I have to side with aschie on this one (although I'm probably a bit more positive on the place). I though it was good, not great. I certainly wouldn't put it at the same level as Naha, Blackbird, etc.. I would go back, but maybe in another six months to see if some kinks get worked out.

I said this in my original post on the restaurant, but I think it's worth repeating. This is a fantastic restaurant town. As a dining public, I don't think we should settle for the level that Aigre Dioux is operating at right now. We should demand great, not just good. If this restaurant were in St. Louis, I would be over the moon about it. But for this market, I don't think it's living up to its aspirations right now.

nsxtasy wrote:

jpschust wrote:If you look to my thread on coming in late in chicago (if you cant find it ill find it for you) which was completely opposite- our food was outstanding as was our service and I thought the prices while a touch high were reasonable for the level of cooking , plating and service coming out of the kitchen and FOH

Your report was in this topic.

I agree with you. I stand by my report of my dinner at Aigre Doux on page 3 of this topic (the topic we're on now). The dinner I had there was exceptional in every way, with exceptionally delicious food, knowledgeable friendly service, pleasant environment, and an experience that was thoroughly enjoyable in every way. My SO and I have had quite a few excellent dining experiences at various restaurants in the past six months, including some of the very best in the area, and Aigre Doux continues to be the place my SO brings up as wanting to return to. And I keep thinking of their wonderful sticky toffee pudding (which I still regret sharing with my dining companions).

There you people go confusing me again.

I thought this was simple: A place that did not live up to expectations.

There has been a ton of debate over the food.

How about this question to help me decide if I want to spend a rare evening away from the twins: Is the place comfortable? Are we talking about a place like NoMi where I can settle in to enjoy a meal, or is it more like Blackbird where if I don't enjoy the food I am having a pretty bad evening [which is not to rip the food at Blackbird -- outstanding food, uncomfortably tight tables]

I think the answers are in these threads. Some people had great experiences, some had very off ones-- the place is inconsistent. The dining room is loud and crowded. If it's a rare shot at a kid-free meal like this and you want as close to certainty as you can have (and believe me, I know where you're coming from), I think you'd have to call it risky from that perspective. (I'd start calling Schwa, myself.)

jesteinf wrote:I have to side with aschie on this one (although I'm probably a bit more positive on the place). I though it was good, not great. I certainly wouldn't put it at the same level as Naha, Blackbird, etc.. I would go back, but maybe in another six months to see if some kinks get worked out.

I said this in my original post on the restaurant, but I think it's worth repeating. This is a fantastic restaurant town. As a dining public, I don't think we should settle for the level that Aigre Dioux is operating at right now. We should demand great, not just good. If this restaurant were in St. Louis, I would be over the moon about it. But for this market, I don't think it's living up to its aspirations right now.

That pretty much echoes my feelings although I didn't say it in so many words. This is a great restaurant town. And right now, they are charging top dollar for two-three star restaurants. For that price range, I expect them to be at the top of their game. And right now, I don't think they are there. Maybe in a different city -- even L.A., which I don't consider to be a great restaurant town -- they are at the top echelon, but not here, not yet, at least.

DML wrote:How about this question to help me decide if I want to spend a rare evening away from the twins: Is the place comfortable? Are we talking about a place like NoMi where I can settle in to enjoy a meal, or is it more like Blackbird where if I don't enjoy the food I am having a pretty bad evening [which is not to rip the food at Blackbird -- outstanding food, uncomfortably tight tables]

There are a lot of different restaurants, and different ways of evaluating restaurants. More specifically, in addition to food, you have decor, density/crowdedness, noise, etc. Here's how I would differentiate these places (all of which I've been to, and all of which have excellent food) and I'd like to add one more):

NoMi is much more of a luxury/splurge place, in many ways. It's in a luxury hotel, it has a great view out of Michigan Avenue out the big windows, it's significantly more expensive than these others (figure $150-225/person including moderate alcohol, tax, and tip, vs $75-125 for the others), and it is dressier (I was there several years ago on a weeknight for dinner and all the men wore jacket and tie; I don't know if that has changed at all). Yes, it's quieter and more spacious, too. I just don't compare it with these other places, but rather, as a step up the "food chain", more similar to places like Ambria and Les Nomades.

