Sustainable fisheries is a very good thing in my book. At least there is some scientific firepower about fish populations and breeding densities and all that whatnot.

But as a concept sustainability in general is just fashionable nonsense. It gives a patina of wholesomeness just by using the word.


Organic labeling just means food was raised in a certain way. It also gives a patina of wholesomeness and allows a premium - pretty much the Whole Foods business model. Just because modern fertilizer was not used does not mean the food is safer, tastier or better for the environment.

I'm done with meaningless labeling like Lite, Light, Natural, etc. that are not regulated by the gov'mint.

I wholeheartedly agree that I don't need to see truffle oil, chipotle, cupcakes, and bacon (except in strip form for breakfast) for at least all of 2013. We'll talk again during the Winter Olympics.

Here are my food cliches:

Conveyor-belt-style fast casual: Maybe it's because I'm the polar opposite of a picky eater, but I have no desire to customize every iota on my sub, burrito, or vaguely Mediterranean wrap. Just make the best sandwich possible. I trust you.

Domestic Kobe beef: liar. Kobe is about six months from going full-Angus. Why's it always in a slider?

Greek yogurt: I actually like Greek (and other) yogurt, but its supporters have become fanatical.

Mariano's Fresh Market: see "Greek yogurt" above

mike

Mikelipino wrote:Greek yogurt: I actually like Greek (and other) yogurt, but its supporters have become fanatical.

Greek yogurt is probably at least as bad a lie as kobe beef these days. Greek yogurt ought to be reg'lar ol' yogurt with less water... but many of the brands have more ingredients than standard yogurts: thickeners, gelatine, etc.
Avoid that. I can't say that any of the fakes are actually cheaper either.

Pie Lady wrote:I'm done with meaningless labeling like Lite, Light, Natural, etc. that are not regulated by the gov'mint.

All three of those terms are regulated by the US government (along with a bunch of others). 21 CFR 101.13 and Subpart D of Part 101

-Dan

Well I'll be jiggered. I thought those were just advertising terms to reel people in. Thanks!

AngrySarah wrote:Sustainable fisheries is a very good thing in my book. At least there is some scientific firepower about fish populations and breeding densities and all that whatnot.

But as a concept sustainability in general is just fashionable nonsense. It gives a patina of wholesomeness just by using the word.


Organic labeling just means food was raised in a certain way. It also gives a patina of wholesomeness and allows a premium - pretty much the Whole Foods business model. Just because modern fertilizer was not used does not mean the food is safer, tastier or better for the environment.

Compost is quite a modern technique, the methods used on organic farms were only developed in the last fifty years. However, that brings up another problem I have with organic certification in that factory farmed byproducts from conventional animal operations can be used in the compost. At least they aren't using sewage sludge.

Does anyone else find it unreasonable that we are forced to memorize all kinds of facts about fish or install apps on our phone to avoid fish harvested using methods that respected scientific organizations that study fisheries have advocated banning like bottom trawling? At least Whole Foods is phasing that stuff out, but whenever I am playing with the Seafood Watch app at the fish-monger I just can't believe something so destructive is even on sale. If the oceans were more visible. Bottom trawling is like burning down an entire forest to harvest some venison. I advise even my cynical friends to look into using things like Seafood Watch when buying seafood.

mgmcewen wrote:Does anyone else find it unreasonable that we are forced to memorize all kinds of facts about fish or install apps on our phone to avoid fish harvested using methods that respected scientific organizations that study fisheries have advocated banning like bottom trawling? At least Whole Foods is phasing that stuff out, but whenever I am playing with the Seafood Watch app at the fish-monger I just can't believe something so destructive is even on sale. If the oceans were more visible. Bottom trawling is like burning down an entire forest to harvest some venison. I advise even my cynical friends to look into using things like Seafood Watch when buying seafood.

Very well put.

mgmcewen wrote:Does anyone else find it unreasonable that we are forced to memorize all kinds of facts about fish or install apps on our phone to avoid fish harvested using methods that respected scientific organizations that study fisheries have advocated banning like bottom trawling? At least Whole Foods is phasing that stuff out, but whenever I am playing with the Seafood Watch app at the fish-monger I just can't believe something so destructive is even on sale. If the oceans were more visible. Bottom trawling is like burning down an entire forest to harvest some venison. I advise even my cynical friends to look into using things like Seafood Watch when buying seafood.

Most fisheries issues are tragedy-of-the-commons problems. If no-one has reason to keep fisheries sustained over a long time horizon, then the natural incentive is to extract as much as possible in the short-term, as somebody else will if they don't. If you've ever watched 'Deadliest Catch' on Discovery, you can see how it's possible to make money - in many cases, an extremely large amount of money - while protecting populations. The captains will bitch & moan about their quotas being cut, but they still buy-in because they know it's best for them in the long-term and nobody has an unfair advantage.

And fisher communities differ. When the Gulf of Maine haddock fishery collapsed in the 90s, the fishers eventually allowed scientists to go out in the boats with them. Some important information about spawning places and times were discovered, regulations were agreed upon, and recently this fishery was declared saved and sustainable.

Exactly the opposite happened with the cod fishing community: internal jealousies kept the scientists off the boats, and, IIRC, no real progress in scientific knowledge has been made, with whatever success has been had resulting from enforcement alone.

Tragedy of the Commons, precisely, Independent George.

Geo

Geo wrote:I'll see your postmodernism generator, and raise you a Sokal affair.

"a pastiche of Left-wing cant, fawning references, grandiose quotations, and outright nonsense . . . structured around the silliest quotations [by postmodernist academics] he could find about mathematics and physics".

I like it.