This is getting a bit off topic, but with Fox and Obel gone, is there any place to get GREAT, hand sliced (not packaged) smoked salmon? Or do I need to make a Russ and Daughters run on my next trip back from NYC? (I'll bring a few bagels too….)

Kaufman's
Fresh Farms
Boston Fish Market (New Item:House Cold Smoked Salmon hand sliced)
Dirk's

Those are four places off the top of my head.

stevez wrote:Kaufman's
Fresh Farms
Boston Fish Market (New Item:House Cold Smoked Salmon hand sliced)
Dirk's

Those are four places off the top of my head.

Max & Benny's
Onion Roll (nova only)

Vital Information wrote:

stevez wrote:Kaufman's
Fresh Farms
Boston Fish Market (New Item:House Cold Smoked Salmon hand sliced)
Dirk's

Those are four places off the top of my head.

Max & Benny's
Onion Roll (nova only)

I picked up 4 ounces from the Onion Roll weekend before last for a snack, very nice.

The hand-sliced nova at The Bagel on Broadway is very good. Great? Well, yes, it rises to my definition of great, but I can't speak to anyone else's standards.

stevez wrote:Kaufman's
Fresh Farms
Boston Fish Market (New Item:House Cold Smoked Salmon hand sliced)
Dirk's

Those are four places off the top of my head.

I second Dirks, good stuff. While there suggest you try their fresh fish too

Perhaps a case of too little, too late, but Dillman's was doing a bustling after-work business yesterday evening. I enjoyed the burger. (Contrary to something I'd read elsewhere, it is not the same as at Au Cheval burger, featuring instead a single 1/3-poundish patty. The rest of the accouterments, including the brioche bun, seemed about the same. I now see this was clarified earlier in this thread.) The Mrs. enjoyed her plate of fried chicken with a side of delicious, supremely buttery mashed potatoes (a very reasonable serving for only $3.95). A fine old fashioned rounded out the meal.

I'm sorry to see this place go. Even if it wasn't the delicatessen many (including me) hoped it would be, I'm pretty happy with the accessible, comfortable spot to sample Sodikoff's greatest hits that it's become. In my mind, it's essentially a haute Miller's Pub (with shorter wait times!), which, coming from me, is a complement.

I like the Miller Pub analogy. To me it's Miller Pub meets Balthazar - a good, not cheap place that's always open where you can duck in for anything any time, including a drink. Chicago needs more of these. As compared to other towns, including lesser food burgs, the number of good neighborhood places in Chicago not open except for dinner (or, increasingly, after 3-4 pm) is frustrating.

The generic sounding Italian concept is lame in the abstract, but this guy basically does everything right, so I am expecting the unexpected. I also think and hope that the new pastrami place will carry on, and in fact strengthen, the deli offerings. Dillman's is big room and I can see it work as 2 smaller spots.

I was lukewarm on Dillman's at first but I find myself there quite a bit because my office is nearby and it's a sure thing. I've warmed up to it. It's always pretty busy, so I don't buy the presumption that it is failing in its present incarnation. Though, it does have a bunch of sister places right there. It's like a high end Pasadita setup with Gilt and Bavettes around the way.

I've been disappointed in Dillman's decision to drop certain "deli" items such as the house-cured herring. And I'm not alone. I think it's pretty obvious that part of the plan was to attract neighborhood East Bank Club-loving empty-nesters and divorced machers who have wandered back into the city from the North Shore. Objectively, they're there. But probably not in large enough numbers to support a "deli" heavy on schmaltz herring, salami and chicken-in-a-pot (And those guys don't really eat "deli" so much, anyway.) That said, multiple servers have told me that Dillman's has a good number of regulars (like me) who really liked, and now vocally miss, the stuff.

The main reason I hope that the new pastrami side doubles down on the Jewish stuff: it's all good, made from scratch and taken very seriously by the kitchen. It hasn't been much said, but the house-made bagels are probably the best in Chicago. Really up there with a good one from NY (or Toronto or Montreal). Forget pickles and pastrami, they make their own cream cheese, for chrissakes. And it's good. The herring, though, that's what I want to see again. Let's hope.

I'm sad to see it go too. It was like a nicer friendlier version of Au Cheval and had some outstanding items on the menu.

