Za Jiang Mian Noodles in Chicago

HI there LTH friends,

It's been a while since I posted, but I am hoping you can actually help me with a double-dilemma food moment. So, first off, I have always, always been intimidated/overwhelmed/underwhelmed by the Chinatown joints. I haven't had the time to be true the very nature of this forum (sorry) and so I just have avoided Chinese food in general.

But two weeks ago I was in Boulder, CO and it was my birthday and my sister took me to a charming little place called ZoeMaMa, and while Boulder, CO looks much more like Palo Alto than when I lived there, I was happy to be perched on my stool watching a Chinese Grandma telllng the team how to serve forth. waiting for my dish. It was everything I wanted _- chewy noodles, rich, porky broth, scallions, etc.

Does this exist in Chicago? I expect it does. Please let me know . . .

bjt

Some other variant transliterations (one Chinese, one Korean) to help with the searching. If we find another good thread, we'll combine shortly.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zhajiangmian (Zhajiangmian, or Zhajiang / Chajang Mein)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jajangmyeon (Jajangmyeon, Chajang myeon or myun)

Yes, it exists in Chicago, with Great Sea's being very popular around LTH, and I even have some Chapagetti in my pantry. Many Korean and Korean-kitchen Chinese places (like Tae Fu in Villa Park) have this in addition to Chinese spots.

Santander wrote:Yes, it exists in Chicago, with Great Sea's being very popular around LTH,

I've had some at VIP Restaurant too (something similar at least), which is another Korean run Chinese place in Albany Park. It's basically a half mile due south (I mean, literally) of Great Seas on Montrose. Last time I went was a weekend and we got a huge plate of it that could feed four people for around $16. It was a special and I remember much of their menu being in Korean, but they should know English if you ask for it anyway. It was good. Their wings, sweet and sour pork, etc - also very good.

3254 W Montrose Ave (Montrose & Spaulding)
http://www.chicagoreader.com/chicago/vi ... id=1153232

This dish is one of my favorites, and since i can't often get to Yu's in Schaumburg (my fav place for it) I have tried quite a few city places.

In the city I have not found better than Peking Mandarin. They execute all the typical Korean/Chinese noodle dishes quite well.

Peking Mandarin
3459 W Lawrence Ave
Chicago, IL 60625

But, when you go to Great Seas, you can also order those fantastic wings they have.

VIP's and Great Sea's JJM is absolutely not the same as zha jiang mian. Not even close. It wasn't in '07, and I'd bet my second born it isn't now. Completely different style of dou ban jiang.

TonyC wrote:VIP's and Great Sea's JJM is absolutely not the same as zha jiang mian. Not even close. It wasn't in '07, and I'd bet my second born it isn't now. Completely different style of dou ban jiang.

They aren't the same things, you are right, but they are similar in a way. Well this is according to my Chinese girlfriend from Malaysia who used to live in Shanghai. You are right though, they are not the exact same but they are a hell of a lot closer than most things you'll find in town probably.

All 3 Katy's serve ZZM: http://www.katysdumpling.com/Katys_Dump ... /menu.html

D'frent locations lists it as "Noodle with black bean paste", "beijing soybean paste noodle", "old Beijing noodle".

Anyway, this dish is so utterly simple (as is dan dan mian) I refuse it to order anywhere (cept in China). Print Baidu's recipe here: http://baike.baidu.com/view/18974.htm , go to Chinatown Market, ask for the ingredients (the only sauces you won't have is 豆瓣酱 & 甜面酱), select the type of wide fresh noodles you like, go home and it can be made in about 15min start to finish.

The biggest difference between the Korean and Chinese douban is the inclusive of caramel in the Korean bean paste. Chinese uses 2 separate bean pastes, Koreans uses an amalgamated base paste. Second biggest difference is during the frying of the sauce: Chinese uses ground pork and tofu curds, Korean doesn't. Third: Koreans like to dip raw onion into junk vinegar while eating JJM. I find this most barbaric. Non-Korean version is gross, Chinese version is good.

Went to Northern City in Bridgeport for a late dinner on Monday night. The za jiang mian was good -- homemade noodles and not as oil-drenched as it often is at other places I've had it in Chicago. The atmosphere was also enriched by the fact that we were the only party of two amidst multiple giant round tables of very merry friends (all Chinese).

Thanks for all the recs (and a recipe even). Yahnul, I am near Bridgeport quite often, I checked out the menu online for Northern City. http://www.beyondmenu.com/24161/Chicago ... px?r=24161

They don't list the dishes by Chinese names, so would it be #421 on the menu? Let me know, thanks!

bjt

No that's dan dan noodles, according to this: http://www.northerncity.com/menu.asp?catid=10006.

You want #418.

Awesome, thanks cilantro!

bjt

I didn't even look at the menu, to be honest, just asked the waitress for a plate of dumplings, za jiang mian, and fuqifeipian (a delicious cold dish of spicy beef/tripe/etc.). Not sure if you're a Mandarin speaker from your first post, but I'm willing to bet that just saying "za jiang mian" to your server will get you where you want to be!

