nitrite expertise solicited

I'm corning a brisket from scratch. I've got 4 lbs of beef and a recipe for 5lbs. The recipe? Charcuterie-Ruhlman/Polcyn pg. 67.

Question: will the called for 1 oz/25 grams Prague Powder/Pink Salt/Sodium Nitrite per gallon brine for a 5 pound brisket become poisonous and/or unpalatable when used for a 4 lb brisket?

I bet toxicity isn't a problem within the called for brine ratio. I'm much more concerned about over-seasoning the beef.

Also, is it advisable to keep the recommended 5-day brine, or should I shorten it?

Thanks in advance.

It will not be poisonous. Just shorten the curing time a bit. Curing time is mostly a function of volume to surface area. If the brisket is flat and wide, it will need less curing time than one that is thick and short.

Bill/SFNM

Thanks much

It's flat and wide, and I was already of the mind to shorten the curing a tad; with your rec that's my definite intention.

You're talking about a 'concentration', not a dose. (That is, you've got a
weight (mass)/volume ratio, [a specific gravity or density relative to water, to be precise] which is what is fixed.) This concentration would be the same for any mass of meat to be treated.

But as Bill/SFNM notes, the time of treatment is a function of surface to volume ratio; or inch-squared/inch-cubed, and not of mass. Your moving from 5 lbs to 4 lbs isn't terribly significant. But, go down to 2 lbs and we're talking something to pay attention to.

Go to it!

Geo

HI,

Years ago, Cook's Illustrated had an article on corned beef. While the corned beefs I have bought have always been red from the nitrates. They indicated in the northeast the typical corned beef was brown without nitrates.

I did follow Cook's method for brining a brisket for corned beef without the nitrates. The flavor outcome was just fine though it take some getting used to corned beef looking brown. In this case it was just a matter of adjusting one's expectations.

Ultimately you can corn your beef without the nitrates without negative taste consequences.

Regards,

Seeing this thread I was curious as to why sodium nitrite was used in the brine.
It seems it is mainly for preserving the red colour in long cures (not unlike the effect of CO on meat)

Nitrite in meat

Again, thanks for the timely info. Project Corned Beef launches this Monday and I'll post my results later in the week.

Just by the by, Morton Tender Quick has a mix of nitrATE and nitrITE, which might be useful. If memory serves, there are *two* Prague powders, which have different formulations.

I use the Morton's for my smoked salmon, and have always been pleased with the results.

Geo

polcyn/ruhlman explain that Prague Powder no. 1 aka sodium nitrite is the more comonly used; Prague Powder no. 2 aka sodium nitrate is a sort of "time release" formula(the nitrate converts to nitrite over time) allowing better preservation of uncooked, cold smoked, and simply air dried products.

Plug:

I picked my Prague Powder no. 1 (polcyn/ruhlman refer to it as pink salt) up at The Spice House yesterday. Their corned beef spice mix(more coriander compared to their pickling spice) smelled so deleriously good I picked up a few oz. of that as well.

The Spice House has Prague Powder? That's interesting! Is that the place down near Lincoln Park? I've been to a place down there once... what's their relation to Penzy's? We've got a Penzy's in KC, but no Spice House.

Before I discovered Morton cure, I used to buy my Prague powder from Rytek, whose place is kind of a 'Home Depot' for meat curing.

http://www.sausagemaker.com/

Keep us posted on your corned beef. What kind of a brisket did you get? I've had trouble lately finding one with any fat on it. Seems as tho' only the cry-o-vac briskets have any fat these days, but they're only available infrequently in KC. Or else I've not looked in the right places.

Geo

The spice house was founded by the Ruth and Bill Penzey. They sold the business to their eldest daughter, Patty, and her husband, Tom Erd, back in 1992. Patty's brother (Bill Jr.) had already founded Penzey's in 1986.

Penzey's is a much bigger company, but I'm loyal to the spice house. They have probably 90% of their items/blends in common, but there is some variation.

The Spice House has three locations, in Milwaukee, Evanston, and Old Town.

Tnx gleam,

It was the Old Town store I was in, walked up there from my hotel in Lincoln Park.

And you've explained away my confusion (tnx for that, especially : ) -- my memory seemed to be that there was a lot of overlap between their stock and the stock at my local Penzy's.

For some things I just couldn't live w/o Penzy's-- all the various chili varieties, for example.

Geo

Oh, also, Ruth and Bill Sr. still run a "retirement" shop, in Wisconsin.

SPICE-WORK
1244 N. Glenview Ave.,
Wauwatosa, WI 53213
USA
414.258-7727
FAX 414.258-9477

http://www.spice-work.com

I have no idea what hours they keep, if they even do much retail at all, or anything about it. I've never been, although I think it'd be fun to go.

I have been to all three locations of the spice house, though. I'm partial to the Old Town location, mostly because I'm well acquainted with the staff, but I think you're more likely to see Tom and Patty at the Evanston location.

The Milwaukee location is probably the smallest, but has a ton of charm. The big bonus is the easy street parking, which can't be said for Evanston and Old Town. It's a nice place to stop at on a trip to or through Milwaukee.

I special ordered my first-cut beef brisket from *shocking* Jewel. I found it a bit overpriced @ 18 bucks for four lbs considering you can purchase the pre-packaged, brined varieties for a similar price. However, it's perhaps surprisingly, a mighty fine hunk of beef; well-marbled, nice fat cap, squared-off(often those pre-made briskets vary widely in width from tip to stern). It looks like a decent cut to work from.

When I stopped in the Old Town Spice House I got to speaking with Tom? who mentioned he'd just been up at the Milwaukee Store and how they're just across from Usingers(sausage making an' all). He guessed I was making corned beef as he was measuring out my pink salt, I mentioned the Charcuterie book, and the conversation took off from there.

Hey. It turned out not too shabby if I do say so myself. I started the brine Monday evening and took the beef out Friday afternoon. At first I was worried by the outer brown/pink splotchiness of the beef. Cooked for 3 hours and trimmed of fat cap it revealed the perfect rosy pink flesh of deli corned beef.

In the future I'll just go with five instead of four pounds. And, while the Jewel cut sufficed I wonder what I can procure at a city butcher.

The salt balance worked well, next time, I think my beef will benefit from a pinch less of the sweet spices and a bit more peppercorn.

I was going to whiskey glaze it as I usually do w/ store bought pre-brined beef. Whattya know? Two days later and the bulk of it's already gone for sandwiches.

That just leaves the forlorn bottle of whiskey for...um...gee...what on earth will I do with it?

I am going to be giving pastrami a try and was wondering if anyone knew the best place to pick up Morton's Tender Quick in the Ukie Village area? This seems a natural progression since my last two smokes were buckboard bacon and then 22lbs of brisket. Might as well cure a brisket!

To be honest I have not even begun to look for it so for all I know it might be at Dominick's/Jewel...
Thanks-
Jamie