A week or so ago I found myself at Max n Benny's for a lunch. First let me say that my corned beef sandwich was exceedingly good. The meat was fresh and freshly sliced, with a classic Vienna taste.* They constructed it well in the secret deli style where the meat went mostly in the middle of the bread, puffing things up and giving an overall appearance of zaftig-ness. In fact, they provided more than enough meat, without being neither obscene nor parsimonious. Much better than expected crusty rye, not Zingerman's thick, but thick cut, made the sandwich memorable. Then, let me say, that this bustling room sang just the way you imagine your deli to sing. It both tasted like a deli and seemed like a deli. The problem is not that this thing does not exist, it's that it exists nearly wholly out of the realm of "people like us", however you wanna define that.

I cannot say I am expert in about anything else on the Max n Benny's menu. I cannot even opine on the pastrami. Still, I can tell you that the menu contains about everything you want from a deli from chopped liver to actual, you better have cream cheese, salty "belly" lox, hand sliced thank you very much. Yes, JeffB, there is chicken in the pot. The huge gaping hole, a flaw that reminds me very much of our flaw in pizza by the slice in Chicago, is in the pickles/table garnish. Just as you cannot have good pizza by the slice** in Chicago because our codes require the pizzas sit under life sucking heat lamps, some law seems to prevent Chicago area deli's from leaving out trays of pickles. And if that's not bad enough, as much as I'd stack our corned beef against Noo-Yawk, we got a way to go on the pickles***. All in all, a lot here. A lot of nothing to do with Dillman's, right, but something, I think on the idea that Chicago has zero interest in deli.

*Our friend EatChicago was saying to me recently that when people say "there's no good Chinese food in Chicago", they mean there's no Chinese food that tastes the way they grew up with, in (the places they go to in) Chicago. I wholly agree with that. To some extent, it's also the same thing with corned beef. New York corned beef has a different taste profile than Vienna. Not sure what attributes what to what. Yet different is not better nor worse. Just different. I mean I like both tastes. Yet, for others, they are not not getting the taste they expect, so it tastes wrong/bad to them.

**With some notable exceptions like Freddy's, that don't worship at the alter of heat lamp.

***The one thing that I really expected better at from Dillman's was the pickles.

Your food insights are always interesting.

Vital Information wrote:some law seems to prevent Chicago area deli's from leaving out trays of pickles.

Though there are apparently no such laws (or no laws that are enforced) regarding trays of pickled peppers, carrots, etc., in taquerias.

And got to say "zaftig-ness" of NY corned beeves make them, for me, very challenging to eat like a sandwich (so I usually resort to knife and fork, which feels wrong).

The Bagel puts out trays of pickles every time. Good pickles.

riddlemay wrote:The Bagel puts out trays of pickles every time. Good pickles.

Yes, traditional New York deli half-sour pickles that I cannot find retail anywhere.

ld111134 wrote:Yes, traditional New York deli half-sour pickles that I cannot find retail anywhere.

Try Kaufman's. They sell 'em in the barrel.

Kaufman's Deli
4905 Dempster St
Skokie, IL 60077
(847) 677-6190

It's good to have the consumer info about Kaufman's, but it's emblematic of the way The Bagel is often overlooked here that VI can write, "some law seems to prevent Chicago area delis from leaving out trays of pickles," when one of the oldest, most established delis in Chicago, now in its 64th year, puts out trays of excellent pickles for every single diner every single time.

The Bagel
3107 N. Broadway
Chicago
773 477 0300

The Bagel
Old Orchard Center
Skokie
847 677 0100

When the Bagel was located on Devon & Sacramento I was stunned as I watched an older woman who had a shopping bag of various containers with her systematically package everything up that was on the table before she left. The entire tray of pickles,bread basket of challah & rolls,etc.

stevez wrote:

ld111134 wrote:Yes, traditional New York deli half-sour pickles that I cannot find retail anywhere.

Try Kaufman's. They sell 'em in the barrel.

Kaufman's Deli
4905 Dempster St
Skokie, IL 60077
(847) 677-6190

Kaufman's has new and half-sours in the barrel. They're excellent.

EvA wrote:

stevez wrote:

ld111134 wrote:Yes, traditional New York deli half-sour pickles that I cannot find retail anywhere.

Try Kaufman's. They sell 'em in the barrel.

Kaufman's Deli
4905 Dempster St
Skokie, IL 60077
(847) 677-6190

Kaufman's has new and half-sours in the barrel. They're excellent.