Blackbird is very crowded (tables close together) and rather noisy, as I recall (it's been a few years).

Aigre Doux is somewhat crowded and noisy, but not distractingly so, and not as bad as Blackbird.

one sixtyblue is much more spacious than Blackbird and Aigre Doux. Although it's not quiet the way NoMi is, it's not particularly noisy either.

If you're really looking for a quiet, luxurious experience, sure, you may be better off with NoMi or a similar "splurge" place. If you're looking for amazing food with a more moderate price tag than NoMi, and you want a more spacious, comfortable atmosphere, go to one sixtyblue. If you want some similarly outstanding food, and the density/crowdedness is not an issue for you, go to Blackbird or try Aigre Doux, especially if you've never been there.

When we have places that a lot of people really like (even if others don't), I like going there and trying it myself at least once before ruling it out.

Mike G wrote:(I'd start calling Schwa, myself.)

In all fairness, Schwa does not belong in the same category as Blackbird or Aigre Doux or one sixtyblue. For one thing, it's significantly more expensive (even considering wine at Schwa at your BYO cost), assuming you're not going crazy with the wine. For another, its food is more innovative. And the atmosphere is more free-form than conventional. Nothing wrong with any of those things, as long as that's what you're looking for, for whatever occasion you're considering. Personally, Schwa is the kind of place I only go once to try, whereas one sixtyblue and Aigre Doux are places I like to return to periodically.

Just a note to a point raised in the last post- I was in a button up shirt and slacks at NoMi on New Years day and I was very comfortable. Our service at times was extrodinarily slow though. I'd think when a waiter is sizing me up and asks me which bottle of wine I'd like and I pull up a 96 or 99 Bordeaux that he should learn right quick that even if I'm only in business casual that I'm pretty serious about what I'm eating and drinking.

nsxtasy wrote:figure $150-225/person including moderate alcohol, tax, and tip

Cost-wise, schwa sure fits in with NoMI. It's BYOB, DML has a well-stocked cellar, and two with tax and tip would come to much less than $450, or even $300.

gleam wrote:

nsxtasy wrote:figure $150-225/person including moderate alcohol, tax, and tip

Cost-wise, schwa sure fits in with NoMI. It's BYOB, DML has a well-stocked cellar, and two with tax and tip would come to much less than $450, or even $300.

These statements appear to contradict each other. I agree with the first statement, disagree with where the second statement says under $300. At Schwa, you start with $100 per person for the food, plus tax and tip and you're at $125-130, without wine. Let's say you bring $25-50 worth of wine per person. That comes to $150-180 per person including the cost of your BYO wine - over $300 for two and, as I noted, significantly more than BB/AD/160B.

nsxtasy wrote:Let's say you bring $25-50 worth of wine per person.

It seems like you're factoring wine pretty high. If you bring $25-$50 of wine per person to Schwa, and it's two people, you're either bringing a $50 or $100 bottle. If that's the wine standard you're using, then figure at AD or BB, tack on an additional $150-$300 for wine, using the markup of 200%. That would place BB or AD significantly higher in price than Schwa.

aschie30 wrote:It seems like you're factoring wine pretty high. If you bring $25-$50 of wine per person to Schwa, and it's two people, you're either bringing a $50 or $100 bottle. If that's the wine standard you're using, then figure at AD or BB, tack on an additional $150-$300 for wine, using the markup of 200%. That would place BB or AD significantly higher in price than Schwa.

Okay, then let's say you and your companion bring two bottles of wine, one costing $15.95 and the other costing $19.95, and add on 8.75 percent sales tax, and you add the $.04 Cook County tax on each bottle of wine , you're going to be right around $150 when you add it to the $130 food bill.

