my last abominable meal @ LTH

given this place chance after chance but last nite, when the first dish arrived after an insufferable 20 minutes, i called it official quits @ 12:20am, 1/30/05.

ordered the highly touted salt/pepper shrimp + 5 spice chicken (which i presumed to be a cold dish) which turned out not available.. much to my own dismay, i subbed the horrific choice of HK style fried rice (said nothing to that effect in Chinese) under duress.

15 minutes pass. no food. restaurant had 1 othr table. spoke to the waitress: "it'll be out right away". 5 more minutes pass, 'HK style beef fried rice' shows up poorly prepared (unevenly stir fried; lettuce was used a filler/texturization?) I ... HATE lettuce in Chinese food. don't care what city this fried rice originated, lettuce doesn't belong in it. So I wait. another 5 minutes ticks by, the salt/pepper shrimp finally arrives, but only after i loudly ask the waitress for my check.

the restaurant got rowdy with a group of teenagers that ordered 4 plates of 'chicken fried rice' and another couple asking for 'sweet and sour sauce' for their "beef with green peper"... I was furious. furious because the salt/pepper shrimp was abhorable w/ too much green onion/onion/non-spicy japapeno peppers, & almost no ground white/black pepper. who the heck puts green onions/onions in salt n pepper shrimp??? where's the garlic?? where's the peppers in the "Salt and Pepper"???

but let's first go back 20 minutes. the tea served while this saga played... undrinkably black. and luke warm. Now I like my tea pretty darned cooked, but this was ridiculous. the rice served w/ the salt/pepper shrimp? also luke warm. lousy grain, tasted like mush, something my dentured grandmother back in Taipei would've loved.

the last few times @ LTH have all been after clubbin/before bar-hopping, ie, late at nite. the service always sucked, the food completely overpriced ($15++ for above snot i wouldn't even feed my golden retriever) and mediocre. folks, if you're all dying for whatever flavor eggplant, whatever styled salt/pepper shrimp at whatever odd hours of the nite, call me 30 minutes before coming to my apt. you wouldn't even have to tip me, just wash the dishes after you're fed.

Tony,

I have vowed to stop dancing like an organ grinders monkey every time some misguided soul says something negative about 'Little' Three Happiness.


Suffice to say I strongly disagree with your poor man's Harry V debasement of my favorite restaurant in Chicago.

And yes, 'Little' Three Happiness puts onions in their Salt & Pepper Shrimp, and it's damn good at that.


Gary

I feel your pain TonyC -- but, to be fair, wouldn't midnight be a tough time to expect something great from a restaurant, any restaurant, no matter how great?

G Wiv wrote:your poor man's Harry V debasement of my favorite restaurant

The best quote of the new year.

TonyC wrote: 'HK style beef fried rice' shows up poorly prepared (unevenly stir fried; lettuce was used a filler/texturization?) I ... HATE lettuce in Chinese food. don't care what city this fried rice originated, lettuce doesn't belong in it.

I beg to differ... There are some styles of fried rice that HAS lettuce in it. Just because you "hate" lettuce, does not mean that dishes have to be prepared a different way. Besides, from your posts, you sound like you are Chinese, and if you did not want lettuce in your fried rice, maybe you should have made a special request to exclude it. The fried rice was probably "Yang zhou" fried rice... and yes, lettuce belongs in it.

Another well made point by hot tamale... Midnight is not a great time to expect 5 star quality dishes from a restaurant. I am sure the chefs in the kitchen are not sleeping there just on the off chance that someone with as sophisticated taste buds as you have, would stop in at midnight...

(Gary, allow me to dance like a monkey in your honor)

My last outstanding meal at LTH

Not long ago, I enjoyed a fantastic meal at LTH orchestrated by G Wiv and attended by approximately 30 enthusiastic LTHers, friends, and kin. My lofty expectations were surpassed by an meal at LTH that I would describe "eye-rolling-ly good".

Shrimp Toast: This cliche of a dish is raised to new heights at LTH, each piece of toast topped with a healthy mound of shrimp and fried to crispy, golden perfection. Topped with a bit of their potent mustard sauce, it was a nearly perfect appetizer.