I got the "new"...I thought that the barrel labled "old" held traditional sour dills. The "new" pickles taste like the NY deli pickles.

riddlemay wrote:It's good to have the consumer info about Kaufman's, but it's emblematic of the way The Bagel is often overlooked here that VI can write, "some law seems to prevent Chicago area delis from leaving out trays of pickles," when one of the oldest, most established delis in Chicago, now in its 64th year, puts out trays of excellent pickles for every single diner every single time.

The Bagel
3107 N. Broadway
Chicago
773 477 0300

The Bagel
Old Orchard Center
Skokie
847 677 0100

Perhaps, but it's also emblematic of my point no. "Hey, my friend, der's no deli in Chicawgo..." The Bagel being another example of something that just flies beyond the foodie community these days, no?

That said, it's been years since I've been to the Broadway location and about 2 or so since Old Orchard. I have to say that Broadway, in my mind, has little deli feel, instead seeming miniaturized, and more corner coffee shop than anything. And that time in Old Orchard, I remember the food being average. Still, point taken!

Vital Information wrote:Perhaps, but it's also emblematic of my point no. "Hey, my friend, der's no deli in Chicawgo..." The Bagel being another example of something that just flies beyond the foodie community these days, no?

I appreciate that you agree with my general point, VI, but on the question of whether The Bagel is a deli: I think we can agree that it is a Jewish restaurant, whether you call it a deli, a corner coffee shop, or what. It is a Jewish restaurant by virtue of three things: The menu is full to bursting with traditional Ashkenazic/Jewish-American fare; the owners and much of the wait staff are Jewish; and practically all the customers are Jewish! (Not all, but practically all. On my last visit, in which we sat at the back booth, I had the opportunity upon leaving to survey the other customers who occupied the entire length of the very full restaurant. On this particular day, without asking anyone his or her religious convictions or requiring to see signs of circumcision, I was able to determine to a high level of confidence that every single person I saw was Jewish.)

As for how good a deli The Bagel is, my opinion is that they do certain things very well and other things just OK. I think the matzo ball soup is among the best in the city. (That at Dillman's and Eleven City are both good also, but all three are different enough that it almost becomes apples to oranges. Suffice it to say that if The Bagel's matzo ball soup were the only version I could have for the rest of my life, I would be content. The chicken broth is delicious, the ball huge yet fairly light.) The kreplach soup is also quite good, benefitting from the same broth. I think the tzimmes and noodle kugel are outstanding. I've already mentioned my affection for the pickles. The nova and sable are really good, the bagels are fine, and the restaurant makes its own cream cheese. The chopped liver is excellent. The corned beef and pastrami may get a "B+" to Dillman's "A," but they do the trick. Although The Bagel's beef short ribs are not strictly a "Jewish" item, they are among my favorite entrees.

If you stray away from those items, you may enter the turf of "just all right." But why stray?

riddlemay wrote:It is a Jewish restaurant by virtue of three things: The menu is full to bursting with traditional Ashkenazic/Jewish-American fare; the owners and much of the wait staff are Jewish; and practically all the customers are Jewish!

I consider only the first of these criteria to be valid for determining whether a restaurant is a Jewish restaurant. Who owns, or goes to, a restaurant is irrelevant IMHO.

Also, to me a place qualifies as a restaurant if there is sufficient seating such that many of the customers eat their food on the premises (Kaufman's is now borderline, but I'd say probably not), and as a deli if there is a carry-out counter used by many of the customers (the Bagel definitely qualifies).

Vital Information wrote:The huge gaping hole, a flaw that reminds me very much of our flaw in pizza by the slice in Chicago, is in the pickles/table garnish. Just as you cannot have good pizza by the slice** in Chicago because our codes require the pizzas sit under life sucking heat lamps, some law seems to prevent Chicago area deli's from leaving out trays of pickles.

Ah, for the good old days of twelve thousand free pickles a week (not to mention free popcorn).

I thought of this thread as I was looking through the Garden Fresh Market flyer this morning. GFM has barrels of pickled mini pickles, red cabbage, sauerkraut, green tomatoes, large pickles, and half sour pickles, your choice, $1.50/lb.

um, it's reopening
http://www.chicagomag.com/dining-drinki ... -Dillmans/