I loved the sour cream and anchovy dressing at Carsons, which was basically Green Goddess. My mom was making a Green Goddess before I had tasted Carsons.

Green Goddess Dressing

1 clove garlic
1 can of anchovies
1/4 cup fresh parsley
1 Tbs red wine vinegar
1 Tbs lemon juice
1/2 cup mayonnaise
1 cup sour cream
2 Tbs fresh chives

1. Place ingredients in blender and mix. Refrigerate overnight.

Servings: 6

Most GG recipes I've seen have tarragon, and sometimes other fresh herbs, on top of the parsley and chives/scallions.
I do a "Green Aztec Goddess" sometimes, using cilantro for the parsley and tarragon, add a serrano, and use lime juice in place of the lemon and vinegar... but otherwise still very similar (hmm... maybe I don't use a whole can of anchovies, that seems a bit much).

Yes, on the Green Goddess! Fabulously garlicky--story on the original: Green Goddess Dressing was created by Chef Phillip Roemer of San Francisco’s Palace Hotel in 1923 for a banquet in honor of actor George Arliss who was starring in William Archer’s play, “The Green Goddess.” I featured this 1940s chip dip version (from a “Let’s Eat Red Dot Potato Chips” company flyer) on my website: http://lostrecipesfound.com/recipe/gree ... -chip-dip/

...but a big "no!" on noodles romanoff and tomato aspic. The noodles dish was my mom's company favorite--unfortunately made with cheap canned conveniences like tuna, mushrooms and pimientos-- and we kids despised it. The tomato aspic made an appearance at my 8th grade graduation party. Poor mom--she aimed for elegant, but the kids just couldn't get with the idea of "tomato jello"

I do not recall tuna, mushrooms or pimento in noodles romanoff. It was a noodle dish with a sour cream slightly cheesy sauce maybe with a touch of garlic and it was delicious.

Toria--Glad to hear there were other better versions of noodles Romanoff out there! The dreaded tuna-mushroom-pimento rendition was just how my mom did it. Please do share your recipe and any history you have on its origins--thanks! In the meantime, I'll be delving into my vintage recipe books etc. to find best-ofs on this myself. I'll keep you posted...

Hmm. All I can recall was it was made from a box. I think it was betty crocker. There are many recipes if you google it but I have not tried any of them so I cannot endorse them. One recipe claims you need to get ahold of that Kraft orangy cheese powder stuff but the Noodles Romanoff that I was used to was very light colored more like white and it had little green flecks of dried chives or parsley. I think if I were going to prepare it I would make it with a bit of butter, some sour cream, some finely chopped chives and garlic with some parmesan cheese. To me a little sour cream goes a long way as it could get too gloppy. I will have to experiment with it soon.

toria wrote:Hmm. All I can recall was it was made from a box. I think it was betty crocker. There are many recipes if you google it but I have not tried any of them so I cannot endorse them. One recipe claims you need to get ahold of that Kraft orangy cheese powder stuff but the Noodles Romanoff that I was used to was very light colored more like white and it had little green flecks of dried chives or parsley. I think if I were going to prepare it I would make it with a bit of butter, some sour cream, some finely chopped chives and garlic with some parmesan cheese. To me a little sour cream goes a long way as it could get too gloppy. I will have to experiment with it soon.

Some of the "copy cat" recipes call for cream cheese as well as the sour cream. I do remember this Betty Crocker product, and it was not orange, but white as you said....

tarte tatin wrote:

toria wrote:Hmm. All I can recall was it was made from a box. I think it was betty crocker. There are many recipes if you google it but I have not tried any of them so I cannot endorse them. One recipe claims you need to get ahold of that Kraft orangy cheese powder stuff but the Noodles Romanoff that I was used to was very light colored more like white and it had little green flecks of dried chives or parsley. I think if I were going to prepare it I would make it with a bit of butter, some sour cream, some finely chopped chives and garlic with some parmesan cheese. To me a little sour cream goes a long way as it could get too gloppy. I will have to experiment with it soon.

Some of the "copy cat" recipes call for cream cheese as well as the sour cream. I do remember this Betty Crocker product, and it was not orange, but white as you said....

