Binny's on Grand said they got it in today, there was a line outside before they opened, and it was all gone by 9:30.
The Binny's in Lincoln Park, however, had not received any, and said they thought they might get some, maybe or maybe not, whatever that means. Just curious if you were able to buy some, how much did it set you back?

Pappy pron

no 20 or 23?

Agreed -- why only buy 3 bottles?

#1 got to leave some for others
#2 not made of $$
#3 like the 15 the best

My short version of a long story is that I had been planning to get in on the PA state sale, which was online, MSRP and first come, first served, for sale exclusively to Pennsylvania (where I have family). I was on the site the second it went live, made it with a couple bottles in my cart to the final of several check-out stops, and then the site buckled under the weight of all the people clamoring for Pappy. It slowed to a halt and bam, logged me off empty handed. I gave it a few more tries with no luck, then gave up, figuring it was not my year.

At least until early this afternoon, when I heard the trucks had hit Chicago, drove to my usual loyal shopping spot out west, and ... did really well. It was timing, footwork, legwork, all kinds of work short of manual labor, and it paid off (albeit via my wallet). I already told my wife, no presents for me this season, I'm all set!

I was asleep at the wheel today and missed this thread in the AM. Of course by the time I saw it, the 15+ appeared to be long gone.

But I got lucky and at least was able to snag a 10 year at the River Grove Binny's...last bottle they had. A satisfactory consolation prize.

Dclose, you must have been right behind me. I got the second to last 10yr at River Grove.

I have a few wait lists in some suburban smaller stores but my hopes are low.

Some places have strict bottle limits, that clearly just get ignored.

I called a bunch of Binny's at 11:30am and they had none, and no idea when it was coming. By 3:30 it had come and gone. Something is amiss.

Then we see posts like this http://chicago.craigslist.org/chc/clt/4189601544.html

It's very frustrating.

Also quite surprised by the lack of pappy, considering that they held back spring as well.

Yeah, I think some places are honest...so far I've found Binny's River Grove and Buffalo Grove to be very straight up about everything. But there is definitely some funny business happening, which I suppose one can always expect when dealing with a product this high in demand.

Some stores go first come, first served. Others reward their most loyal customers. Neither approach seems particularly out of line to me.

=R=

I agree that either approach is perfectly fine, I just hope for a decent amount of transparency regarding their process.

I used to be a conspiracy theorist on this point, but I've since come around a little. While it's not always first come, first served in the strictest sense, the Pappy hunt does reward diligence (sometimes to the point of obsession!) but mostly rewards loyalty: if you are a regular shopper with whom the store maintains a relationship, I think you have a better shot than someone who just pops in once a year looking for Van Winkle. In the case of Binny's this year, specifically, I'm pretty sure they stuck to a no-hold policy, which is akin to first come, first served, but I think mitigated with an emphasis on regular customers ahead of the pack. Maybe a better way to put it could be that the more familiar with you they are, the more transparent the process becomes?

I should stress that this perhaps held true primarily for quieter Binny's locations outside of Chicago. Chicago sounded to me like a mad scene of waiting lists and lotteries and delivery truck chasers and lines out the door.

I did note this year I encountered more outright misdirection than usual - I had someone at Binny's lie outright a couple of weeks ago that the shipment had come and gone, all three bottles - but if I were a store getting called a thousand times a day for a month about the same hard to get product, I'd get a little grouchy, too. I was in Bardstown, Kentucky when the Pappy got released around there, hanging out in a small, well-regarded shop, and the phone calls were coming one after the other. The proprietor would basically pick up the phone, say no, hang up, complain to us in the most colorful of terms, then repeat the process when the phone rang again a few seconds later.

Two other things: FWIW, the Four Roses 2013 Anniversary Small Batch has been much more elusive than either the Pappy or BTAC this year. Also, Pappy, BTAC, Four Roses or whatever be damned, we live in a golden age of bourbon, and the number of incredible bottles that can be had for $30 to $50 is pretty incredible, from Weller 12 to Elmer T. Lee to Wild Turkey 101. Blows my mind what budget goodness abounds.

