revealed in its multiple parts a culinary intelligence. Several dishes seemed overly playful, but this constituted a "salad" as imagined by a child. At the same time the dish paid heed to the NOMA-style commitment to gathering and foraging and a commitment to high quality ingredients.Toast, as every breakfaster knows, isn't really about the quality of the bread or how it's sliced or even the toaster. For man cannot live by toast alone. It's all about the butter. -- Adam Gopnik
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Post #70 - November 13th, 2011, 2:20 amKennyz wrote:Maybe I’m burying the lead when I say that I didn’t care much for the food at Next Childhood. Perhaps I should focus on how well the staff balanced whimsy with professionalism, creating an environment that invoked the child aesthetic without coming across as too kitschy. Maybe I should admire attention to detail that went into the plating and write about the thoughtful, tasty beverage pairings. But I can’t. Thinking about the non-food elements of the evening continues to bring smiles to my face, but the fleeting smiles are replaced by bitter frowns when I think about the food.
Tapioca maltodextrin abounds on this menu, and in each case it plays an unpleasant part. “Hot dog powder” – intended to be mixed in to macaroni and cheese – was chalky and artificial-tasting. Pebble-sized pieces of a variety of maltodextrined this-or-that saw there essences completely lost amidst a dish with a dozen kinds of fried leaves, vegetables, and “hay”. They did not fail to contribute their characteristic chalky, gummy texture though.
Presentation trumped taste in almost every dish. “Fish and chips” included a cute little stick figure made of some kind of balsamic syrup. Something had been done to the syrup to render it thick and paint-like, and it was nearly impossible to lift it off the plate to incorporate into a bite of a food. Sad, since the dish really could have used a hit of acid. Mac and cheese had 5 little pods of disparate toppings surrounding the outskirt of the bowl, creating a dish intended to induce nostalgia rather than make sense as a plate of food. Sweet potato pieces designed to look like campfire logs accomplished that goal, but the potatoes themselves were bland and in desperate need of more robust seasoning. A “hamburger” course had gelled mayo, a bun that had been pureed into a sauce or something, and some pretty colors. It was fun to look at and contemplate, and tasted maybe a quarter as good as an actual burger. Dainty brussels sprouts cups were blanched into flavorlessness, then filled with various gels and pastes. A plate of roasted brussels sprouts would have been more enjoyable.
To be sure, some things at Next Childhood tasted good, and adjectives like fun, entertaining, and professional described it well. Delicious, unfortunately, was not one of those adjectives.
This comes closest as a description to my meal at Next. A for effort, but in the end, I left unsatisfied in terms of flavors and food experience. I was hoping for more in terms of food and less in terms of dinner theater. I applaud them for their hard work but in the end, the food should not be about how hard the chef or cooks work, it should be about the pleasure it gives the diner.
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Post #71 - November 14th, 2011, 9:21 pmWe were at Next Saturday night - a lucky foursome with the $35 tickets - and thought it was wonderful. We had drinks at Aviary beforehand then the nonalcoholic pairing. I felt this pairing was particularly right for the menu ... with the root beer so wonderful and the pumpkin chai as well. We were not so sure about the lemonade which we liked but felt was not the best pairing for the soup but the aroma of the apple juice was perfection.
The meal was just really lovely ... Each dish pleased ... each evoked a memory, brought a grin or a wow. There were a lot of small touches like the superb celery in the chicken noodle soup or the tomato with the mac and cheese that just sang. Favorites amongst our table were Autumn (including for the two of us who are not really mushroom fans), fish n' chips and mac and cheese. Hot chocolate and Armagnac was a particularly nice way to end ... the soundtrack was perfect ... service fun and of course perfectly polished.
I wonder if some folk approach Next as if it is designed to be Alinea 2 when instead it seems more playful, experimental ... great chef, great team seeing what they can do with various interesting food themes ... I really enjoyed going along for the exploration this time, would love to do it again ... and we relished every minute of the evening.
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Post #72 - November 14th, 2011, 9:28 pmSiun wrote:I wonder if some folk approach Next as if it is designed to be Alinea 2 ....
Not me. In fact I've never been to Alinea 1. I just approached Next the way I approach pretty much any restaurant - in search of a delicious meal. I fully accept that there are reasons besides deliciousness to love a meal, but those are not reasons that matter as much to me....defended from strong temptations to social ambition by a still stronger taste for tripe and onions." Screwtape in The Screwtape Letters by CS Lewis
Fuckerberg on Food
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Post #73 - November 14th, 2011, 9:57 pmAh, but I found it delicious. I definitely cleaned my plate of every savory course and have been dreaming of the mac and cheese and the fish with tartar foam and breading ...
but also smiling at the memories.