For those who are trying to compare the restaurants, rather than to nit-pick posts (which is one of the most obnoxious habits I've seen on LTH), my point was that Schwa is likely to be significantly more expensive than Blackbird, Aigre Doux, or one sixtyblue. And, whether the per-person cost at Schwa totals $148 per person or $153 or $170, that remains true.

I think my point was that the OP is fine with the price point of NoMI, and Schwa is at the same price point. Therefore, I don't see why cost would be a concern, or why it would be brought up.

I'd agree about the nit picking , but, well, sometimes it's hard to stop, isn't it?

Not to nitpick, but... I'm still having a hard time seeing how $35.90 worth of wine adds $150 to your bill, even after you add tax and corkage. Am I missing something? (Even two each is only $75.80.)

All these places seem very much in the same ballpark to me. Appetizer, entree and dessert at Blackbird would surely be above $50 and possibly $60, how much is the four-course tasting at Schwa? If the eight-course is $85, the four is probably in the 50-60 range too. And if the eight-course is $85, then two people might hit $300 after tip and wine, but they'd really have to go to town on wine to reach $400. Anyway, I don't think there's a significant price difference there to make that the deciding factor between those choices.

Mike G wrote:Not to nitpick, but... I'm still having a hard time seeing how $35.90 worth of wine adds $150 to your bill, even after you add tax and corkage. Am I missing something?

Apparently. Can you see how $35.90 worth of wine, when sales tax is added to it and is split between two people, can add $20 per person, turning the $130 per person on the bill (with tip) into a $150 per person cost?

You can control your costs at any restaurant, through which courses and food and beverage items you choose. That's why there's a range of dollar figures. I've found that, when going to Blackbird, one sixtyblue, and Aigre Doux, my bill total (with tax, tip, and moderate alcohol) is consistently in the range of $85-100 per person, and $150ish (over 50 percent more) for Schwa. I usually refer to the former as $75-125 under the assumption that some people may get more or less food/alcohol than I do. Other than for the BYO wine, food pricing at Schwa tends to be less variable than elsewhere.

Mike G wrote:Appetizer, entree and dessert at Blackbird would surely be above $50 and possibly $60

At Blackbird, Aigre Doux, and one sixtyblue, prices are very similar; appetizers are $10-15, entrees are $30-35, and desserts are $10ish. Figure $55 for food, $15-25 for wine, and tax/tip, and you're right in that $85-100 range.

Mike G wrote:how much is the four-course tasting at Schwa?

When I went to Schwa, everyone got the $100 ten-course tasting.

Mike G wrote:I don't think there's a significant price difference there to make that the deciding factor between those choices.

I think a 50-60 percent difference in price is significant enough to put Schwa into a different dining category. Deciding factor? If you're deciding based on price, you're probably not going to any of these restaurants anyway.

Two people (beth and I) did hit $300 after tip, tax, and wine. Actually, we hit $295.

Shrug.

Okay, I post this and I see you've edited yours with much the same math as I did. So I'll just summarize.

I think the comparison, a tasting menu to a la carte, is not really head to head. By careful management of alcohol choices at Blackbird, it can be a fair amount lower than Schwa, yes-- for a different type of experience. At the same time, order one high end bottle and your cost at Blackbird shoots right over Schwa.

There's a reason Michael Carlson made that comment in Chicago mag about how all the other chefs tell him he's crazy to be BYOB and leaving so much wine money on the table....

Mike G wrote:Yes, but you're comparing the high end of the tasting menus at Schwa to dining pretty moderately at the other places.

No, I'm comparing actual prices paid at each of the restaurants. Without any unusual ordering (e.g. super expensive wines) going on.

Mike G wrote:I just don't want people to be thinking Blackbird-- that's the bargain place!

If they expect to spend $55ish for food, and with moderate alcohol, tax, and tip to end up around the $80-100 range, then their expectations will be met.

Mike G wrote:(No, Sweets and Savories is the bargain place.)