Vitesse98 wrote:Two other things: FWIW, the Four Roses 2013 Anniversary Small Batch has been much more elusive than either the Pappy or BTAC this year. Also, Pappy, BTAC, Four Roses or whatever be damned, we live in a golden age of bourbon, and the number of incredible bottles that can be had for $30 to $50 is pretty incredible, from Weller 12 to Elmer T. Lee to Wild Turkey 101. Blows my mind what budget goodness abounds.

Maybe the relative scarcity of the 4R13 is due to the fact that it is a single product, whereas the Pappy and the BTAC are comprised of multiple products. I'm just guessing, though, because I have no idea what the actual output is on any of this stuff.

I agree that there are some great American whiskeys currently available but I do miss the days -- not very long ago, at all -- when I could walk into my local Binny's and always find Van Winkle Lot B 12-year, Handmade and Old Rip 107 collecting dust on the bottom shelf in the bourbon aisle. That was the golden (brown) age.

=R=

I think - and these guys all play this stuff very close to the vest - that Pappy runs something like 6000-8000 cases (how many per case, and how many of each type, can and does fluctuate - this year there was, not surprisingly, more 10 and 12 released than usual). The FR13, on the other hand, was I want to say 8000 bottles, which is super-scarce, and more or less twice the number of Pappy 23 bottles out there, which is to say, a tiny amount.

Very true statements, we should be happy to that we live in an age of deliciousness.

Vitesse98 wrote:I think - and these guys all play this stuff very close to the vest - that Pappy runs something like 6000-8000 cases (how many per case, and how many of each type, can and does fluctuate - this year there was, not surprisingly, more 10 and 12 released than usual). The FR13, on the other hand, was I want to say 8000 bottles, which is super-scarce, and more or less twice the number of Pappy 23 bottles out there, which is to say, a tiny amount.

I know Julian mentioned a while back in an interview in Garden & Gun that they were going to increase production on the 10 and the 12 by about 3% for each of the next several years. It may actually be mentioned (and linked) upthread.

=R=

Here in the hinterlands of Central Illinois, my purveyor told me yesterday that he didn't think they would get any Pappy at all. He said, "stores in any big city" would likely be my best bet. Yeah - thanks.

Davooda

ronnie_suburban wrote:I agree that there are some great American whiskeys currently available but I do miss the days -- not very long ago, at all -- when I could walk into my local Binny's and always find Van Winkle Lot B 12-year, Handmade and Old Rip 107 collecting dust on the bottom shelf in the bourbon aisle. That was the golden (brown) age.

Exactly. I miss those bygone days when you could buy a case of Old Rip 107 for $29/bottle (or less), throw it in the car trunk and always be properly prepared.

Onward and upward.

I was able to find Old Rip and Lot B on a Binny's shelf as recently as last year!

Vitesse98 wrote:I was able to find Old Rip and Lot B on a Binny's shelf as recently as last year!

Yeah, it still happens every once in a while but it used to be an ongoing thing. Those days are long gone.

=R=

I was able to get a Lot B 12yr from Kristina at West Lakeview Liquors this spring. I was in there shopping and asked her if she had any on hand - it was not on the shelf but she went to the back room and came back with a bottle for me.

So I agree it can be had at other times of the year, though you do need to get a little lucky.

Basically, if you're on a first-name basis with someone at a liquor store, you're better off than most!

Dave Driscoll (who you should all be reading!) has a great post on this:

First to the Party

Even though I'm pretty much priced out at this point, I'm still always keeping my eyes open when it comes to property on the San Francisco peninsula where I live. I would love to eventually own a house, not because it's a life-long dream, but simply because I'd like to start investing in something that's mine alone. I'd like to start having an experience that I won't have to move away from when the landlord decides the rent needs to be raised. Being at the mercy of someone else eventually gets old. However, finding an affordable house in the Bay Area today is like finding an affordable bottle of Pappy Van Winkle -- you need to know someone who has access.

Read the whole thing.

Darren72 wrote:Dave Driscoll (who you should all be reading!) has a great post on this:

First to the Party

Even though I'm pretty much priced out at this point, I'm still always keeping my eyes open when it comes to property on the San Francisco peninsula where I live. I would love to eventually own a house, not because it's a life-long dream, but simply because I'd like to start investing in something that's mine alone. I'd like to start having an experience that I won't have to move away from when the landlord decides the rent needs to be raised. Being at the mercy of someone else eventually gets old. However, finding an affordable house in the Bay Area today is like finding an affordable bottle of Pappy Van Winkle -- you need to know someone who has access.