Yahnul, I am not in any way a speaker of Chinese in any dialect -- I am a California girl so I have the Spanish food words down. If you are a Chinese speaker could you help me with a phonetic "telling" or speaking of the dish? They did it so quick in Boulder that I just couldn't catch it. I am sensitive and tried to pick it up but it was pretty quick. BUt I'd love to be able to go to Chinatown and say "Fill in the Blank" noodles. I would love that very much.

bjt

Copy these, if you can see them, print them out, hand to wait staff:

炸酱面

As for phonetics: the "zha" rhymes with A-Ha, and the zh- is like a j, as in John. In jiang, the the ji- is like jy-, and the -ang has the same A-ha! vowel sound. Mian is something like Me plus the letter N, so Me-En. Hopefully this makes Some sense.

This: http://www.mdbg.net/chindict/chindict.php?page=worddict&wdrst=0&wdqb=%E7%82%B8%E9%85%B1%E9%9D%A2 might help with pronunciation. Hover over the little arrow to the right of the characters, and click on the speaker icon. Remember the tone of each syllable is an important part of the meaning, so unless you think you've got it down I'd go the printer method.

This is why this forum is so appreciated, thank you to all of you. I think I'll go with the printed version. We're actually headed to Chinatown next Sunday the 9th for the super awesome sounding "Shall We Gather at the River" event at Ping Tom Park with The Chicago Symphony Orchestra, so I might try it down there somewhere as well.

bjt

Went to VIP Restaurant again this weekend. Such good food...one of the hidden gems of Albany Park. According to my Chinese descent friends from Malaysia, the stuff at Great Sea "sucks" (I haven't had it there) and VIP Restaurant does it right. Yes, it's the Korean version of it but still very good. It's the #9 ($17.50) on the back menu in Korean by the way.

marothisu wrote:VIP Restaurant does it right. Yes, it's the Korean version of it but still very good. It's the #9 ($17.50) on the back menu in Korean by the way.

You're talking Cha chiang mian, right? Here's a video by Mike Sula of making cha chiang mian at VIP.

marothisu wrote:According to my Chinese descent friends from Malaysia, the stuff at Great Sea "sucks" (I haven't had it there)

I'm not Chinese, from Malaysia or your friend, but would disagree Great Sea cha chiang mian "sucks" I stick to three items at Great Sea, cha chiang mian, house made potstickers and gampongi (fried chicken drumettes), and remain a multi decade satisfied customer.

G Wiv wrote:

marothisu wrote:VIP Restaurant does it right. Yes, it's the Korean version of it but still very good. It's the #9 ($17.50) on the back menu in Korean by the way.

You're talking Cha chiang mian, right? Here's a video by Mike Sula of making cha chiang mian at VIP.

marothisu wrote:According to my Chinese descent friends from Malaysia, the stuff at Great Sea "sucks" (I haven't had it there)

I'm not Chinese, from Malaysia or your friend, but would disagree Great Sea cha chiang mian "sucks" I stick to three items at Great Sea, cha chiang mian, house made potstickers and gampongi (fried chicken drumettes), and remain a multi decade satisfied customer.

Thanks for the video. Very cool. Well my friends use "suck" loosely perhaps, but they are not impressed with it. As they said, it's not as authentic there because the bean paste and stuff is not stir fried into the dish like they do at VIP. According to them, Great Sea kind of just mixes it in after the fact, and there's not as much "stuff" in the GS one. I will try the one at GS though soon. The one at VIP is such a good deal IMO for how big it is.

The video doesn't show the chef at VIP stir frying the bean paste/meat ragu with the noodles, and I've never seen it served that way. Is this something one asks for specifically?

JeffB wrote:The video doesn't show the chef at VIP stir frying the bean paste/meat ragu with the noodles, and I've never seen it served that way. Is this something one asks for specifically?

This is according to my friends. That's the words they used....essentially they meant cooking it in versus just mixing it in after the fact. I will ask them later about it.

marothisu wrote: Yes, it's the Korean version of it but still very good. It's the #9 ($17.50) on the back menu in Korean by the way.

$17.50? Is it an exceptionally large portion (like a double portion)?

Jamieson22 wrote:

marothisu wrote: Yes, it's the Korean version of it but still very good. It's the #9 ($17.50) on the back menu in Korean by the way.

$17.50? Is it an exceptionally large portion (like a double portion)?

It could easily feed 4-5 normal people. It's a pretty huge portion. Two people could easliy share it with pretty big appetites and be full. Between 5 people a few nights ago, everyone got at least 2 platefuls of the stuff (ovoid plates).