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Post #74 - November 14th, 2011, 11:26 pmSiun wrote:I wonder if some folk approach Next as if it is designed to be Alinea 2 when instead it seems more playful, experimental ...
I see it as just the opposite, Alinea 1/2. Testing the boundaries of what that team could have done if they'd decided not to go the *** route, but instead remained closer to their playful and experimental, dare I say original, nature.
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Post #75 - November 30th, 2011, 5:25 pmI'll keep this short and sweet:
I thought the Childhood menu was better than the Thai menu. But this is also the first meal at Next that I have been so uncomfortably full at the end of that I couldn't even eat the dessert. I would have changed the order and some portions.
I am also interested in seeing them get back to the time/place concept.
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Post #76 - November 30th, 2011, 6:39 pmfranklincampo - Did you receive any extra courses with your meal? I hadn't really heard anything about the portions being bigger than Paris or Thailand.
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Post #77 - November 30th, 2011, 10:29 pmHurdler4eva wrote:franklincampo - Did you receive any extra courses with your meal? I hadn't really heard anything about the portions being bigger than Paris or Thailand.
I can't compare to other meals at Next, since the Childhood menu was my only visit. But I did not think it was an unusually large amount of food. None of the portion sizes was overly generous, and I'd describe the total amount of food as average at best.
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Post #78 - November 30th, 2011, 11:28 pmnsxtasy wrote:Hurdler4eva wrote:franklincampo - Did you receive any extra courses with your meal? I hadn't really heard anything about the portions being bigger than Paris or Thailand.
I can't compare to other meals at Next, since the Childhood menu was my only visit. But I did not think it was an unusually large amount of food. None of the portion sizes was overly generous, and I'd describe the total amount of food as average at best.
I hate to jump in here without posting previously about my experience at Childhood (11/11) because I enjoyed the meal immensely . . . but I also thought it was a ton of food. In fact, I couldn't come close to finishing either dessert. I'm going back in a couple weeks and looking forward to seeing how the meal differs from the first time. Last time I was in the dining room. My upcoming visit will be at the kitchen table, which means there will be even more food this time.
=R=By protecting others, you save yourself. If you only think of yourself, you'll only destroy yourself. --Kambei Shimada
Every human interaction is an opportunity for disappointment --RS
There's a horse loose in a hospital --JM
That don't impress me much --Shania Twain
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Post #79 - December 1st, 2011, 12:07 amronnie_suburban wrote:My upcoming visit will be at the kitchen table, which means there will be even more food this time.
Quake and tremble at the sight of the enormous Jell-o mold... fear it!!!!!
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Post #80 - December 1st, 2011, 8:27 amThe childhood menu at Next just got 4 stars from Vettel/Tribune.
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Post #81 - December 1st, 2011, 5:40 pmHurdler4eva wrote:franklincampo - Did you receive any extra courses with your meal?
We were not served the brussels sprouts pictured above.Dlongs wrote:The childhood menu at Next just got 4 stars from Vettel/Tribune.
Link
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Post #82 - December 1st, 2011, 9:22 pmNo Brussels Sprouts here either ...
I found the quantity of food pretty right on - I did nibble rather than devour the sweets but I just about licked my plates clean on the savories - and I tend to be a light eater.
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Post #83 - December 1st, 2011, 10:07 pmnsxtasy wrote:Hurdler4eva wrote:franklincampo - Did you receive any extra courses with your meal?
We were not served the brussels sprouts pictured above.Dlongs wrote:The childhood menu at Next just got 4 stars from Vettel/Tribune.
Link
Mike Sula has mad respect for Next but didn't enjoy it as much at Vettel did (or as much as the previous Next menus) . . .at The Chicago Reader, Mike Sula wrote:As thrilling as each of Next's productions have been, maybe that's why this was my least favorite. Childhood isn't all happy memories, and the eating during my own was frequently unhappy (I was picky and unadventurous). Maybe I'm too close to the subject matter to be fully transported back to that place. A willingness to play along is essential at Next, and if you can't or won't, you just won't get it.
But I wouldn't tell anyone attempting to score tickets through Next's Facebook page not to try to get to the remaining days of Childhood. It remains the most consistently imaginative and entertaining of dining experiences anywhere. That this crew continues to turn on a dime every three months and execute on this level demonstrates a kind of consistency that the doddering fools who failed to award it a Michelin star are too old and hidebound to understand.