Salt and Pepper Shrimp (shell & head on, extra crispy, extra peppers): I would rank this dish among the finest dishes I have ever had at a Chinese restaurant. A perfect balance of spices, crispiness, juiciness, and fresh shrimp flavor. The presence of onion didn't make me blink.

Crispy Skin Chicken: Crispy skin, juicy chicken. Who could ask for anything more?

Greens (Pea shoots w/garlic & Watercress w/fermented tofu): The freshness and flavor of these dishes were only elevated by Gary's chili oil. These were an excellent complement to the shrimp and chicken.

Rice noodles (well-done) with duck and veggies: A very good preparation, if only slightly over-dressed. We also had many plates of plain crispy rice noodles (my weakness). I think a dish halfway between the two would be perfect: Crispy rice noodles with a few pieces of sliced duck.

Crab (I forget the sauce): Succulent, but a lot of work. It takes a dedicated soul to work the crab bits from the shell, but I always enjoy the challenge.

Short ribs in XO sauce: Probably my least favorite dish, but I still went for seconds. The pepper and sauce overwhelmed the meat flavor of the ribs, hampering my enjoyment.

Overall, my most recent (and first) trip to LTH was full of excellent flavors and textures. It was skillfully executed by the staff and the company created a truly excellent experience. It's a little more than two weeks later and I'm still thinking about those shrimp.

Best,
Michael / EC

the restaurant got rowdy with a group of teenagers that ordered 4 plates of 'chicken fried rice' and another couple asking for 'sweet and sour sauce' for their "beef with green peper"

These are the kinds of discerning patrons most 24-hr restaurants have to deal with as night drags into morning. Stick with the White Palace Grill for after-hour gastronomy on the South Side. You should be looking for Edward Hopper, not Craig Clairbourne.

White Palace Grill
1159 S. Canal St.

CrazyC wrote:The fried rice was probably "Yang zhou" fried rice... and yes, lettuce belongs in it.

^^^^
i'd like this proven academically. An actual Chinese recipe faxed/scanned/jpg'd would suffice. Would love to read a Mandarin Chinese recipe for Yang Zhou chow fan including 'Iceberg Lettuce' as an ingredient. You know... I'm not a gambling man, but i'd put a $20 wager on this.

and no, it wasn't yang zhou chow fan. as i specifically written, it was inepted named 'HK style fried rice'. I've had fried rice in HK several times. There wasn't any lettuce. There was NO way for me to have known there'd be lettuce in the HK style fried rice, hence there was no way I could've told the waitress to hold the lettuce while ordering. See the catch 22?

as far as attributing the failure of fine dining due to lateness of time. I figure if you can't cook as well @ 1am, perhaps your restaurant shouldn't open til 1am???

jbw wrote:Stick with the White Palace Grill for after-hour gastronomy on the South Side.

really appreciate the tip as I do live on the southside... but this wasn't a viable option for me at the time. By default, I crave Chinese, if not Asian, food...

I should probably apologize for slamming ("debase" is too euphemistic and doesn't do my feelings justice) the namesake. While the neighbor's crab in onion sauce (ie, probably the same as "Crab (I forget the sauce)") did look excellent, it's not always possible for me to order a 5 course, $12/entree, meal for 2 simply to find 2 agreeable dishes). Still, no matter how appealing this future meal MAY be, i'm not willing to wait 30 minutes for the first dish to come out, drink crap tea, and eat mushed rice. Especially at a Chinese restaurant...

TonyC wrote:as far as attributing the failure of fine dining due to lateness of time. I figure if you can't cook as well @ 1am, perhaps your restaurant shouldn't open til 1am???

TonyC,

Point well taken...though I think it's possible that many restaurants probably reserve their A team for busier hours.

Surely, no one is surprised that your post has taken some fire, and I must admit, my last trip to LTH was not on par with previous dinners (the newbes who came with me were delighted, but I felt some dishes were flawed..or at least not up to previous visits) and the wait time for dishes was unusually long.

All that said, this was the first slightly unsatisfactory meal I've had there, so I'm willing to chalk it up to the normal inconsistency one might find in any kitchen staffed by fallible humans.

Just curious, as you've mentioned the tea twice, my experience at most restaurants, Chinese or otherwise, is that the tea is substandard. Are there any joints that serve tea you feel is especially good?