Here is what one of my friends says (he is from Malaysia, been in the US for maybe 2 years):

"vips was way better. like i would compare eating authentic malaysian food to eating at penang in chicago thats how vip noodles are to great seas. but vip is spicy, slightly fried texture, onions, shrimp, squid, and other stuff. great seas the bean paste is like crap with just the noodles. thats all. great seas doesnt cook them. Basicaly pure paste and plain noodles mixed in."

marothisu wrote:Here is what one of my friends says (he is from Malaysia, been in the US for maybe 2 years):
"vips was way better. like i would compare eating authentic malaysian food to eating at penang in chicago thats how vip noodles are to great seas. but vip is spicy, slightly fried texture, onions, shrimp, squid, and other stuff. great seas the bean paste is like crap with just the noodles. thats all. great seas doesnt cook them. Basicaly pure paste and plain noodles mixed in."

Malaysia isn't China. Malaysia isn't even Singapore. Unsure how your friend's nationality has anything to do with the taste VIP's ZZM vs. Great Sea's ZZM vs. XXX in this particular case.

The noodle in Beijing ZJM's isn't "stir fried" with the sauce, ever:

(and yes, they use MSG)

http://www.meishij.net/chufang/diy/gaod ... 38266.html
http://www.meishichina.com/Eat/Nosh/200805/35646.html
http://www.ttmeishi.com/caipu/bbfdecb5ffd741ca.htm

Nor does it have typically "shrimp, squid, and other stuff". That doesn't preclude one from tossing all kinds of shit into ZJM at home (I like to add egg skin, etc.), but to say a ZJM isn't "authentic" because there's no seafood in the bowl is simply incorrect.

g'luck to bjt on your 炸酱面 cooking.

TonyC wrote:Malaysia isn't China. Malaysia isn't even Singapore. Unsure how your friend's nationality has anything to do with the taste VIP's ZZM vs. Great Sea's ZZM vs. XXX in this particular case.

First of all, my friends were talking about better tasting and more authentic was secondary. Second of all, they never said either were 100% authentic. They said "more" authentic and we are talking about the Korean version of it, NOT the chinese version of it, as referenced by me saying the menu item is in all Korean on the back.


In any case, I hope you do realize that Malaysia is almost 25% Chinese ethnicity, which is about 7 million people (The US has about 15 million Asians, not all of whom are Chinese). My friend is of Chinese descent and also lived in China, and has lived in the US for a grand total of two years. The same is true of my girlfriend and her family - they are all from China but living in Malaysia and also used to live in Shanghai. Saying that my friend doesn't know what he's talking about because he's from Malaysia would be similar to saying anybody from the US of XX descent has no idea what they're talking about because they aren't living in that country. Last time I was in Malaysia was less than 1.5 months ago, and last I checked, I not only ate extremely authentic chinese meals (including by far the best dim sum of my life, a hundred times better than anything I've ever had in San Francisco or NYC), but also home cooked Chinese meals. In fact, my girlfriend's grandmother is from China and emigrated to Malaysia in the mid 20th century, first settling in Penang.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Malaysian_Chinese

Nobody in their right minds would ever go to Penang and claim that the food there is not extremely authentic Chinese, or the massive Chinese new year celebration is in some way less authentic. For the record, the entire state of Penang is about 46% Chinese (700,000+ people). As a contrast, Los Angeles has about 425,000 Asians, San Francisco has 268,000, and NYC has 1.038 million.

Or even Malacca for that matter, which last time I was there, the entire older part of the city was in Chinese (along with English and Malay) since the state is almost 33% Chinese.

Some states:
Penang - 46% Chinese
Kuala Lumpur - 43% Chinese
Johor - 35% Chinese
Malacca - 32% Chinese
Perak - 31% Chinese
Selangor - 28% Chinese
Negeri Sembilan - 25% Chinese
Sarawak - 24% Chinese

For the record, Singapore and Malaysia were the same country back in the early 1960s, and many people who live in Singapore work in Johor Bahru and visa versa still.


But again, this is about VIP versus Great Sea, not necessarily whose is the most Chinese.

bjt wrote:This is why this forum is so appreciated, thank you to all of you. I think I'll go with the printed version. We're actually headed to Chinatown next Sunday the 9th for the super awesome sounding "Shall We Gather at the River" event at Ping Tom Park with The Chicago Symphony Orchestra, so I might try it down there somewhere as well.

bjt

bjt, I'm curious to know how it went and if you liked it!

I never got a chance to try it, crazy eh? But don't give up on me and I still really appreciate all the info that was provided to me. I am headed to Chinatown this afternoon, I am wondering if they will have it at Sing's (where the guy makes the hand-pulled noodles).

bjt

A recent thread on Chinese restaurant recs for Northbrook sent me down a rabbit hole today looking (without much success) for good north suburban Chinese restaurant options, because I've been disappointed with the last handful of takeout and delivery orders I've gotten. So, along the way, Yu's Mandarin, Chef Ping, Chinese-Korean ...

Anyway, noticing that some posters in various threads wondered about and/or debated what was in za jiang main, or ja jiang mein, and continuing down the rabbit hole, I found this recipe, from Chinese Cooking for Dummies, which I notice is by Martin Yan.