The wonder years at Next
=R=By protecting others, you save yourself. If you only think of yourself, you'll only destroy yourself. --Kambei Shimada
Every human interaction is an opportunity for disappointment --RS
There's a horse loose in a hospital --JM
That don't impress me much --Shania Twain
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Post #84 - December 2nd, 2011, 8:01 amI believe the kitchen sends out the brussel sprouts to a certain number of tables per night. We were lucky to get the brussel sprouts while the table next to us who were almost synchronized with us did not. The same thing happened with the Paris menu and the gougeres.
We also got the bubblegum float but I believe that was more due to the fact of how slow the courses were coming out. We had several 15+ minute breaks between courses. We didn't mind but I'm sure our server noticed it.
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Post #85 - December 4th, 2011, 11:56 amWe ate at Next last night, and from a pure entertainment standpoint this was my favorite menu. I went in with low expectations on the food, and I think that helped me enjoy it much more than I thought it would.
I don't know why more people don't talk about the burger course. Maybe I just ate a lot of McDonald's growing up, but no course evoked more memories for me than this one. The "bun sauce" in particular was just so spot on. I also really enjoyed both the fish course and the lunch box (helped in no small part by the fact that I got a Knight Rider thermos).
There were certainly a few misses as well. The soup, I thought, was bland. The donuts in the "foie-sting" course were served cold, and they were hard and dense. Not very pleasant to eat. This is how they came out for our entire table, so it seems to be a conscious choice by the restaurant. Why they aren't serving these donuts hot is beyond me, and really sticks out as something they should have thought of. I also wasn't nuts about the autumn scene. For me, it didn't evoke a walk in the woods. It actually evoked a walk through a Phish concert. With four smoldering logs placed on the table, the only scent I got was that of cheap weed. I asked our server about this, and with a slight smile he agreed (he has a friend that calls this "the bong course"). I didn't grow up in Michigan in the mid 80's so who knows.
In any event, this was a really fun dining experience and I did enjoy most of the food. Obviously this is the most conceptual menu to date, and I give the Next team a ton of credit for (mostly) pulling it off.
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Post #86 - December 4th, 2011, 12:07 pmjesteinf wrote:The donuts in the "foie-sting" course were served cold, and they were hard and dense. Not very pleasant to eat. This is how they came out for our entire table, so it seems to be a conscious choice by the restaurant. Why they aren't serving these donuts hot is beyond me, and really sticks out as something they should have thought of.
FWIW, ours were piping hot.jesteinf wrote:I also wasn't nuts about the autumn scene. For me, it didn't evoke a walk in the woods. It actually evoked a walk through a Phish concert. With four smoldering logs placed on the table, the only scent I got was that of cheap weed. I asked our server about this, and with a slight smile he agreed (he has a friend that calls this "the bong course").
I've wondered about this. I loved it, but ours was barely smoldering and there wasn't even any visible smoke, though the scent was clearly there. On the other hand, I saw some going out to the dining room that were billowing smoke, and I thought to myself that those would have been overpowering, but I figured they must have died quickly on their way out (we were at the kitchen table and saw them as they were just leaving the kitchen). Perhaps this was not the case?
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Post #87 - December 4th, 2011, 12:22 pmjesteinf wrote:I don't know why more people don't talk about the burger course. Maybe I just ate a lot of McDonald's growing up, but no course evoked more memories for me than this one.
I didn't grow up eating "classic" kid's food (no mac & cheese, few hot dogs, no bologna sandwiches on white bread), but occasionally got a McD's hamburger as a treat, so this also evoked a lot of memories for me, too.
We were seated next to a table that actually brought a Happy Meal for the kitchen. One of the diners apparently worked for McDonald's. Not sure if they knew of the hamburger course in advance.
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Post #88 - December 4th, 2011, 1:43 pmI would think at this point i the season that they should be able to get the donuts to each table hot. Hopefully this isn't a kitchen table vs the rest of the restaurant sort of thing. Anyway, it was disappointing that a team as talented as the one they've got at Next screwed up what should be a no brainier.
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Post #89 - December 4th, 2011, 1:54 pmjesteinf wrote:I would think at this point i the season that they should be able to get the donuts to each table hot.
Completely agreed. Didn't mean to suggest otherwise.
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Post #90 - December 4th, 2011, 2:12 pmGot it, no worries.
One other thing I forgot to mention was the truffled Oreo in the lunch box. I loved everything about it.