Hammond

TonyC wrote:i'd like this proven academically. An actual Chinese recipe faxed/scanned/jpg'd would suffice. Would love to read a Mandarin Chinese recipe for Yang Zhou chow fan including 'Iceberg Lettuce' as an ingredient. You know... I'm not a gambling man, but i'd put a $20 wager on this.

Deal... I am heading home in a day or two, and I will try and find a Chinese cookbook for Yang Zhou fried rice with lettuce. Though, fried rice is basically a vehicle to re-use left overs. In fact fried rice is best made with day old rice. So basically you could put anything in to the recipe and it will still be fried rice. A simple google search for "fried rice recipe lettuce" gave me no less than 5 recipes that incorporated lettuce. In fact, this link brings you to a recipe with lettuce that won a Fried Rice competition in 2001. But I have a sneaking suspicion that this will not be enough to appease you, so I will go ahead and find you that cookbook.

TonyC wrote:and no, it wasn't yang zhou chow fan. as i specifically written, it was inepted named 'HK style fried rice'. I've had fried rice in HK several times. There wasn't any lettuce.

Funny, because in my 16 years growing up in Hong Kong, and Singapore, I have had fried rice with lettuce...

I am not saying that all the fried rice dishes I have had had lettuce, I am saying that just because you have "had fried rice in HK several times" and "there's wasn't any lettuce", that does not mean that all fried rice dishes in Hong Kong doesn't have lettuce.

But this is becoming a rather stupid discussion... we are arguing over a dish that has no set ingredient list (except rice of course). I mean, if I do not eat eggs, there would be NO way for me to have known there'd be eggs in the HK style fried rice, right? Same arguments for peas, carrots, onions, etc...

If the dish was called "HK style beef fried rice with lettuce", I guess you will be ok with that... which then means that if you want garlic in your Salt and Pepper Shrimp, wouldn't it be better for you to order "Salt and Pepper Shrimp with Garlic"?

Just curious, as you've mentioned the tea twice, my experience at most restaurants, Chinese or otherwise, is that the tea is substandard. Are there any joints that serve tea you feel is especially good?

you know, i really really love the tea at spoon. i asked them what it was and they just described it as "thai tea." It's never bitter, always fragrant and fresh tasting. and it has this certain almost gummy quality that i find completely irresistable. more than once i have found myself lingering at the table, leftovers packaged and on the seat next to me, sheepishly hoping for one more fill-up.

CrazyC wrote:Deal... I am heading home in a day or two, and I will try and find a Chinese cookbook for Yang Zhou fried rice with lettuce. Though, fried rice is basically a vehicle to re-use left overs. In fact fried rice is best made with day old rice. So basically you could put anything in to the recipe and it will still be fried rice. A simple google search for "fried rice recipe lettuce" gave me no less than 5 recipes that incorporated lettuce.

I'll succumb to the premise that there MAY be lettuce in "HK style" fried rice and thus rendering my complain about the lettuce pointless. But even glossing over this pt, the "HK style fried rice", was, still, lousy. I believe you specifically brought up the point of Yangzhou fried rice containing lettuce, and it is specifically that point I'm wagering the $20. To be a good sport, I'll email Yangzhou city's Foreign Affairs office asking if lettuce is 'typically' used in the city's infamous fried rice. FWIW, googling "Yangzhou "fried rice" lettuce" yields zero interpretations of your "Yangzhou fried rice". NOT that English google is an authoritative source.

CrazyC wrote:Funny, because in my 16 years growing up in Hong Kong, and Singapore, I have had fried rice with lettuce...

You bring up Hong Kong and Singapore as country of origin/youth and I'll argue both countries/city-states were occupied by Western forces which injected untraditional ingredients into both culture and hence, cuisine. (Heck, even the prostitutes in Singapore fluent English). If a recipe from a Singaporean publisher is surrendered, I'll ask for me US$20

CrazyC wrote:But this is becoming a rather stupid discussion...