I found this image online of the Betty Crocker box, which does look kind of orange in color. (But who knows how true this image is to actual color.)
http://www.flickr.com/photos/80314182@N02/7458028874/

What I remember my mom buying was the Rice-A-Roni version, which is more white in color.
http://www.shopwell.com/pasta-roni-romanoff/nc/p/1530044024

My memory says that the color is too orange--I made it more than once in grad school and it was creamy white.

Geo

Just as recipes that have the word "DuBarry" in their names incorporate cauliflower and "Florentine" have spinach, recipes that use the word "Romanoff" invariably include sour cream - strawberries Romanoff, potatoes Romanoff, and yes, noodles Romanoff, boxed or not. The latter two seem to always include either chives and Parmesan cheese, too. All three recipes have one other thing in common: mid-20th century Hollywood restaurateur Michael Romanoff, who was Wolfgang Puck before there was Wolfgang Puck. Interesting fellow.

"Just as recipes that have the word "DuBarry" in their names incorporate cauliflower and "Florentine" have spinach, recipes that use the word "Romanoff" invariably include sour cream - strawberries Romanoff, potatoes Romanoff, and yes, noodles Romanoff, boxed or not. The latter two seem to always include either chives and Parmesan cheese, too. All three recipes have one other thing in common: mid-20th century Hollywood restaurateur Michael Romanoff, who was Wolfgang Puck before there was Wolfgang Puck. Interesting fellow."

Oh I am soooo intrigued! Will absolutely see what all I can find in the wake of Michael Romanoff, including a not-boxed noodles Romanoff. What fun--thanks!
--MKRogers

The Betty Crocker version was definitely orangey - the box image quite accurate actually - and the cheese component to the sauce (provided in a little paper packet) was a orangey cheese powder.

There were other brands with different styles but for me the BC orange version was .... heavenly.

Cool. I wondered where the Romanoff moniker came from. It seems though that perhaps what I had and remember was not the Betty Crocker version. I do know my mom made it from a package. It was tiny thin egg noodles in a white-ish sauce with little green flecks. Maybe another brand...I am thinking if I made it now I would make it with the Swabian noodles I get at Aldi. I really like those for times I do not have time to make spaetzle and they have some tooth to them.

I still make the Green Goddess dressing, still is the top of our dressing choices along with Creamy Garlic. I like taking a scoop of cole slaw on a salad then add a dollop of cream garlic on top. Duck with Orange Sauce, London Broil, Shrimp De Jounghe, Bakes Clams, Oyster Rockefeller will never go out of style at Myron and Phil. Add a smoker and some burgers, French Onion Soup, Tomato Bisque, supper club meets BBQ and burgers. The M&P setup is still on the table too. The rediscovery of chop liver.

I found this recipe for Noodles Romanoff in Betty Crocker's Picture Cook Book (c. 1950) (probably my Mom's first cookbook, as she bragged that she could make only fudge when she got married).

http://www.flickr.com/photos/aliaselias/8450573023/in/photostream/

With more digging, I found clues to where my mother came up with the (not popular with us) idea of adding mushrooms and tuna to Noodles Romanoff. A 1966 print ad for Kraft's boxed Noodles Romanoff included the recipe for Noodles Romanoff Tsarina--the Tsarina embellishment consisted of adding mushrooms, parsley and a garnish of toasted, sliced almonds to the dish. Then, in Barbara Swain's "Barbara Swain's Cookery for 1 or 2," the Noodles Romanoff recipe includes sour cream, cottage cheese and canned sliced mushrooms--plus, a variation at the bottom of the recipe for "Tuna and Noodles Romanoff" including directions to "drain and flake a 3 1/2 ounce can of tuna, fold into sour cream mix before folding into noodles." Aha!

Although I haven't yet found a direct reference connecting Romanoff's restaurant with Noodles Romanoff, I did find a ton of from-scratch Noodles Romanoff recipes published in books and online. The one that sounded pretty good--albeit, heavy on the dairy (2 cups sour cream!)--was from Virginia and Robert Hoffman's "The Great Little Food with Wine Cookbook" 2003.
Easy Noodles Romanoff
1 pkg egg noodles
2 Tbsp butter
2 cups sour cream (I'd definitely cut this down)
1/2 cup grated parmesan
1/4 cup dry vermouth
1 Tbsp fresh chives, minced
1/2 tsp salt
1/4 tsp pepper
1 clove garlic, finely minced
Cook noodles according to package instructions. Drain. Butter noodles. Mix sour cream 1/2 of the cheese, vermouth, chives, salt, pepper and garlic. Stir into noodles. Arrange on platter. Top with remaining cheese. Serve.

