overcooked burger, send it back?

happened twice this week. once at Blackie's printers row and once at Feed. ordered medium rare, got well done. my burger at Feed took longer than any other dish ordered by my party. seemed they heard 'medium rare' as 'dry as plaster'.

would the staff hate me forever because i sent back a "burger"? w/ accoutrements & tip/tax, these amount to $10 burgers, but they are, afterall, just burgers.

<edit for clarity>not discussing slight grades of medium vs. medium rare. we're talking straight up overdone ala Burger King</edit>

Tony,

Here is my current procedure when ordering hamburgers: "If I order a hamburger will be cooked rare like I want or (medium to well done) like the kitchen prefers?" (or something to that effect)

If the waitress advises it will always come out medium to well done, then I order something else.

If I am assured it is cooked to my specs and comes to the table not cooked to my specs, though I am more forgiving if it is medium rare instead of rare, then I am sending it back. They had their chance to correct the situation when I ordered and avoid a loss. They effectively lied, I am now sending them back.

You will have to be prepared to order something else, but that saves everyone a lot of aggravation. If you are only there for the hamburger, then have the conversation before sitting down.

Regards,

This is one of those classic issues in restaurants for me. I like a burger that's pretty rare -- but definitely not raw. I like a red center but not so that you still see the fat in the burger and it's cold. I've had the experience in many many places where I order it "rare but not raw, please" and i get it raw. I'm perfectly happy to send it back, realizing when I do that I will most probably get it back at least medium -- not my preferred temperature but I can live with medium. Blackie's is actually one of the most problematic on this -- it's a crapshoot every time.

Why is this so hard?

Now...in terms of what Cathy does, I think I'm going to start doing that as well. Excellent procedure, I think. Cathy, I'm curious...how much success have you had with that approach? I don't need stats or anyting of course but I'm wondering if that question nets you what you want in a burger more often than not?

One problem is that the terms "rare" and "medium rare" are subject to interpretation. When ordering a burger or steak, I ask the server to note on the order that I want it "dark pink, not red, not pink". I know colors are less than precise, but as long as the cook/chef sees the note, I usually get it close to the way I like it.

Bill/SFNM

Proof that the terms "rare" and "medium rare" and their ilk are open to wide interpretation can be found on your kitchen thermometer.

At least on mine, it says rare is 140F.

Which is bollocks.

I do as Cathy does, ask before ordering, and have learned to approach it from at least two angles as well, as some places follow the FDA's ludicrous recommendation that 140F is rare. So first I ask "can I get the burger cooked an honest rare," and then if the waiter affirms, I describe the interior I'm expecting.

If we successfully reach the point of expecting a genuinely rare burger only to discover it's FDA rare, I'll generally say to the server "I think I got someone else's burger. This is nothing like what I described." From the server's reaction it's easy to judge whether the next burger will be what I asked for; if things look dismal, I'll downscale my order to just a side dish or give up entirely, point out the discrepancy, and adjust the tip accordingly.

HI,

First things first, I was at Feed today for lunch. It was my second time in two weeks. I became somewhat memorable to the cook last week when we had a discussion about the sides. She favors the corn pudding and the pickled beets, though I commented mine had tasted rather flat. She took a sample to find they didn't have enough vinegar and sugar, which she remedied on the spot. My pickled beets today were substantially better.

Today my table got into a conversation with another table, which included talk of LTHforum. The staff overheard and began making inquiries. So I explained who we are and that their restaurant has a thread already. It occurred to me they may just find this thread first about the overdone hamburgers. So I told them of TonyC's experience, then asked what is their policy for making hamburgers. I learned they do try to make it to customer specification. I asked them how they felt if Tony returned the hamburger because it was overcooked, they hoped he would.

***

My decision to start returning hamburgers is a relatively recent event. While this technique of careful questioning has steered me from ordering hamburgers. I have had a few fibs like at Chief O'Neills where I was assured it would be cooked to my spec, then came medium and slightly beyond. When I mentioned it to the waittress she offered quite an incredible reply, "Well, I didn't make it myself." On this occasion I was so hungry, I just ate the darn thing.

***

Another restaurant issue, not related to cooking, though it does involve a hamburger. I went to Blackies in Deerfield with a buy one get one free coupon for their hamburger. I came a little late, my friend had just received their drink when I arrived coupon in hand. The waiter advised they will not honor the coupon though their Glenview restaurant would. Nothing on the coupon indicated any limitations. My reaction? I left the restaurant. I was sorely tempted to go to Glenview with the coupon just hoping they would send me back to Deerfield. Sometimes these coupons need some advance discussion, also.