Not necessarily. Again, it depends on what you order, and whether you take advantage of specials. I ate at S&S a few weeks ago and spent $90 per person, including moderate alcohol, tax, and tip. (No, I didn't go on a Wednesday and get the $10 wagyu burger.) IMHO, based on the dinners I've had there, Aigre Doux and one sixtyblue have better food for around the same money. Not that S&S was bad - it was very good, and I recommend it along with these other places - but the food I've had at AD and 160B is even better. (More specifically, some of the dishes at S&S were wonderful, but several others fell flat, whereas everything I ate at AD and 160B was exceptional.) Granted, S&S has other charms - its unlikely location, and Paul's eagerness to please. Anyway, my point about S&S was not about its quality, but that its cost is not that far out of line from these others. Maybe a few dollars less, but in much the same ballpark. When folks talk about it as a "bargain", they're usually referring to one of their specials (and if you want to talk about specials, I think the $50 pre-theater special at Everest is a much bigger bargain than those at S&S).

Mike G wrote:I think the comparison, a tasting menu to a la carte, is not really head to head.

Schwa does not offer an a la carte option. Aigre Doux does not offer a tasting menu. one sixtyblue does, but does not push it and it's offered primarily for those interested in wine pairings. Your post is the first I've heard about one at Blackbird.

Then we're agreed. Three courses cost less at Blackbird than eight at Schwa, and twelve at Sweets and Savories. As long as you're drinkin' cheap, anyway...

Then we're agreed. You're likely to spend the same amount for dinner at Blackbird, Sweets and Savories, one sixtyblue, and Aigre Doux. And you're likely to spend substantially more than that - like 50-60 percent more - at Schwa. As long as you're drinkin' cheap, anyway...

I just hope Blackbird can make it with nobody buying the expensive stuff there.

Well, We ate there this weekend; four of us, 40th birthday, and I can't say I was impressed. Mind you, this is a big deal for me to spend this much money on a meal, and I feel I've had better meals at Sweets and Savouries and at Lula Cafe. Chalkboard was better as well. The food was good, the service was good, the sticky toffee pudding, which i wanted to transform me, was just ok but came out piping hot, as if it were microwaved. I dunno. There is only about 1x a year I spend this much on food, for a celebration. And I wanted it to be amazing and it just wasn't. The room was nice, but we went on a Saturday at 8pm and there were families with kids there? Not exactly the type of atmosphere I wanted. The service was fine, not too intrusive, tho we only saw our waiter 3 times during the meal. Had we had any problems, I'm not sure he would have been available. I won't go back. I think there are better places in town where I won't be sad that I spent $300 on a meal.

Therese O.
Chicago

Went here for brunch on Saturday, since I wanted to check the place out for a possible graduation dinner anyways.

I ordered the lobster omelette with home fries, and my friend ordered the Huevos Rancheros. I also had a cocktail, the Rose Kiss. The lobster omelette was very buttery, and I really mean buttery as in the taste. Not a generous portion of lobster, but it was ok. My friend really liked her Huevos Rancheros, but I did not like the deconstructed nature of it. The beans and salsa were served seperately, the eggs were cooked with the tortilla under it... It was wierd....







The portions were not large, so we had room for dessert. We shared the Sticky Toffee Pudding, which I really liked. When eaten with a little of everything it was really good. The creaminess of the sorbet, with the warm moist cake, and the tangy-ness of the orange... I particularly like the crunchy bits of meringue under the sorbet, and the sweet bitterness of the kumquats on the orange slices.






I inquired about the space for dinner and was told that it gets very noisy at night. So this is probably not going to be an option for graduation weekend.

I dined at Aigre Doux for the first time earlier this week, and shortly before my visit I read the reviews here. Needless to say, I was a little nervous.

When I first entered Aigre Doux, I was impressed with the decor -- very attractive dining room. We were promptly greeted and seated and service got off to a great start.

We started off with the Buffalo Ricotta and corn ravioli, which was served with sauteed corn and a very light lemon vinaigrette. The raviolis were so light and flavorful and I made every effort to lap up every drop of the sauce. This dish was fantastic and I was immediately wondering how anyone could not love Aigre Doux. How are there any negative reviews??? . . . but then . . .