P.S.--I've also ordered a copy of "Romanoff-Prince of Rogues: The Life and Times of a Hollywood Icon" by Jane Pejsa which may give a recipe (I hope!) and will definitely fill me in on that much celebrated imposter, Michael Romanoff, aka Prince Michael Dimitri Alexandrovich Obolensky-Romanoff (!)

Oh great keep us posted. So much for the Tsarina noodles. I am not a huge fan of tuna...a good way to ruin noodles romanoff if you ask me. I made some noodles romanoff for lunch.
Similar to that of above.

I had some Swabian egg noodles from Aldi which I love even though they are not traditional but its all I had. Got a pan of water boiling to just cover the noodles. Put one cube of wylers chicken bouillon and one cube of knorr parsley flakes in the water. These things add a lot of flavor. Do not add any more salt to the dish as this would suffice. I used a small amount of noodles for about two side dish servings or one main dish servings. The noodles were to boil for ten minutes and absorb all the water and bouillon which they did. At the end of the boiling I added two tablespoons of butter and had to dribble a bit more water to bring them to their boil time so they would not stick. Added a table spoon of minced garlic which cooked a bit with the noodles. Aslo sprinkled in some dry mustard which I think adds a bit of a kick. I like Archer farmes dry mustard and herbs. Once cooked, I put two big spoonfuls of sour cream in the pan, sprinkled some freeze dried chives in and then some parmesan cheese. Put on a plate with fresh cracked pepper. I think it was very good. Although I do not remember real parm in the noodles of the olden days which provides a stringy cheesey touch the original did not have. I will have to hunt down some other noodles to make it with. I could also see turning this mass into a baking dish and sprinkling it with parm and panko crumbs and giving a little bake. Would be a company dish. If fact if the party occurs that is what I will bring.

Note if you just use sour cream with the noodles it will be very bland you do need something to punch up the flavor that is why the powered cheese could be important but if you put the bouillon cube in that punches things up too.

sundevilpeg wrote:Their assessment of Crab Louis is nuts on multiple levels. It's still commonly available at any good fish-oriented place in SF, including both Tadich Grill and Swan Oyster Depot (though I always indulge in the lavish version at the lovely Rotunda resto at Nieman-Marcus, with its astounding vintage stained-glass ceiling). And in the 40-plus years I have been eating it, I have never - NEVER - seen it dressed with Green Goddess dressing! It has its own eponymous dressing, made with fresh mayonnaise, chili sauce, minced green onion, and sometimes capers - and it's served on the side. "Fading Favorites," my ass!

One of my guilty pleasures, The Franciscan on Fisherman's Wharf, has a great version (although I happen to enjoy nearly all their crab dishes).

mrkrogers: Another fun read on Michael Romanoff can be found in the hugely entertaining autobiography of David Niven, Bring on the Empty Horses, in which Niven devotes an entire chapter (!) to the wacky world of Romanoff. Good stuff.

Another dish you rarely here about anymore is mousse au chocolate. It seemed to be quite the rage in the sixties and seventies. Everyone and their uncle wanted to learn how to make it. Now rarely here of it and never see it on menus. Maybe due to raw eggs.

toria wrote:one cube of knorr parsley flakes

This caused me to think of Sandra Lee and my stomach churned.

Also:

the powered cheese could be important

or please, no!

...and on aspics: I don't mind them topping a good quality pate or liver mousse, especially if there is some good crusty bread in the offing--MKRogers

There is nothing stomach churning about a small cube of dried parsely flakes. I also used freeze dried chives. Same you get out of the bottle at the store its just compressed in a small cube. The cheese powder, I am dubious but people on line that have researched it felt it important to get the same taste they were used to. I would not use it as I was happy with what I made and I think it can be made without it. Yes fresh parsley and chives would be better but did not have them on hand. I often cook with what I have. Of course the original did not have anything but dried ingredients.

I have to admit - I have a weakness for the powdered cheese products they use in boxed mac & cheese.