Read the whole thing.

I think it's interesting and probably intentional that while espousing the belief that folks should be looking ahead to the next great thing, he offers absolutely no suggestions as to what it might be.

I also think the whiskey : owning a house analogy is a bit flawed. I mean, after you buy a house, you can live there for as long as you want/can afford to. Later you can sell it, pass it on to your heirs or whatever. It has lasting value, even under continual use. With whiskey, that's not true. You basically just buy it and drink it. If you don't drink it, you're not using it.

=R=

As far as the procurement goes, San Fran is actually a good analogy. As my friend used to say, it's impossible to find a place to live in San Francisco, and even if you do, you can't afford it. And yet, people find places to live, and they manage to afford it. Whiskey (for most) is clearly less important than housing, and definitely cheaper, but in my experience, if you make an effort - effort being relative, of course, 'cause this ain't bricklaying - you'll succeed.

Another way to put it: I had a much easier time getting a couple of bottles of Pappy Van Winkle than I would have trying for good concert tickets. Or, hell, tickets to Next. And the whiskey's a lot cheaper than both, and easier to share with friends. I can't just pull out Next or Alinea tickets or, I dunno, Stones or Justin Timberlake tickets when my friends come over, or to celebrate a special occasion. What's more, unlike, say, wine, one typically does not go through a bottle or two of whiskey a night. Whether Pappy 23 or Very Old Barton, it's built to last, a well from which you can draw an ounce at a time as the mood or occasion sees fit. That's still a pretty special (ideally communal) experience in the age of disposable or one-off events.

Vitesse98 wrote: Another way to put it: I had a much easier time getting a couple of bottles of Pappy Van Winkle than I would have trying for good concert tickets. Or, hell, tickets to Next.

I somehow knew you'd find a way to "Godwin" a Next reference
Love it!

Vitesse98 wrote:What's more, unlike, say, wine, one typically does not go through a bottle or two of whiskey a night.

Evidently, you haven't been drinking with very many LTHers.

ronnie_suburban wrote:I think it's interesting and probably intentional that while espousing the belief that folks should be looking ahead to the next great thing, he offers absolutely no suggestions as to what it might be.

Funny that you mentioned this. I was also going to link to his previous post, Best Spirit of 2013?

What the blog is supposed to do is share information and passion about spirits we feel passionately about. Right now I can safely say that no non-K&L exclusive spirit has captured the staff's enthusiasm like the Darroze 20 year old Assemblage Armagnac.

I wouldn't be surprised if public attention adjusts slightly more towards other Old World spirits, like Armagnac, Cognacs, Scotch Whisky. But I'd be more surprised if I was able to predict one of the next fifty fads!

Boudreaulicious, are you saying Next is run by Nazis!??!?!

I kid. Mea culpa.

I don't know much about Armagnac, Cognacs, Scotch Whisky, but they can run much, much more than Pappy Van Winkle, no? I think part of the fun of Pappy is that it is by and large affordable (as far as luxuries go). A casual look on the Binny's site finds an $8000 bottle of Armagnac, $3000 Cognac, hundreds of dollars for Scotch. A hundred or so for Pappy 15 or Pappy 20 is a relative bargain compared to those Old World bottles!

Vitesse98 wrote:As far as the procurement goes, San Fran is actually a good analogy. As my friend used to say, it's impossible to find a place to live in San Francisco, and even if you do, you can't afford it. And yet, people find places to live, and they manage to afford it. Whiskey (for most) is clearly less important than housing, and definitely cheaper, but in my experience, if you make an effort - effort being relative, of course, 'cause this ain't bricklaying - you'll succeed.

My experience living in the Bay Area was pretty much exactly as your friend described. The few places I found in the City where I actually wanted to live were amazingly expensive. When I queried people about how they found their places and managed to afford them on a barista's wages, it usually came down to a story involving grit, motivation, and a well-connected uncle.