The train derailed with the main courses. The wood-grilled pork tenderloin was served with a braised ham hock, pureed potatoes and a plum glaze. The pork was cooked well, but there was absolutely no evidence of wood grilling here and it was just not flavorful enough. The pureed potatoes were such a boring addition to the dish, as if to say: "well, we need something else on this plate." The plum glaze was fine, but not good enough to rescue an uninspiring pork tenderloin.

The Colorado rack of lamb was served with truffled grits, fennel, roasted peach and fava beans. I had two major problems with the lamb: 1) although perfectly medium rare, there was no crust on the lamb -- i.e., no evidence of a good searing, and 2) the grits were too liquidy, probably from the sauce on the plate. I would add that the lamb was slightly under-seasoned, but this was a minor violation compared to the above two issues.

So after the wonderful appetizer, the mains disappointed quite a bit. If anything rescued the meal, it was the dessert -- a chocolate malted custard, similar to a pot de creme in texture. The chocolate flavor was fantastic and it was so thick and creamy. I tasted every spoonful slowly, amazed just how they perfected the flavor and texture of this custard. It was served with what was advertised as a Hazelnut "Kit Kat," but the small candy/cookie lacked both hazelnut flavor and crunch.

As for the service that started off so well, it ended with a whimper. As the restaurant filled up, visits by service staff disappeared and I felt slightly ignored. But my real complaint is that the main courses really fell flat. And given how good the starter and dessert was, I must say that I'm slightly confused how this happened. In any event, Aigre Doux needs to clean up these missteps if it wants to avoid the fate of so many which have perished in the same location.

My only experiences have been at lunch, and the food seems to have good ideas behind it. Service, on the other hand has been rough. My last visit I received a different entree that what I ordered, and after telling them I didn't have time for my original item, they just said OK. Probably should have seen some adjustment on the bill.

My wife and I finally dined at Aigre Doux last night. I really like this resturant. Its decor is sexy and the lighting sets the mood. On saturday it was bustling and a little loud but not overly loud. The experience was great. For starts we had a beef ravioli in a sauce with some type of cheese grated on it and osso bucco with white beans (yummy). For entres my wife had the short rib with sweet potato gratin and caramelize red cabbage. It was so tender it melted in your mouth. I had the steak and frites. I didn't care for the cut of meat. Although it was cooked perfect, NY strip is leaner which is not very tender. Still, it was very taste. For desset my wife had apple bread pudding and I had the sticky toffee pudding (yummy). Both dessets almost put me in a coma. This place is a bit pricey but worth it. I am defintely going back.

I will be going here as part of restaurant week. I'd really wished to try it in the past, but the mixed reviews have put me off paying full price so I'll stick with the prix fixe menu. I only got one chance to go to all of the restaurants and it seemed like a safe bet. My report should be up once I return!

We went there for the restaurant week special on Sunday and were not impressed. The food was good, but not great and I am not one to complain about small portions, but for the restaurant week menu, the main course left us hungry. Service was not attentive, waiter seemed distracted and didn't even ask if we wanted a drink to start (we did). To start hubby had the pumpkin ravioli, which was tasty, light pasta, tasty filling, accompanied by walnuts. I had the haricot vert soup with Peekytoe crab, also nice, a smooth velvety soup and the crab was a nice accent. Then we both had the short rib, which was about the size of a half of a deck of cards, with a tiny mound of pureed sweet potato and another half a card deck of sauteed swiss chard. Meat was tender and rich, the sides were fine, although I can make those at home, and I guess I expect something a bit more from this type of restaurant. Dessert was a chocolate malted with kit-kat, which was more of a crunch bar. The bread is very, very good, it has a nice crunchy cheesy crust and we ate a lot of it since we were still hungry after our main course. Wine list was interesting but expensive by the bottle. We each had 2 decent selections by the glass, a refreshing gruner veltliner and earthy syrah.
Having been to restaurant week in other cities, I felt quite let down. It seemed like they really didn't want to participate by the effort put forth. There are many restaurants in this city and they did nothing to entice us to come back. When we lived in DC, we went out several times for restaurant week and ended up returning to those restaurants because we had such a great experience during that week.
LO

If you've been to restaurant week in DC then you know that some restaurants are hit and some are miss during that week, though the ones that are a miss generally doesn't say much about them other than they probably shouldn't do restaurant week. (Smith and Wollensky I'm looking in your direction). Aigre Doux is a fine restaurant and I'd give it another chance.