Don't think so. It is the tired circular authenticity discussion. Chinese fried rice w/ lettuce is unauthentic, hence I don't want to see lettuce in my fried rice. I don't not like lettuce for lettuce's sake. You may mock my wonting of garlic in the salt/pepper shrimp. Yet you and I both know if we traversed greater lands inhabited by the Chinese (sans Singapore), we'd most likely (and in a statistical fashion) find garlic in salt/pepper shrimp, but not white onions. A plate of salt/pepper shrimp w/ onions and no chopped garlic is a disservice to the dish. Eventually, after enough of this bastardized version is served, people (and let's just say Americans???) begin to believe what they're eating is, really, salt and pepper shrimp. And I'll say we've erred.

Okay, let's play nice here. TonyC, your definition of "authenticity" seems to be getting close to "what I grew up on," which is kind of CrazyC's point-- you may hate lettuce in fried rice but it's hardly unknown if she grew up with it (and if Hong Kong isn't a Chinese enough place for authentic Chinese for you, then it's hard for me to see how any restaurant in Chicago will ever live up to your standards). Anyway, your distaste for LTH's rendition is understood, now let's move on before the next dish is dead horse.

unfortunately, i had a substandard meal @ lth as well. i was ready for an iconic meal. i mean you named the website after it which has been responsible for showing me numerous wonderful meals since i've been back in town. 3 out of 4 plates ordered were barely edible and remained 1/2 eaten, to ones apparent concern (it was around 10 p.m.) and the tea tasted like dirty socks. bad service and long waits for food as well. disappointment all around. the salt and pepper smelt were the only redeeming item i'd like to go back with some other lth'ers to see what you see, eat what you eat, although that's a bit unfair. a place should stand on it's own without the benefit (which i admit i bask in) of preferential treatment. show me the lite.


it is true that the "a" team is often not working the odd hours, but i also believe that if you choose to remain open and can't accommodate your clientele w/consistency and quality, it's more about the mismanagement and greed of the owner. it's not like your getting a 30% discount because the chef is 30% worse than the norm. did i mention how bad the tea was?

Since you did not go with LTHers perhaps you went to the wrong Three Happiness.I know there are two and I believe that has happened before.

the little one on the n side of the st is the one i went to. the big one on the corner deteriorated years ago. used to be a place called hong min that was good a few doors down from lth. but it is no longer there.

jazzfood wrote: used to be a place called hong min that was good a few doors down from lth. but it is no longer there.

It tragically burned down a year or so ago. THere are rumors of a reopening in a new location in the works.

jazzfood wrote:the little one on the n side of the st is the one i went to. the big one on the corner deteriorated years ago. used to be a place called hong min that was good a few doors down from lth. but it is no longer there.

LTH is, I believe, on that block where Hong Min was, LTH being a bit to the east of the Hong Min site and so nearer to Wentworth. But is that not the south side of the street?

Antonius

Antonius wrote:

jazzfood wrote: But is that not the south side of the street?Antonius

Yes, I'm guessing jazzfood just got directions mixed up. I think he went to the "right" LTH (though it may have been wrong for him that night...it happens)

Hammond

my bad. it is the s side of the street a few doors e of where hong min was. besides your raves, i wouldn't go back without one of you. my meal/service/experience was not even approaching good.

My wife and I ate at LTH yesterday- I was not that impressed, but it's difficult to judge a place on a few dishes.

I didn't think that the salt and pepper shrimp was all that flavorful, although the shrimp were definitely fresh. I put it over some rice with a little bit of sweet-and-sour sauce, chili and garlic oil, and some soy sauce and it was better.

My wife's crispy chicken looked great, but the chicken was pretty dry- I did like the coating.

Eggrolls were below average- the outer coating was somewhat pasty rather than crunchy.

The potstickers were average, although I've had better.

My daughter's won-ton soup was excellent.

Saps

I have nothing to add to the discussion of LTH's food per se, as I haven't been there yet. I would like to opine that I think it is both funny and utterly apt - spiritually perfect - that the site is named for a tiny place that most of the world has never heard of and about which those who have are in passionate disagreement over. Wouldn't have it any other way.

Looking forward to going there someday -- say, midweek around 6:30, with a wink and a request for Gary's chili oil before my order hits the kitchen.

while i admittedly don't mind the perks of being in the biz and being well treated, on the flip side, i never much cared for places you needed to know someone to eat well @.

jazzfood wrote:while i admittedly don't mind the perks of being in the biz and being well treated, on the flip side, i never much cared for places you needed to know someone to eat well @.