Regards,

I prefer my burgers medium rare, but I am forgiving when it comes out medium. Burgers just cook much faster than steaks. Also, since burgers are usually topped with cheese or ketchup and mustard or grilled onions, dried out, unflavorful meat is usually not an issue until the burger is cooked beyond medium. Certain places like Paradise Pup don't even ask . . . it just comes out medium.

But it's this beyond medium point where I do have a problem, and I think this is most often encountered at corporate chains that have rules against cooking anything less than medium (which I've learned means medium-well). I avoid ordering burgers at those places. And if I order medium rare and they allow me to do that, and then the burger comes out well or medium well, then I absolutely would send it back.

Hi,

Cooking hamburgers medium to well done is really not limited to corporations. I have encountered that response at many price points in stand alone as well as chains. In some states, like West Virginia, they will only make your hamburger well done by state statute.

Regards,

Cathy2 wrote:Hi,

Cooking hamburgers medium to well done is really not limited to corporations. I have encountered that response at many price points in stand alone as well as chains. In some states, like West Virginia, they will only make your hamburger well done by state statute.

Regards,

Very true about non-chains cooking at least medium . . . I was just using that as one example. But please . . . shhhhhhhhh!!! Please don't give Chicago's aldermen any more food legislation ideas.

I dunno, it just seems to me that if the restaurant asks me how I'd like my food prepared, then they really mean to honor my request. In that case I'd send back any food, not just burgers, that come out very wrong. Well done lamb, steak, tuna....they all go back.

I've dined with friends who don't like to make waves...I think that I worked hard to earn the money I'm spending at a restaurant. They aren't giving me this overcooked dinner for free...I'm polite about it and always take that attitude that the waitress isn't at fault. Usually the problem is corrected with a minimum of fuss.

Then there's always the possibility the server grabbed the wrong burger and this way the kitchen might be able to head off sending my burger to another table.


D.

It's rare chicken that really bugs me.

Sir, our chef's special tonight is chicken a la salmonella.

Since I like my burgers medium, I typically ask for medium rare. 9 times out of 10 I get a a medium burger. When I get it medium rare, I happily eat it, knowing the restaurant got it right. When there is a big difference (asked for medium rare, get medium -well to well-done), I send it back. If they ask how I want it done, and it is no where near that, I think it only makes sense to send it back. Most decent restaurants that care about customer serivce would rather have you send it back and get a chance to get it right than have you begrudgingly eat the burger and say bad things about the place after you leave.

schenked wrote:Since I like my burgers medium, I typically ask for medium rare. 9 times out of 10 I get a a medium burger. When I get it medium rare, I happily eat it, knowing the restaurant got it right. When there is a big difference (asked for medium rare, get medium -well to well-done), I send it back. If they ask how I want it done, and it is no where near that, I think it only makes sense to send it back. Most decent restaurants that care about customer serivce would rather have you send it back and get a chance to get it right than have you begrudgingly eat the burger and say bad things about the place after you leave.

That's exactly my ordering philosophy. I prefer a true medium rare, but not wanting to upset a (possibly) disgruntled kitchen/waitstaff I order "medium rare" fully expecting a "medium-ish." I'm pleasently surprised when the kitchen actually delivers.

I've tried volunteering to sign a waiver (denied), pleading that the customer is always right (denied)... and usually end up ordering a non-burger from the chains, unless I'm willing to accept a ground-beef-patty sandwich as a vehicle for toppings such as chipotle-bacon-blue cheese. On occasion, that's OK... but it's not a hamburger.

Hackney's nailed medium rare on my recent dinner there. There's just something special about having the proteins just starting to denature, and a large amount of liquid still in place.

The latest issue of Cook's Illustrated, usually a stalwart defender of doing things right, advised mashing up white bread and milk in the burger, and "you can't overcook it!" Puh-lease!
If I wanted grilled meatloaf, I'd make grilled meatloaf.

HI,

Recently I was at Red Star Tavern in Deerfield, IL for lunch. I discussed my potential selection of a hamburger before making a final decision.

"If I order a medium rare hamburger, will you serve it as specified or cook it to medium instead?"

"For your health, we prefer to cook hamburger to medium."

"If I want medium rare instead, will you serve it medium rare?"

"Yes."

"If you think you won't, then it will save all of us trouble because I will send it back if it is cooked medium. I can always order something else."

"You can order it medium rare."

"Great, I want a medium rare hamburger. Please substitute brocolli for the fries please."

The assembled plate arrived looking good:



Fortunately the hamburger looked even better inside:



I recognize the conversation was a bit pointed, though it delivered me what I wanted. What riles me is when I have this conversation and still don't get what I want. Really I am quite happy to order something else if they are unwilling to accomodate me.

On this occasion everything went very well.

Red Star Tavern
695 Deerfield Rd
Deerfield, IL 60015
(847) 948-9700

Regards,