Mostly it's because every time I try to make "real" mac & cheese, my bechamel comes out grainy, oily, and disgusting. Pathetic as it is, the neon orange powder is far better than anything I've ever accomplished myself. I wound up ordering a pound of the powder from Amazon so I can at least make mac & cheese with real noodles instead of the soggy boxed stuff, but a real cheese sauce is sadly outside of my abilities.

Hmm mine does not come out that way, you make a white sauce and then put some shredded cheese in it and then voila. You know you could put the white sauce on the pasta and then put the cheese in and just combine it or mix with a spoon and then bake. I have made macaroni and cheese many times both baked and unbaked and it always turns out nice and smooth. Maybe the recipe for the bechamel, or maybe cooking the sauce with the cheese too long?

If you get a chance to visit Hennings in Keil, Wi they sell bulk cheese powder there for a lot less than Amazon. As well as some great cheese. We use it on popcorn.

toria wrote:Hmm mine does not come out that way, you make a white sauce and then put some shredded cheese in it and then voila. You know you could put the white sauce on the pasta and then put the cheese in and just combine it or mix with a spoon and then bake. I have made macaroni and cheese many times both baked and unbaked and it always turns out nice and smooth. Maybe the recipe for the bechamel, or maybe cooking the sauce with the cheese too long?

I wish I knew. It's been a while, but I do know that there were multiple variables that affected my results. Too much heat led to curdling the cheese, and the oil separating. Too little heat resulted in the cheese + milk, rather than a cheese sauce. Replacing the flour with corn starch or tapioca starch made it less grainy, but the texture wound up being almost like gelatin instead of a proper sauce. The cheese selections affected texture, too - I love the flavor of very sharp cheddar, but it tended to get very grainy very quickly (particularly the cheaper varieties). White cheddar tended to do better than yellow cheddar.

As near as I can figure, my temperature is wrong, my cheese mixture is wrong, and I'm using my starch incorrectly. That's an awful lot to be going wrong at the same time. It's embarrassing because this should really be easy. My carbonara comes out fine (the LTH thread really helped on that), but I still can't do mac & cheese unless I cheat.

I think I need break this down systematically, post pictures and solicit feedback on the cooking thread. I'm clearly doing multiple things wrong, and I'm sure the brain trust can correct me if I break it down.

Independent George wrote:

toria wrote:Hmm mine does not come out that way, you make a white sauce and then put some shredded cheese in it and then voila. You know you could put the white sauce on the pasta and then put the cheese in and just combine it or mix with a spoon and then bake. I have made macaroni and cheese many times both baked and unbaked and it always turns out nice and smooth. Maybe the recipe for the bechamel, or maybe cooking the sauce with the cheese too long?

I wish I knew. It's been a while, but I do know that there were multiple variables that affected my results. Too much heat led to curdling the cheese, and the oil separating. Too little heat resulted in the cheese + milk, rather than a cheese sauce. Replacing the flour with corn starch or tapioca starch made it less grainy, but the texture wound up being almost like gelatin instead of a proper sauce. The cheese selections affected texture, too - I love the flavor of very sharp cheddar, but it tended to get very grainy very quickly (particularly the cheaper varieties). White cheddar tended to do better than yellow cheddar.

As near as I can figure, my temperature is wrong, my cheese mixture is wrong, and I'm using my starch incorrectly. That's an awful lot to be going wrong at the same time. It's embarrassing because this should really be easy. My carbonara comes out fine (the LTH thread really helped on that), but I still can't do mac & cheese unless I cheat.

I think I need break this down systematically, post pictures and solicit feedback on the cooking thread. I'm clearly doing multiple things wrong, and I'm sure the brain trust can correct me if I break it down.

Apparently, the secret is sodium citrate (see Rene G's post and links here). Obviously, not an ingredient one is likely to have on hand, but if you went so far as to order a pound of cheese powder, I am sure you have the will and the savvy to track some down.

Holy smokes! Thank you for this - I am so going to try this. I've already googled, and I can apparently get sodium citrate for around $10/pound (and a pound apparently makes a LOT of mac & cheese).

I should have mentioned that I have done the Velveeta trick, and it works, but that always felt wrong to me. I can't explain why - I've long been an advocate for Velveeta in grilled cheese. I might also have to get an immersion blender, too - just to be safe, of course.