Don't know if this is what you were implying, but I don't think you need to "know someone" to eat well at LTH. I certainly don't (well, I do know some people, but none of them are connected to LTH) and I have had several fantastic meals there recently. I really think the crispy skin chicken is one of the best chicken dishes I have ever had...

However, I probably would not have had such good experiences (or even thought about going there) if I hadn't found out (from this site) what the best things on the menu are....but that is also true of many other great local restaurants.

I have to bring this back from the dead (again). I took too the GWiv tour of LTH for the first time (I can't believe it has been this long either) and I too had a outstanding meal. While there was one miss, due to a miscomunication that left us with beef rather than beef short ribs with XO, everything else on the grand tour was great. Well I should mention that, again believe it or not, I a Jewish boy from West Hartford, CT, had egg fu young (in all it's terrible splendor ) for the first time yesterday! Bowls of steming guts in red oil? No problem! Egg fu young? A bit scary! Anyway, Tony you know you and I have pretty similar tastes, I think it is just a matter of timing and ordering the right dishes with great specificity. That, as a matter of fact is why I held out so long in going, I wanted to make sure I did it right the first time.... I did... Thanks for comming all!

jazzfood wrote:


it is true that the "a" team is often not working the odd hours, but i also believe that if you choose to remain open and can't accommodate your clientele w/consistency and quality, it's more about the mismanagement and greed of the owner. it's not like your getting a 30% discount because the chef is 30% worse than the norm. did i mention how bad the tea was?

Actually, many of the best meals I've had in Chinatown have been in the wee hours (also true in HK). Some restaurants here, like Seven Treasures and Happy Chef actually seem to improve after 10pm and are often quite busy at that time. Other restaurants, including Mountain View Chef, Kam Fong and again, Happy Chef offer a special deal after 10pm where almost anything on the menu is available in a smaller portion for $2.99-3.99 making this a great time to visit as even a smaller group can get a wider selection of dishes than would otherwise be the case.

consistancy is what i'm talking about. not the time of day. with well trained staff it should be seamless regardless of who's cooking.

I could have posted in one of five LTH threads, but figured this one would get the quickest responses.

I am still having good experiences at LTH, but can't seem to get them to make the Xanadu-promised "BBQ Pork and Duck pan-fried noodles". I end up with an extra charge and crispy chow mein with brown glop. Damn good brown glop, but brown glop just the same.

Can someone who has been there recently tell me the menu item description / number, or if it's off-menu, what you are doing to get them to make this delicious looking and sounding dish? Many thanks!

Santander wrote:I could have posted in one of five LTH threads, but figured this one would get the quickest responses.

Sweet Mama I hate this subject line, silently curse TonyC each and every time it come up.

Though you were right, it captured my attention right quick.

Crisp rice noodles (chow fu) w/bbq and roast duck is an off menu item, though it's comprised of standards so it should be (fairly) easy to order.

Here is my ordering technique, pretty much verbatim.
Crisp (make breaking motion with hands) rice noodle, chow fun, with BBQ pork and roast duck, very light gravy, mixed veg and crisp (once again make breaking motion with hands) rice noodle. Light gravy please.

Yes, more than a little redundant, but it works for me.

Crisp Rice Noodle w/BBQ pork and roast duck @ LTH [Not abominable in the least]


Enjoy,
Gary

'Little' Three Happiness
209 W Cermak
Chicago, IL

I took my brother-in-law, nephew and The Wife to LTH last Sunday night.

Here's how the opening conversation went:

ME: We'd like to get some appetizers. How about some salt and pepper shrimp...

WAITER (smirking): That's not an appetizer...

ME (raising eyebrows, but unwilling to press the point): Okay, well, how about shrimp toast...

WAITER (pointing to The Wife): I don't think she'd like it...

ME (incredulous): What? She's been here like six times. We've had it before...

WAITER: Well, you know, sometimes Americans...

ME (indulgently, though steaming): Shrimp toast. Two orders. Please.

Waiter reluctantly brings shrimp toast. Later, I ask if it's okay to order the salt and pepper shrimp, which looked nothing like the beautiful plate shown on WTTW last night. Ours had clumps of tempura batter all over it. Disappointing...but of course I will return.