LO wrote:We went there for the restaurant week special on Sunday and were not impressed.

LO wrote:they did nothing to entice us to come back.

In short -- I felt the same way as LO.

I was there with three other folks last night to also sample the restaurant week menu. Given the choice of two selections for appetizers and two for entrees, everything that could possibly be ordered off of the restaurant week menu was on the table.

Everything was absolutely pedestrian. I enjoyed the soup most. The curry flavor in the small crab peices littered around were nice. The pumpkin ravioli were fine, but overly sweet. Everyone at the table agreed everything we had we could have made at home...better. The "sweet-sour" shortrib was very tender, but very flavorless. The "sweet-sour" in the name of entree must have referred to the pairing of the sweet potatoe puree and the swiss chard, because the shortrib had little flavor. All I could think of while eating it was how much I would rather be eating brisket from Smoque. The dessert reminded me of chocolate Jell-O pudding and I couldn't resist doing a bad Bill Cosby impression after the first spoonful.

Service was as minimalistic as the decor. I liked the decor, but not the service. Our waitress interacted with us using telegraphic utterances. "Drinks..." ..."Ready" ..."Everything OK". "...Thanks." I might be missing a few words, but that about sums it up. She looked scattered and flustered. They were busy. Appetizers arrived before our first order of wine. Soups arrived without spoons.

From some of the posts I've read here, my "restaurant week" experience doesn't sound representative of what this place can do. However, they've kind of ruined it for me. I looked through their regular menu. I am not in the least bit enticed to go back. I can think of at least 4 places at similar or lower price points where I have had exponentially better meals (e.g., Spring, May Street Market, Blackbird, West Town Tavern).

[*unrelated side note: went to Khan's BBQ for the first time last week -- don't know what took us so long, and boy did it deliver. I have nothing to add that hasn't been said. Would of much rather been back there than at Aigre Doux last night.]

i too was disappointed with my visit during restaurant week. porions were dwarf sized and they handed out the bread like it was gold. reminded me of a visit to carlos many years ago where we ate everything thrown at us and were still very hungry. we ate peanuts and crackers and cheese spread when we made it home. i went to hot doug's after aigre doux to try and save the day. doug , as usual, met my needs.

How do you cover the mediocrity of ingredients past their prime? Add cream. Forgot to season the sauce, what to do? Add extra cream. If you could take just one ingredient with you a deserted island, what would it be? Cream. That's what I imagine to be the kitchen's philosophy at Aigre Doux.

If you have crappy cauliflower with no taste, throw it away. Please do not insult me by thinking you can boil it in some bland vegetable stock and puree with a 10:1 ratio of cream to stock/veg, and expect me to like it. Even if you run it through a fancy chinois to make it silky smooth. Anson Mills is a nice grits producer, but no matter how much you douse the stuff with cream and butter, you still have to season it, or it won't taste good. It's nice to know how to cook lamb sweetbreads to make them light and crisp, and that the braised lamb shank is only moderately dry and stringy. But you ruin the whole plate with that salty, generic reduced brown sauce that tastes like absolutely nothing but salt and cream. Even fancy mandoline slices don't help an ill-conceived apple slaw make $34 lamb and grits with salty brown sauce taste better. Fish in coconut milk is a tried-and-true idea that you execute decently, though without the complexity or deliciousness of most neighborhood Thai and Vietnamese places.

Desserts almost save the day - perfectly textured ice cream (surprise, surprise) in a multitude of delicious flavors, and a delicious warm apple pie with honey crisps with nice bite to them. But sweet desserts can’t quite remove the mostly sour taste that the Aigre Doux experience left with me.